The Breakfast Club

[LilyLangtrey]

Good afternoon, Clunkers!

Welcome to the Breakfast Club where the kettle is permanently on, the drinks flow and the snacks are both self-replenishing and calorie-free.

We start each day with a look at history and a tribute to a brave or inspiring woman. Mostly though, we just chat randomly about current affairs, recipes, life in lockdown, literature, music and anything else that comes into our heads.

Veteran Clunkers welcome. Anyone else who wants to join in the chat - sense of humour essential! - welcome.

Kettle's on

Thank you Lily for today's OTDs. I imagine you have them all printed and in an OTD file for your DNs?

The Gillick case is 35 years old? What an ever more slippery slope our young people have been forced to tread since then. I wonder how Victoria Gillick feels about what's going on these days?

Thank you so much for the OTD. I had no idea about Victoria Gillick and that history. Probably due to not growing up in the UK and being just slight too young.

I’ll have some fruit please and a cup of tea. I have been comfort eating bad food for two week to finish my work, I need to look after my body a bit now.

I wonder how Victoria Gillick feels about what's going on these days?

I'm curious about this too.

Is it just me, or does Boris seem more focused and on the ball?

I thought exactly that when he appeared with his announcement yesterday. Perhaps that particular EU decision/announcement being made lightened his heavy load? Of course, we know that's not the end of it. A 'spokesperson' for no 10 last night suggested that the planned negotiation meetings arranged for next week will be cancelled.

Cam, are you back from your airport run? Did Dad get off ok? I hope he stays safe and arrives home ok. Not too long before you see him again

Thereby I'm having the same problem. It's not so easy responding to individual posts is it and consequently, they get forgotten. Seeing Cam's post just now reminded me I didn't comment on her early morning airport run when she posted yesterday.

Good morning all, and scritches behind the ears to all the kitties.

I was having a lovely lie-in until the terrierists decided to loudly protest at the presence of seagulls on the roof. Said seagulls are enjoying the apples from next door’s tree, they like to play football with them on our dormer roof before eating them.

I was half awake anyway and anticipating my first coffee so not too shocking a start to the day.

I think a walk into town might be on the cards; it’s market day and we don’t need anything but I do enjoy a potter about.

The Gillick issue is very interesting Lily; most teenagers of average intelligence can of course understand the risks of unwanted pregnancies and weigh it up against taking what is considered a safe and fully reversible method of contraception.
But to consent to taking experimental off label drugs that will likely render you sterile and without sexual function? Huge difference. And there lies the crux of the case; informed consent.

To think we've gone from that to debating puberty-altering drugs on request for children makes me very disheartened.

Yes, it's unbelievable really, isn't it?

Too true.

@TracysShoulder

Cam, are you back from your airport run? Did Dad get off ok? I hope he stays safe and arrives home ok. Not too long before you see him again

Thereby I'm having the same problem. It's not so easy responding to individual posts is it and consequently, they get forgotten. Seeing Cam's post just now reminded me I didn't comment on her early morning airport run when she posted yesterday.

Tracy,

I am yes. He was fine, thank you. My brother will meet him at the other end. He will almost be landing now.

Morning all. Very grey here today. Might go out for a walk later. I don't need anything from the shop, and have been out the last two days, so will see.

I also don't manage to respond to everything. That's where the 'Like' button is so useful, to show that one is reading, even there's no time to write a detailed reply.

I remember the Gillick case too, and concur with what's been said.

this is why RE lessons can be a good idea.

Understanding religion is essential to understanding so much of history, art, music, literature, architecture.... I was in our local cathedral one day at the same time as a school party of teenage boys. One of them asked one of the volunteer custodians 'What's a cathedral?' She was visibly gobsmacked. (And didn't their teacher do any preparation for the visit?)

Morning everyone!
I'm just catching up with yesterday. DM had an accident last week and has just been released from hospital so yesterday was spent running around getting bits and pieces that she needs for home.
I love Haworth and the Brontes. My only disappointment is that when we went to the Parsonage, I hadn't been able to book online to see the personal library collection. The women on the ticket desk and in the shop tried to persuade the one member of staff who could access the library to let me see it since we'd travelled such a long way, but she refused. It was incredibly churlish of her. But I do have fond memories of the amazing chocolate/sweet shop in Haworth. The owner let DS use the till and serve customers
Now to catch up on today's OTD.

Morning Clunkers, it was bright and sunny first thing but is now grey and moody looking. Thank you for the OTD, I really enjoy reading it every morning.

I've nipped to Tesco and got the newspapers, and put the slow cooker on and we'll be having curry tonight.

Take care.

Morning Ladies. Feeling much brighter today. The walk to the shop and resulting snacks and food helped a lot.

Went outside to pop a rubbish bag by the back door, and got a faceful of cobweb - EW!

Gavlar if the water doesnt help, please contact the docs.

Morning Clunkers,

Hope everyone is well.

Thank you Lily for my daily history lesson.

Thank you Tracy, breakfast looks very 😍

Baked, hope your dad had a good flight and you are now having a sleep.

I won’t say anything on VG as my mum was very much against her, my mum was a midwife.

Well fun and games in the Nelly household, daughter and Grandsons turned up just after 8 this morning🥴, followed by son, sausage muffins were cooked and eaten, son had arranged with dads carer to FaceTime him as we were all together, carer answered dad came on, he really had no idea what was happening, we all said hello, he didn’t recognise us, but waved and was saying things but we couldn’t understand, GS’s were singing a song to him, he then told them to be quiet, we heard the word racket clear as day followed by a swear word which the GS’s found very funny, dad’s head drooped he had fallen asleep, we all said our goodbyes and ended call, it is hard seeing my dad like this but I’m glad we did this.

Went to the park where all walked and talked, GS’s burning their energy off on their scooters, fed the squirrels and birds.

They left about an hour ago, peace is now in the Nelly household. 😁

Have now a coffee in hand, sitting down and breath. 😁

I’m glad I am not the only one that dislikes Saint Bob, he always looks like he could do with a good scrub. 😁

Morning Teflon Glad you're feeling brighter. A walk and snacks is usually a good mood lifter, I find.

Gillick competency is an interesting concept. Looking at the case now with the benefit of hindsight, it reminds me of an article I read concerning accessibility of the morning-after-pill. They had conducted research on how it was impacting in deprived areas (presumably because they often have high rates of underage and teen pregnancy) and girls were saying it was being used to pressure them into sex. So rather than it being a positive, it was having a negative impact on some of the people it was supposed to help.
The author of the article then drew parallels with how legal changes that are introduced ostensibly to help women - often have the opposite effect. And that the only reason such legal changes are pushed through is because they actually benefit men. Viewing Gillick competency through that prism, and in the context of the Bell/Tavistock case, I think the author might have been correct. Gillick competency could be viewed as the first legal attempt to decouple DCs from parents, and to push for every younger bodily autonomy which we're now seeing TRAs and paedophiles trying to take advantage of.

@TheReturnOfGavlar, hope you get to the bottom of what is causing you pain, take it easy, feet up hot water bottle and a cosy blanket. ❤️

Kitler.😸

Dizzy sounds like he has settled in nicely and so quickly. 😻

Morning, Nelllyyy.

I couldn't sleep. Had to have a new boiler this morning. Banging, noise, people wandering in and out of my house. In Tier 3 now so people are on high alert.

I wonder what your mum was against? Curiosity is grabbing me even more now.

I've just picked my eggs up from the wall where the 🚜 👨‍🌾 farmer's wife leaves them for us. Made the builder's omelettes yesterday and they were raving about them. It was Cam's Friday afternoon Kitchen.

My dad has landed and is in the safe hands of my brother. Back into quarantine he goes.

@TeflonTits

Morning Ladies. Feeling much brighter today. The walk to the shop and resulting snacks and food helped a lot.

Went outside to pop a rubbish bag by the back door, and got a faceful of cobweb - EW!

Gavlar if the water doesnt help, please contact the docs.

Morning Teffy,

You sound so much better. ❤️😁

@DorisLessingsLesson

Gillick competency is an interesting concept. Looking at the case now with the benefit of hindsight, it reminds me of an article I read concerning accessibility of the morning-after-pill. They had conducted research on how it was impacting in deprived areas (presumably because they often have high rates of underage and teen pregnancy) and girls were saying it was being used to pressure them into sex. So rather than it being a positive, it was having a negative impact on some of the people it was supposed to help. The author of the article then drew parallels with how legal changes that are introduced ostensibly to help women - often have the opposite effect. And that the only reason such legal changes are pushed through is because they actually benefit men. Viewing Gillick competency through that prism, and in the context of the Bell/Tavistock case, I think the author might have been correct. Gillick competency could be viewed as the first legal attempt to decouple DCs from parents, and to push for every younger bodily autonomy which we're now seeing TRAs and paedophiles trying to take advantage of.

That is really interesting, Doris. Wondering if you could locate that article.

Another project that I have followed has been the Pause pilot which has grabbed my curiosity. This is a support programme for mothers that have had repeated removals of children into care system. To qualify for the programme, they have to take the LARC. There has been a lot of good evaluations on the programme that evidences good outcomes in terms of savings for LAs, but why not offer support without a forced contraception?

I'm very unsure. Although Gillick competence test is a safeguard for children the benefitting for men is a key point you've raised. The same could be said for women who were refused sterilisation procedures because and I quote: depriving a man of the chance to have children

I really like how Lily's OTDs bring so much discussion and debate. I learn such a lot from you all.

Cam, you are spoiling those builders. They'll take even longer. My DD (emp lawyer) tells me right off if I say Farmer's wife, I have to drop the wife bit and just say Farmer, but then how do people know which of the Farmers you're talking about? Lady Farmer? Mrs Farmer?
So pleased your Dad's home safely. He must find all this isolation lark so tedious.

Eww Teflon, I hate that cobwebby thing. You can't seem to get rid of it once you've walked into it. Hope the owner of the cobweb stayed outside

@BakedCam I'll try to find it. It was quite a while ago but it was so unusual in its approach that I found it quite striking. Everyone had been celebrating about increased accessibility and then this article was quite scathing about the impact it was seeing on teenage girls.

Morning all.
As always, thank you to Lily and Tracey for our starters for the day. There's a lot reading to catch up with since last night.

Great to hear your dad has had a safe journey home Cam.
We need you to share the recipe for these builders' omelettes you speak of.

Sounds like you still need some TLC Gavlar.

A dull, grey day here. Some walking later as we've begun our 4 week restrictions.

The restaurant we we went to yesterday afternoon was on a complex with a large supermarket. We saw a man struggling with his large box of beer. I said to my sister, "that's what I call stock up to lock down".

Have a good day all.

@BakedCam, my mum was for underaged girls to be able to get the pill without parents permission, she delivered babies born to underage young girls and said if this could be prevented then it should be allowed, even now where the pill is freely available young girls still get pregnant, so things have not really changed, she also use to carry on about “not everybody wants to have 10 children” and boy did she sometimes rant.

Glad you dad is safely home.

Yuck to the noise, I bet you feel slightly jet lagged. ❤️

@TracysShoulder

I really like how Lily's OTDs bring so much discussion and debate. I learn such a lot from you all.

Cam, you are spoiling those builders. They'll take even longer. My DD (emp lawyer) tells me right off if I say Farmer's wife, I have to drop the wife bit and just say Farmer, but then how do people know which of the Farmers you're talking about? Lady Farmer? Mrs Farmer?
So pleased your Dad's home safely. He must find all this isolation lark so tedious.

Eww Teflon, I hate that cobwebby thing. You can't seem to get rid of it once you've walked into it. Hope the owner of the cobweb stayed outside

It is great and I find the Gillick family quite interesting. One of them created the effigy of HMQ on coins- although I can't remember the dates at all. Whether one agrees with VG or not, her appetite for what she believed in was unshaken.

Lily's OTDs do present us with great discussion content. That is the beauty of the 'model' of the BC. It is thorough and interesting discussions.

Oh they will be gone, I will chase them out. They have gone now. Back on Monday. Peace is restored. Although we are looking like The Dingles at the moment as the old bathroom has been ripped out and all that remains is a pile of rubble. Right back to the brick. Skip is coming on Monday. I have had to apologise to the neighbours.

my mum was for underaged girls to be able to get the pill without parents permission, she delivered babies born to underage young girls and said if this could be prevented then it should be allowed, even now where the pill is freely available young girls still get pregnant, so things have not really changed, she also use to carry on about “not everybody wants to have 10 children” and boy did she sometimes rant

I had a feeling your mum would be along those lines.

My mother was of a similar view. Her view was not of young women having children too early, but that children should be shown how to manage their feelings and begin to make decisions even if not always the right one that parents would agree with. Although I was raised in a culture where we shown independence at a very early age. That is not seen much of today as while safeguarding is important of course it is, there are no more dangers now than there was 50 years ago. We just view things through a different lens. That's my true opinion. Children are faced with differing challenges and we have a heavily governed child protection system that in some ways, penalises mothers in its earnest way of protecting children.