SAHMs...would you encourage your daughters to SAHM or WOHM ?

[mozhe]

I ask out of genuine interest....people have often said to me that I became a committed WOHM because I had such a strong model in my own mother....and I would certainly be very disappointed if one of my own daughters chose to be a SAHM.
SAHMs what do you think ? And why ?

'Honestly, if my children are healthy and mentally balanced and happy I will be on fecking cloud 9 for the rest of my days. Everything else is dust.'

But what I can't stand is this wishy washy concept of 'happiness'. What I am arguing is that financial security, a rewarding career, mixing with others and not being isolated, being intellectually challenged, feeling valued etc etc all contribute to what makes someone happy. Before you start, yes, you can have all of these things as a SAHM but they're very often harder to achieve and many of these issues (particularly financial security) will be dependent on the mother's partner being able and willing to earn enough money. This is not an opinion, it is a fact.

And to the poster who made the point about the cost of childcare. Firstly, childcare IS subsidised. 3 and 4 year olds get well over 50% of their fees paid for by the governemnt and the about of subsidy is about to increase. Also I absolutely appreciate that for many women it is not financially worth their while doing paid work and paying for childcare. And I made the point earlier that many women give up paid work out of necessity and not choice - so much for 'happiness'.

But even where paid work barely covers childcare it may still be worth the mother returning to paid work when she looks at the bigger picture. When I returned part-time to work after maternity leave for dd2 after childcare costs I was left with £100 a month. BUT, I still had my job which I loved and I was contributing to my pension and I and my partner were covered in the eventuality of my getting sick etc. and I needed to keep doing paid work to keep me sane. So for me, it was worth keeping at it for the long-term benefits.

Finally, being a good parent isn't just about being at home for your kids. For me, it's also about being in a position to get them into good schools, support them through unviersty, being able to go on holiday and afford hobbies, not being a financial burden in retirement etyc etc. In my family these things would not be possible if I had not kept my job. Actualyl as dp and i are both teachers and work our hours around our kids' school hours there is not one thing we are not able to do for our kids that a SAHM could do but there are many many things that we are able to do as WOHPs that we wouldn't be able to do if one of us quit our job.

I think the current university intakes are more interested in jobs than we were 20+ years ago. It's interesting see my children's friends and their career discussions. Peraps there was just a 60s/70s blip of irresponsibility and now children have gone back to normal.

Haven't read it all but I hope that I can guide my DD so that she is independent, happy and able to have a choice.

I do agree that a notion of 'happiness' is wishy washy - after all we have our own pre-conceived notions of what we mean when we invoke the phrase 'I just want my children to be happy'

Happiness being a life goal is a modern notion - I want my children to be active, curious, questioning of authority, interested in politics and the world around them and responsible/ caring. These worthwhile attributes do not necessarily lend themselves to being either sahm or wohm so perhaps it is more important to me who they are rather than what they do.

My mum was miserable as sin sah and she would have been miserable as sin working - depression can be that kind of creature - but she was a v good mum and from my point of view I benefited from her presence at home most of the time.

If I had a daughter I think I would advise her to choose a career that allowed her to also have time with her kids - teaching springs to mind, because of the holidays. Or something that can be done on a freelance basis.

By the time our kids are grown attitudes may have changed and it may be the case that more family-friendly policies are in place.

I'll encourage and support my daughters to think very carefully about their career choices,( the poster that said xenia/self/b&wcat could have these choices beccause we had very well paid jobs was right...so I would definitely want them to think about that. ), and also to team up with a DP that would be willing to shoulder an equal part of the domestic front...children and chores. Also to be encouraging to their fellow WOHMs, and inspiring to SAHMs !

I agreeed with Xenia

I don't have a dd but if I did I would just encourage her to do what made her happy.

I'd encourage her to get a good education and a good job/career, regardless of whether she would take time out to look after her children or not.

I must admit, I'd feel disappointed if I had a dd and she put a small baby in nursery so she could go back to work. It's just something that doesn't fit comfortably with me.

XENIA AND MOHZE

GET BACK TO WORK

Mohze said - 'I'd feel disappointed because I honestly think it is best for women, children and society if most people work'

Well I feel the complete opposite and I think it's best for children to have a parent at home, if it's possible.

Why though ?
Ok otter....lecture starting in 10 minutes !!

Even if the kids are at school Gobble?

Because little children want to be with their mummy and daddy above all else - it's the most secure environment for them to be in. Day nurseries are hideous places imo.

I feel society has really lost it's way tbh. It's terribly unfortunate that for so many there is just no choice, but for an equally huge number of people there is, and they choose work over time with their children. It's really sad imo.

But there's no point arguing, we'll never agree. I know I'm doing what is best for my children, for our family and for me. I wouldn't have it any other way.

There can be other secure environments for children....you do not know what you are doing is best you can only hope it is. You may be wrong.

Not getting involved in this discussion but would just like to add that some children are better off in a nursery or with a Nanny/Childminder!

Ha ha! I think I'll take my chances!! pmsl!

ST, yes, there are those circumstances but I personally feel it's the case generally.

Anyway, get yourself on the Grease thread - I've posted something for you!

My mother was a working mum. I chose to stay at home for a while, then briefly worked full time, before settling for p/t working while my little ones are small. My mum has been an absolute beacon of feminist light during that time (lol) - supporting me and making me feel good about every decision I have made or situation I have found myself. Surely that's what mums are there for?

I would hope I would support my daughter in whatever choices made her and her family happy. No offence, but I hope I am never the type of mother who is 'disappointed' in the choices my adult children make.

my mother things my being a sahm worthy of nothing.

For my dds I'd be happy with what ever they chose to do. I think being able to choose is the most important. Some wohm want to be sahm and the the other way round.

How do you encourage your daughter to do something that you hadn?t without it seeming like you?re expecting her to live the life you wish you had? (I?m asking because I want to know how to do it not because I?m making a point).

I went freelance, working from home after having dd ? seemed the perfect compromise. Turned out to be hell (both monotonous and stressful). So now, in my early thirties I am once again thinking of what I?m going to do when I (finally) grow up.

I would want my daughter to be less floaty and naïve and to be confident and informed enough to go for a career that she would want to go back to after having children. But I have no idea how to do that without it turning into some kind of horrible projection thing that she could only despise me for.

The most important thing is to support your children in the choices that they make. My mum has made it very clear to me that she doesn't approve of me being a part-time WOHM, ie she thinks that I should stay at home, and my mil has said the same to dh. I am lucky enough to be able to afford to do either but feel that I have to go to work for my own mental health. The two of them have made me feel very guilty and miserable about the choices I am making and I would never want to do that to my daughter or dil.

It's difficult isn't it? Our poor daughters. Our expectations for them academically and career wise are now outstripping those we have for our sons (I'm speaking generally, I haven't got sons) and so in another 10-20 years presumably the men who as boys are now being outperformed by girls will be less successful in their careers than their female partners but they are not necessarily participating in domestic life any more than they were. So in another 20 years our girls will be successful, dynamic career women who will also still be expected to do most of the domestic work and childcare. Yet, as Xenia said earlier, it's likely that they won't find the time to have children at all and may not be able to find the right partner if things continue as they are. Then again I think we should be more worried about boys than girls since many elements of feminity which are encouraged in girls (communication skills, empathy, language, conforming) lead to success while the elements of masculinity that may once have led to success (sport, physical strength, competitiveness, rebellion) now don't.

They need to have their chidlren (if they want children) before they are too old. That journalist who writes about her marriage with the 14 years younger Indian husband I think was writing today (they are divorcing as he's had one lover too many) that he had robbed her of her child bearing years. He hasn't. She's let that happen. Women are responsible for themselves. They can't go around blaming men all the time. (He also put on 4 stone and took 6 years off to write a novel and she made over 50% of her house and assets to him).

So all of us consciously or unconsciously encourage our children in different ways. Either they see happy working mother and want that or mother going on about how good work is or fed up with it or they see unhappy stay at home mother and decide to do the opposite. I certainly agree that we can't say - I never earned £100k so I want you to or I never got the chance to stay at home so make sure you do but if we believe a particular thing is right such as our religion, principles or whatever then I don't see the problem with bringing up our children to those values. That is more likely to be that they work hard and don't tell lies than that every child of mine has to be a banker or housewife though....

But Xenia, you think women who work part time are misguided and in denial don't you? So surely you would judge your daughter according to those principles? Or am i confusing you woth someone else?