PIP cuts- what happens next?

[Orangesandlemons77]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cp3q7584v07o

So this goes to a vote next month? What then does anyone know please?

I believe that is the definition of a politician.

It's so irritating isn't it. They don't even seem to understand the basics of the two benefits nor the implications of potentially taking away the PIP and LCWRA from large numbers of people. It's not even just taking away the LCWRA element either, that affects whether for example a person gets a work allowance or their partner benefits from it. I work in benefits for older people and the most common UC scenario I see is one where one of a couple is too ill to work and getting PIP and LCWRA, and the other works and claims carers element. If that disabled person loses the PIP ( lets say £500 worth ) , then the LCWRA £420, carers element £201, that is a household loss of over £1100 per month before you even factor in loss of work allowance which could be worth around another £300. The current proposals are madness.

The way they are planning to get rid of the WCA and base this on PIP in future seems not to be well thought through either, PIP is not related to work and has different criteria from ESA.

None of it really makes sense does it

I worry for people going through Cancer treatment who are automatically awarded LCWRA but often don't qualify for PIP. I'm assuming some special provision has been made for this category of claimants.

Nothing has been decided yet. Apparently,so many Labour MPs are opposing the bill,the PM has started making noises about 'making adjustments' to it. I have emailed my MP about it, received the usual standard reply, basically saying that she supported moves to help disabled people into work blah blah blah etc etc. I am currently on PIP,I get maximum points for mobility but only 8 for the daily living descriptors,I only scored 2 on 4 of the categories 4 years ago. I'm undergoing a review at the moment and as I understand it,it won't be subject to the needing to obtain 4 points on at least one category yet,that will start in November next year. It's very worrying and I'm hoping that the fact that over 120 MPs opposing the bill will have some effect next week.

But surely it should just be based on how much someone is struggling and the impact of their disability not condition specific. I'm not keen on the idea that you should automatically get PIP because you are having treatment for cancer but not for MS, heart failure or schizophrenia.

I'm worried for my friend who has secondary progressive MS, she can't walk at all but I think she only got standard for her care PIP (probably can wash above the waist etc) and she is very independent and possibly didn't get across the full impact of her care needs in the assessment, she does get enhanced mobility.

She's also in the LCWRA group but if that goes, and then her PIP would (?) possibly due to this 4 point rule, she could be really in trouble, she has just got a flat from the council as well which was so much better as it is adapted for her wheelchair.

I keep thinking of her and hoping things will be OK. The MS she has is not relapsing, and comes with a lot of fatigue which means she struggles just to get through the day never mind work.

You only automatically get pip for cancer if your death can reasonably be expected within 12 months

I think the PP meant LCWRA, which is to be replaced with PIP(?)

Yes i see what you mean but most people cannot work through cancer treatment and I guess I'm thinking of so many extra costs with numerous appointments for treatment often at specialized centres miles away. I appreciate that could equally apply to other conditions as well though . I guess with the other conditions you mention they might be highly likely to be getting PIP also.

LCWRA is automatically awarded without needing an assessment if someone is undergoing cancer treatment and/ or if they are terminally ill with less than 12 months left.

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2025/jun/26/starmer-offers-massive-concessions-on-welfare-bill-to-labour-rebels

Seems the 4 point rule might only apply to new claims, hmm. Still bringing it in though

This will just bring more division. We will end up with two people with similar levels of disability with one getting hundreds of pounds more than others just because they happened to get assessed a year earlier.. We already have a situation with pensioners that is grossly unfair with pensioners on PIP potentially getting double what other pensioners just claiming Attendance Allowance get because there is no mobility component on AA. They have no concept of fairness.

Yes. I wonder what attracted them to this 4 point idea in the first place.

That would be unfair, I think. I would rather that they look at the frequency of some of the reviews, and the quality of the assessments that people have to undertake, with wildly different outcomes for people. So many of the assessor reports bear no resemblance to what the person has even said, resulting in a wrong award, and then a costly tribunal, for so many, to then be awarded the correct level.

Hope all still vote against, there is nothing stopping them doing loads of reviews before it kicks in and treating your claim as a “new” claim with the “new” rules of 4 points. It doesnt protect ANYONE, its just worded differently that is the only difference. Do not be fooled.

Hoping also that Starmer will have to step down if they vote against next week, hell be forced too surely. One of the worse PMs we have had since Marget Thatcher!!

Starmer won't step down over this. It is a terrible mess but not a PM resigning scale of mess. Plus no one wants the merry-go-round of PMs that we had under the Tories.

Kendall however...

Only applying the new rule to new claims doesn't make it any better at all IMHO. If it is cruel and unfair to apply it to existing claimants, it is cruel and unfair to apply it to future claimants.

It is very unlikely now that it will be voted down. And he will neither step down nor will he be forced to. And there's plenty of competition in that list since Margaret Thatcher....

Do not be fooled. In the end, even the rebels were not voting for the status quo (and nor do I think anyone should) - they were rightly arguing for more discussion and more consultation with people, but the welfare bill is unsustainable, and the narrative will always be about how it is reduced.

Surely the “concession “ means nothing? The change in rules for current claimants would only apply when the award is reviewed for renewal. So everyone would carry on receiving current award until renewal anyway? Are they saying that current claimants, when reaching renewal, won’t have the 4 point rule applied? This all sounds very messy and ambiguous to try and fool MPs into thinking it’s a significant concession.

They are saying that it would only apply to brand new claims.

It is a stupid mess.

@PandoraSocks so for e.g. I am due for renewal in 2026, and at the renewal assessment the 4 point rule won’t be applied? But someone else who only applies for the first time in 2026 will have the new rule applied?

Yes, that is how I understand it (though the actual date might not be 2026, I suppose). But we need to see the text of the bill to be 100% sure, I think!

I think the devil will be in the detail, too.

What happens if there is a break in a person's PIP claim because they go into hospital, or delay renewing etc? Will they be treated as having made a new claim, and the four point rule applied?