SAHMs...would you encourage your daughters to SAHM or WOHM ?

[mozhe]

I ask out of genuine interest....people have often said to me that I became a committed WOHM because I had such a strong model in my own mother....and I would certainly be very disappointed if one of my own daughters chose to be a SAHM.
SAHMs what do you think ? And why ?

Agree LoveAngel, being a SAHM is a life stage not an absolute. I love it - for now, not for ever. Today i have planted courgettes in the sunshine with grubby ds. Five years from now, i will be working hours to suit me and my family. The fact that someone would be disappointed if their daughter was a SAHM blows my mind. i would be disappointed if my kids didnt go to uni, gave up on education, lots of things , but not if they spent a period of their life being focused on their children. Really, i cant believe that people who feel this exist!

But you do as a stay at home mother therefore inevitably present a picture, the most compelling the child is going to get because TV shows and friends with mothers who work are not the main influence, the home is... that mother is someone who doesn't work and is at home and sees to family needs, cooks, cleans and father is someone out there making money and you present that image to them in the most influential stage of their lives. Now you may be happy with that image presented to them but not all women are by any means.

That is not the image that i present to my children! DH and i do equal amounts of housework. I have independent property and income from this. I think possibly your idea of a SAHM is a very 1950s one. Many people have portfolio careers and lives that fit around their families. Intellectual and social stimulation can come from outside the workplace! The image my kids have of their parents are different, but not defined in the way you describe.

Xenia - my mum was a single parent who grafted full time throughout my childhood. I am a married mother who has been a SAHM and now works part time. I think you are taking the 'women turn into their mothers' thing a bit literally!

Also worth mentioning - daddy dearest does not come home form a long day 'at the office' (ummm...he works in the music industry, but hey), light his pipe and demand his slippers.
He usually comes home via Sainsburys, unloads shopping, puts kids to bed while I cook dinner (or vice versa) and then pours me a glass of wine and has a good feel of my backside. I think we are fairly healthy role models for both sons and daughters (ok - not the backside feeling bit, perhaps).

Come on, tou're obviously an intelligent woman.
Again, I urge you to stop buying into sweeping generalisations, cliches and stereotypes. Its like reading the Mail (and I go to such lenghts to avoid it...you're spoiling it now!)

Since I'm a childminder, my dd has already told me she's looking ofrward to cheap childcare, so I guess she going out to work!!

I don't have a daughter and probably never will, so no need to worry about this one. Well that is unless ds decides to be SAHD.

To be honest, I wouldn't give a monkeys what my child decided as long as one of them was working and the child was supported!

I took pretty much a year off after having dd - and still only work 2/3 days a week as a rule. I don't regret it for a single second. It was absolutely lovely and enjoyable and fun. I think working when ds was small and putting him into childcare was damaging for him and made him very unhappy. This obviously coloured my decision about what to do with dd. My career is OK. I could earn even more money but it's not my priority at the moment.

Well, not meaning to throw a spanner in the works, but I don't plan on ever working for pay again if that's plausible for us.

I want to be available for my kids when they have young families, and I want to be able to help people in our neighbourhood who spend all day alone, or who need assistance for whatever reason in the middle of the day.

Interesting selection of stats there Aloha. If you look here www.eoc.org.uk/pdf/facts_about_GB_2006.pdf
you will see that only 42% of all mothers do paid work (36% with children under 4 rising to 56% with children from 16-18) compared to 96% of men. You will also see that there is still a 17% pay gap between men and women who work full-time hours. And my argument was never that SAHMs are wrong, misguided or anything else just that there are serious long-term consequences of this decision. Even if they only take 6 years out of paid work to become SAHMs their pensions will take a significant knock and they will find it hard to compete with their colleagues who have not taken 6 years out. Reserach proves that when returning to work they often take less well paid and valued jobs. Their long-term earnings are therefore almost certainly going to be signficantly decreased by their decision. And even if they only take a single year out of paid work then terrible things can happen during this year.

Did you read my example of my colleague whose wife is a SAHM and has a serious possibly terminal illness? They have no childcare, no life assurance, no critical illness (more fool them you may think but this is hardly uncommon and they're young and fit and this was always going to be short-term). During her illness my colleague is having to take time off to look after the kids and his wife. Should the worst happen they are well and truly stuffed. So much for the happy dream of SAHMdom but this could happen to anyone. I also teach and have taught quite a few girls who have got pregnant before getting their qualifications and without being able to afford childcare are in a very difficult position. They also are SAHMs sometimes permanently but very often not by choice and very often unhappily. I resent the fact that so many Mumsnetters disucss SAHMdom as such a wonderful choice they've been able to make. They've been able to suspend their careers and are loving every minute. This may be the case for them. Great. Fantastic. But this is not representative of all or even the majority of SAHMs.
You may think these arguments are spurious and artificial Aloha. I happen to think they're important and we need to take them into account when talking to our daughters.

Okay, I have 'chosen' to stay at home, but I'm not doing it because we live a well cushy life and I don't 'need' to work. As far as we're concerned it was what I was always going to do. We faced quite severe financial difficulty over it, I have health problems and yes, dh has had to take time off to look after me. Life happens, for sure. But I still wouldn't choose to work outside the home for money, because the problems wouldn't have been any easier if we'd got used to a double income first and then had to deal with the income cut.

It's an interesting discussion and illustrates a blazing row in our house the other day. I think alot of our generation are the 'think we can do it all's' I worked f/t in a male dominated profession to which I simply cannot go back now I am a mum. Its fine and I work for myself in a much smaller capacity and am able to be at the school gate etc. But at school I set out with a single minded view that I could be xyz and worked my socks off through school and uni. Worked for 10 years had child then - ooops... what was all that effort for?
The row came as my other half pointed out 'quite frankly what was the point and really why do women study such mad courses when once they have a child they become SAHM's ? they should have the kids and not waste the time studying!'
After I peeled myself off the ceiling and sat back and thought about it, I could see where he was coming from.
Yes I did well and yes thats great but that is over now. I do know an awful lot of women who are highly educated and/or had great careers and cannot go back, who are happy to be SAHM but mourn the loss of all they strived for because if and when they can go back it will be at a much lower level than before.
And before certain individuals jump up and down, those of us who don't work in NHS, civil service, large corporate (approx 50% of women work for small business who have a real problem when women have children) having a child can quite effectively stuff your career! So those who have daughters, advise them so that when the time comes and they want the choice to be either SAHM/WOHM make damm sure the career path enables it!

isn't that the point you are making bawc that we are a bunch of pampered m/class mums who have no idea about the real world etc. - so surely our daughters will be just as priviliged and not likely to be without options when it comes to working, staying at home, planning for the future and the like. So in that case our earnest hand wringing discussion about what to tell them is merely academic?

I think my points are pretty black and white Bigmouth and quite the opposite of what you're suggesting. One of my points is that many SAHMs are not the ones who have chosen to become so whilst taking time out from a successful career and have a partner who is able and willing to support them as so often represented here. One of my other points is that even those who have chosen to become SAHMs whilst taking time out from a successful career also need pensions, can also be dumped by their partner or find that he gets ill, can also get sick themselves, may also find themselves disatisfied, isolated and depressed, may also find it difficult to return to their jobs etc etc... And all of the above could affect your daughters too.

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Your link doesn't work b/w. Ini fact it's not even a link!

these are some statistics for you, other sources put working women slightly higher, and the percentage or working men slightly lower

And it is simply untrue to say only 56% of women who are mothers work. I think you must have misread your statistics.

I am utterly baffled by your example of a SAHM with a terminal illness. HOw on earth would it improve things if she had a job? She'd still be dying.

I'd want them to be educated to a good level so that to do either was a real choice for them and not just a forgone conclusion either way.

It's not a waste of an education to be a SAHM. most only do it for a certain period of time anyway. If you aheva career you have a choice to go back at some point.All beit on less money than before probably.

I would want to point out that if she wants to have children then choosing a career that involved a lot of travel or very long hours may make her life difficult

I wouldn't care if she was either as long as she was happy

I have a friend who, two weeks ago, was diagnosed with a terminal illness. she is not expected to see christmas.

whether she is a WOHM or SAHM (and I'm not even going to tell you which) is utterly utterly irrelevant when faced with that hideous reality, I can tell you. What matters is that her dh and ds will be bereft.

I've said it before and I'll say it again - WHY so many people are so insistent that the choices they have made are the only valid life choices out there is completely beyond me

dino and if I keel dh gets £5m

whether or not I'm working!

oh no pph I didn't know you had heard that it was so terminal

I'm well educated, and it's very useful to be so as a sahm, especially as I'm HEing. Earning money isn't the only use for a good education.