I was really stressed on the way there and couldn't decide the best route to go, and I was panicking.
I ended up going a slightly different route from normal and then panicked in case it would take longer and i wouldn't get there!

Then DD managed to leak through her nappy just as I was about to be called - couldn't have been worse timing! At least I managed to change it before my name came up. but the seat was a bit wet.

Anyway, doctor has referred me - i had my letter from KAT, and I didn't really say much in the appointment. My letter was basically saying that i showed enough signs to be referred and that i was allowed a proper assessment under the autism act.
He did ask me why i thought i had it (or for how long), so I explained that i knew there was something but couldn't work out what, the problems i had, etc, and that a friend linked girls with aspergers article on facebook a couple of years ago and that I saw myself in it, but that i didn't do anything about it because i didn't think adults got diagnosed/assessed.
But there we are... I'm in the queue.

PolterGoose · 01/09/2015 20:50

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Ineedmorepatience · 01/09/2015 21:24

Thanks polter and nickel!

I am feeling a bit better tonight, have a busy day tomorrow and the mum of the little one that I was one to oneing for popped round this afternoon and was supportive so that was good. He is off to school but I will be doing some respite for his family so will keep in touch with them.

I have found 2 places near to me that will do adult assessments, so just need to pluck up the courage to ask the GP for a referral, I need to do it soon as am moving GP's because they are being really unsupportive for Dd3 and I cant hack it any longer!

Good luck both of you with your assessments

CrohnicallyAspie · 02/09/2015 19:48

I need help with something. A relative of mine had a stillbirth at the beginning of the year. She shared a huffington post article on stillbirth which said (amongst other things) that people need to learn the difference between sympathy and empathy.

I always thought sympathy was feeling sorry for someone and empathy was knowing how they felt. The article uses examples of sympathy (that's so sad... But at least you had 35 days with Hugo) and empathy (I'm so sorry, what was your baby's name?)

This doesn't match with what I thought sympathy and empathy were, and I can't see a real difference between 'that's so sad' and 'I'm so sorry'. Which is better, and why?

PolterGoose · 02/09/2015 19:56

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Gumblebee · 02/09/2015 19:57

As I understand it empathy is divided into cognitive empathy (being able to tell how someone else feels - sometimes impaired in ASD) and affective empathy (sharing someone else's feelings once you know what they are - impaired in psychopathy), whereas sympathy is feeling sorry for someone or, occasionally, sharing a special kind of bond with someone.

I found the article you're talking about. Firstly, her definitions are completely different from the definitions I'm used to. Secondly, the examples she gave that you posted aren't even examples of HER definitions.

I think what she has to say is really important but I don't understand why she's framed it as being anything to do with sympathy vs. empathy.

CrohnicallyAspie · 02/09/2015 20:17

So it's not just me that doesn't 'get' the article then gumble!
polter Empathy can be 'good' emotions too, but sympathy is always feeling sorry for them so only appropriate when it's a 'bad' emotion/situation? Sympathy can be faked more easily because it's as simple as saying you feel sorry for them? Or rather, you can feel sympathy for someone even if you don't understand what they're going through? Like my DH might be sympathetic if I'm having a bad day but he struggles to empathise because he's NT and doesn't really understand.

Is cognitive empathy just intuitively 'knowing' what someone else feels? Or can it be thinking about what's happened and working it out? I do the latter- sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't and I jump to the wrong conclusions, and sometimes people try to hide their true feelings and fool DH (because he sees them acting fine) but not me (because I know how they should be feeling)

And affective empathy is where you literally cry because someone else is crying- you might not actually care about what's happened to them but they're sad so you're sad?

Is that about right?

CrohnicallyAspie · 02/09/2015 20:18

Just read that back and what's with all the '?' ?! It's, like, so American?

LeChien · 02/09/2015 21:31

I like this video about sympathy and empathy.

Polter, good luck when you have your assessment

nickelbabe · 02/09/2015 21:49

I think sympathy is feeling sorry for someone and perhaps expressing that you're sad for them.
Whereas empathy is being able to sense how they feel, maybe even understand how they feel, especially if you've experienced similar, and being able to get them to talk to you about it - shared experiences are good, but it's not just feeli g sad for them but actively helping them.

Gumblebee · 02/09/2015 23:32

It almost seems like people think of empathy as when it's real and sympathy as when you're putting it on, and that sympathy is insincere.

But I don't expect people to automatically know what I feel (though I do appreciate it when someone does "get it"), and I feel a bit creeped out if other people feel what I feel, so, actually, if something truly crap has happened to me, real sincere sympathy isn't something I would reject at all

I dunno. I'm probably way, way off base here

Gumblebee · 02/09/2015 23:34

In fact I'd rather have someone admit that they don't and can't know how I feel than someone who tries to "empathise" and gets it wrong.

CrohnicallyAspie · 03/09/2015 06:54

Thanks for the video lechien. I think the hole analogy is actually quite good, I know they were trying to illustrate how useless 'sympathy' really is, but I think it's a personal preference (and depends on the situation too) whether you want someone to come in the hole and hug you, or whether you actually do want a sandwich!

Like gumble says, I don't want someone to 'empathise' when they don't know how I feel. That feels uncomfortably close to 'Oh, you have Asperger's? I know how you feel, I don't like crowds either' ie minimising what we go through.

LeChien · 03/09/2015 08:50

Crohn, in your example ("oh, you have Asperger's? I know how you feel") I wouldn't put that as empathising, I would put that as a crass attempt at something that ends up (once more) dismissing and minimising how someone else feels.
Empathising (although I may be wrong) would be saying "Oh, you have Asperger's? I don't know how you feel but I'm here for you and I will listen if you want to talk".

LeChien · 03/09/2015 08:52

I think empathising is not necessarily feeling what you feel, but being able to put you first when you need it.
Sympathy is more superficial and is about the person giving sympathy and trying to say the right thing.

CrohnicallyAspie · 03/09/2015 09:22

You see, I thought your example 'I'm here for you' would be sympathy, but I can't articulate why I think that. Maybe I do have the wrong definitions in my mind?

PolterGoose · 03/09/2015 10:14

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CrohnicallyAspie · 03/09/2015 10:23

Actually, that makes a lot of sense.

Regardless, I actually feel really bad because I am guilty of having more or less ignored my relative's stillbirth. Not intentionally, but at the time of the stillbirth I was having almost daily meltdowns, the funeral was around the time of my ASD assessment, I missed the actual funeral because of important health tests, I was adjusting to a new antidepressant, another relative (on the other side of the family) was taken into hospital with a life threatening infection... I had so much going on in my head I didn't have the capacity to deal with anything else.

And now she's posting articles about how it's important to talk about stillbirth and not forget or try to hide it. I'm guilty of doing just that, and I don't know what to do. I mean, we weren't even that close beforehand (see each other a few times a year and maybe talk a couple of times on FB too). So I'm worried that anything I do or say will be considered a meaningless platitude or whatever.

PolterGoose · 03/09/2015 10:32

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iamaboveandBeyond · 03/09/2015 11:25

That sounds like an appropriate message to send to someone to me :)

CrohnicallyAspie · 03/09/2015 11:28

Thanks, that's a lovely idea!

CrohnicallyAspie · 03/09/2015 20:46

I just need to vent to people that hopefully 'get it' because my husband doesn't.

I'm tired of pretending to be normal and I'm tired of holding everything inside.

We got some good news yesterday, bloody fabulous news in fact, and tonight I just cried and cried because of the release of pent up emotion. Today was the most 'normal' day I've had for a long time, and yet I was still stressing inside over noises and queues, I wanted to do or say something, to ask for help, and I just couldn't do it.

And I'm so tired of it all.

ALittleFaith · 03/09/2015 21:24

Me too Crohn, me too.

We are staying with DH's grandparents. They are very passive-aggressive, lots of hidden digs and comments. Staying with them is exhausting.

Playnicelyforfiveminutes · 04/09/2015 18:47

Oh bless you chron I've just been reading this back and I think you are far too hard on yourself... I am just as confused as you re sympathy and empathy.. Please don't beat yourself up for not being a good enough friend to her.

Great news nickel :) I didn't know there was an autism act! Proud of you ;)

PolterGoose · 04/09/2015 19:14

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