PIP cuts- what happens next?

[Orangesandlemons77]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cp3q7584v07o

So this goes to a vote next month? What then does anyone know please?

Same here. So disgusted with them.

I see the PIP bashing threads have started up again now on MN. Lovely.

Unless they appeal within the strict time limits and go through the lengthy Mr process first all of which will be harder for more vulnerable or less aware people

{mention:PandoraSocks}Yes@PandoraSocksYes we'll now get blamed for any tax rises!

Ah i see the mumsnetters are out with their pitch forks for those on PIP.
I am beginning to think this forum isn’t a very nice place to be.

At least 50 Labour MPs still opposed to welfare bill, Starmer warned, amid claims Tuesday's vote could be very tight
Ministers should not be confident that they will pass the welfare bill on Tuesday, despite the huge concessions welcomed by the MP who tabled the reasoned amendment to kill the bill, a backbencher told the World at One
Cat Eccles, who was elected MP for Stourbridge last year, said that she was aware of around 50 to 60 Labour rebels who were still oppposed to the bill. But she said she could be more.
Eccles is one of more than 120 Labour MPs who signed the reasoned amendment that would have blocked the bill at second reading. The government currently has a working majority of 165, which means that if 83 Labour MPs were to vote with all the opposition parties on a measure, the government would lose.

Also from the Guardian

Like the Green party (see 10.31am), the Independent Alliance (see 11am) and some Labour MPs (see 9.50am), the Liberal Democrats are saying the U-turn does not go far enough, and that the UC and Pip bill should not be allowed to go ahead on Tuesday.
Steve Darling, the Liberal Democrats’ welfare spokesperson, said:
It should not have taken a major rebellion for the government to realise that these cuts would cause immense damage to some of the most vulnerable and risk creating a false economy by actually forcing some people out of work.
The government should still pull this bill before the vote on Tuesday and go back to the drawing board. In the absence of any impact assessment, MPs still do not have the full facts and those who are affected have still not been consulted on these changes.
Liberal Democrats will continue to oppose this bill that risks stripping thousands of carers of vital assistance and leaving some of the most vulnerable without support.

Yes, I noticed that, well at least they are not bothering us I suppose.

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2025/jun/27/a-negotiated-dogs-dinner-starmer-faces-second-revolt-over-welfare-bill-concessions

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2025/jun/27/labour-welfare-bill-cabinet-benefit-cuts-keir-starmer

How are you feeling? I'm sort of relieved about my own PIP claim but worried for new claimants. Hoping they might drop the whole thing.

They are not going to "drop the whole thing", and I will lay you any odds you like that Ministers will be revisiting all this. They are already stating that they will be reviewing PIP assessments and consulting with disability charities. Do you believe they will be doing the right thing after having those chats? The two tier system itself will cause so many problems that they will probably have to go back to it. This is a sop - a retrenchment. It is not the end of the war, just one battle, while they get their troops in line again.

We cannot afford to step away from the lines, but we need to start dictating the terms. Yes, there are people who play the system - and let's see what can be done to stop that. Let's have in place proper support for people who can and should work. Let's actually talk about increasing payments to people who will genuinely never work. And let's tackle employers who refuse to have disabled people on their books. Either they will set the narrative, or we do. Criticisms of the system are rife and fair - but if we want a better one it is down to us to fight for it because nobody is going to do that for us. That is very clear.

Does the old claims thing include LWRCA?

So if you're awarded that and PIP right now youre effectivly 'safe' from it all?

It's just PIP I think. It seems so (safe) but maybe not if stopping PIP and starting again.

@PhilippaGeorgiou I think you are spot on.

Next up will be the loss of the ESA support group.

I'm in this, cont based ESA. I think it might be going too, but not sure when.

Nobody will “effectively” be safe; if you loose points and loose your claim at your renewal. You will have to reapply as a new claim (if you loose tribunal) and the 4 points rule will then apply.

No change in the under 22s lwrca rule which will push thousands of families into poverty.
Not sure how my son will manage on a single under 25 payment for 3 years! Hey ho long as they look good changing the wording but meaning the same thing - the MPs dont seem to care!

There are talks of it being merged with JSA as a time limited unemployment benefit. I expect it will be just for new claimants though.

So the news is now saying there’s a U-Turn on the proposed cuts, as discussed in this thread
https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/_chat/5362857-taxes-to-rise-to-fund-pip?utm_campaign=thread&utm_medium=app_share

However, I’m struggling to see exactly what this U-turn is, and what the tax rises are going to cover, because they are still bringing in the 4-point rule. The assertion that existing claimants will be protected and only new claimants will fall under the new rules is very misleading, as the vast majority of PIP recipients have to renew their claim every few years, so eventually everyone will have to score 4 points on one criteria to qualify for help. It’s still going to impact a huge number of people, so this U-turn is bullshit, and the headline about tax increases is basically just stirring up resentment towards disabled people.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/cj937xylzyet

@MarvellousMonsters At the moment they are saying that if you have PIP at the point of the change you will not be assessed under the new rules. It will be for entirely new claims, not renewals.

This is reassuring @PhilippaGeorgiou, thank you. I couldn’t find anything that clarified that, and I’m still not convinced it won’t creep in surreptitiously.

The 4 point rule is awful, it means that most of the people who would qualify for low rate daily living support under the existing system, won’t. This will impact a lot of people, and will effectively eradicate standard rate daily living, as only those with severe issues will now qualify. It’s so difficult to get PIP under the current system, this will make it so much worse. There are so many ways they could reform the PIP system, constructive, proactive, sensible changes that could be made, instead they opt for this. It’s so shortsighted.

I’ve looked on the govt page about this and it just says there’s going to be a 13 week period to allow existing claimants to adjust, I can’t see anything that says existing claimants won’t be assessed using the 4-point rule when their claims are renewed.

“The Universal Credit and Personal Independence Payment Bill will provide 13-weeks of additional financial security to existing claimants affected by changes to the PIP daily living component, including those who their lose eligibility to Carers Allowance and the carer’s element of Universal Credit.
The 13-week additional protection will give people who will be affected by the changes time to adapt, access new, tailored employment support, and plan for their future once they are reassessed and their entitlement ends.”

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/welfare-bill-will-protect-the-most-vulnerable-and-help-households-with-income-boost

Things have moved on since that was published though, that document is now out of date since the further concessions have been agreed.

We will need to see the actual amended wording on the bill, but it does seem that the new rules will now only apply to brand new claims and possibly when there is a break in claim. So as long as people don't let their PIP claim lapse, they will be OK.

I hope it gets voted down. There isn't anywhere near enough clarity on what happens when a claim is reviewed, also the link with LCWRA and the pip assessment.. we are also going to see a big surge in pip claims before November 2026, so I can't see how this saves any money 🤷‍♀️

Either way I hope it's the end for Starmer.

Yes I work for a charity that helps people claim PIP. dread to think of the number of people who will be applying between now and Nov next year !
I think another of the latest concessions is that they have agreed those already receiving LCWRA will see the value of that element rise in line with inflation as most of the UC elements do each year. I think in the original proposal it was due to be frozen until maybe 2029 ?