Plucking up the courage to leave.

[Bluebeanbag]

I've been in a relationship with H for 18 years and last weekend a thread on here opened my eyes to his behaviour. It was like reading a diary of my own life. For years I've known that something wasn't right but he has always successfully convinced me that I was the one at fault. At the beginning I told myself that the massive rows were part and parcel of being with someone with such a fiery temperament (and the making-up sex was so good!). I tried to absorb all the negativity for the sake of the family. I told myself that he couldn't help it; that he was damaged. But i am finally starting to see things for what they are - that he is an angry and controlling man who manipulates me into believeing that my actions are selfish and I am an 'evil bitch'. I actually feel as though I'm going crazy sometimes because he is so convincing.

So on the basis of what i have read here, my own gut feelings and some straight talking from a friend, I have decided I cannot stay any longer. I have booked an appointment with a solicitor tomorrow to get some advice about the DC and house (mortgaged together) but I need to know what questions I should ask, please. I haven't told him yet - I am utterly paralysed by fear of how he will react. He has never been physically violent towards me but his words can feel like being punched in the face and absolutely destroy me at times. Alternatively, he can sometimes go down the route of hurting himself and threatening suicide which is almost worse.

No. Nothing is ever resolved because he won't agree with you. Time to start flipping those statements round. It will send him crazy 😈

I like @RandomMess post. Make him start writing things down for clarity and so you can tick each point off when its been discussed and agreed. You could even get him to literally sign each point off...

@RandomMess 😁 I will do that!

I'm just thinking about the complexity of it all and I think youre right - it would be really helpful for him to put it in writing because we haven't even got to the point of discussing any of the finer points like maintenance etc. I'm sure he will try to argue something along the lines of because we are having 50/50 contact there should be no maintenance payments but then who pays all the costs of looking after the children?

Finer details I should say

You know he is likely planning on bullying you regarding the pretence of 50/50 childcare so as to wear you down?

Once he gets you to agree to a final financial split, there is NOTHING to stop him saying that he wants you to take the boys full time and he will have them EOW?

All he has to do is give you the bare minimum CM from the calculator?

So all his bullshit about needing 3 bedrooms was just tactics.

As usual @RandomMess has made an excellent suggestion, everything is better via email and you will reflect after you speak to your solicitor.

He could well kick off at not getting his way.
Don't hesitate to call the police and have him removed.

Stay strong.

Hey Blue

Just checking how you are doing?❤️

It's been a rocky few days. He's very much in nasty mode and is resentful of the fact that I am going out on days when he is having the DC so is trying to make everything as difficult as possible.

After lots of consideration I have decided to agree to the 60/40 split and I know you will all think I'm crazy but here are my reasons:

1 - he has said that if I don't agree to the 60/40 split, he will drag it all out for as long as possible and will refuse to sell the house, so I then have to get a court order forcing the sale (more cost etc).

2 - I need to get out of this house ASAP because he is making life very difficult for me (although being wonderful to the DC), so I want the sale to go through as quickly as possible.

3 - if he does drag it out, it will be more costly and who is to say what will happen to the housing market in the meantime?

4 - with a 60/40 split, if I have a mortgage, child benefit, maintenance payments on top and he has just the collateral, we would end up with roughly the same financial pot for buying another property.

5 - fighting for 50/50 just wasn't sitting right with me. I felt sick and anxious.

I won't be just accepting his word for it all though. He has finally instructed a solicitor and has started the ball rolling to try and get some financial agreement worked out.

I have got a question for you all though. He has mentioned wanting to split all the bills 50/50 from now on until we move out. I've gone through and worked out what we both pay in terms of bills and there isn't a huge difference although he does pay a few hundred more, it just happens that he pays the 'important' ones like the mortgage and utilities. He is very financially astute and I just wanted to know whether you think I have to agree to this or not?

You are making a mistake not going through a solicitor.

What are your pensions valuations? That is as important as the house.

I will be going through my solicitor. None of this is a formal agreement without her involvement. At the moment it's just words. I've called her today to set up another appointment.

He has a small pension. Mine has been running a lot longer. He stopped his when he became self employed and decided to pour all his money into the house as a pension instead. Hence why he is so bitter about the financial split.

I think you need to tell your solicitor that his threats are compelling you to settle, which is not in your best interests.

The sooner you see her the better.

He is abusive.
If you got him out of the house you would not feel this pressure to settle.

So if you get both pensions valued splitting the house 60:40 may be overall a 50:50 split which is more palatable.

So push ahead with the financial form completion is it E? To get all pensions correctly valued.

Oh come off it he only gets one shift per work.Is that what he tells you?;everywhere I look businesses are short staffed;I bet he could find and do other work on the days he isn't working elsewhere.

The whole I want primary to be primary carer routine is so he gets a bigger share of the house,tax credits,child benefit and maintenance from your wages for your DC.He isn't interested in what's best for your DC it's about lining his pockets.

It's a also an attempt to continue to control you;if he scares you into thinking you'll only be a EOW parent you might not back down.

If he starts being difficult putting the house in the market then get a occupancy order for the house.

I honestly think you'll regret this, I think he'll make your life hell, and do all the things you are trying to avoid, even with a 60/40 split.

I have my ex everything, walked away with my clothes and £1000. He kept the houses the lot. He still make my life hell and was difficult at ever turn - just because he could. I wish I'd gone for what I was entitled to because he gave me the same amount of shit even when I walked away with nearly nothing

You know this man is nasty bully and a liar, so don’t believe a word he says. Do it all through your lawyer, take her advice, don’t take what you think will be the easy route to try and placate him -you know it won’t work….and please take note of what happened to @TooHotToTangoToo when she tried that…

As for contribution, families are made up of different types of contribution, financial, time, loss of career, caring roles etc, just because you can't put a figure on it, doesn't mean it's not worth anything

This really stood out to me. I have been through your situation and though not resolved, I am still suffering the accusations of injustice from exH. It no longer hurts though - I know it comes from his habitual position of being 'hard done by' and to do anything less (we went though the courts to resolve finances) would have been a disservice to our children as I had and still have the lion's share of care. If I had agreed to what he thought was 'fair' I would have ended up in bed and breakfast with our children - what kind of father would want that to happen?

You only have to look on what is fair for you - he should fight for his position but you should also fight for yours, do not try to look through his eyes.

@Twillow

Great post.
Thisi is the truth.

Please protect yourself for the long term.

If you go for 60/40 OP at least get him to agree to a better childcare split as part of that agreement. 50/50 with such a shit Dad sounds terrible for the children. He sounds selfish enough to give away contact in the return for capital from the house.

@Aishah231 the boys actually adore him because he is 'fun daddy' all the time and is far more inconsistent in terms of rules and expectations with them than I am. I'm the boring, nagging mummy most of the time. Although having said that, they are both wonderful and very loving boys and I get loads of cuddles from them all the time. I think in the long-run, as they get older they will recognise me as the more stable parent it's just that they don't see that right now.

Had a couple of interesting conversations today and I have successfully refused both times to be drawn into an argument.

This morning he announced that his solicitor is going to draw up a Deed of Trust for us to sign which sets out the split from the sale of the house. This document will apparently cost £600 the cost of which he expects us to share equally. I asked whether he has taken any advice about the divorce from his solicitor and he said no, he has just asked him to draw up this document. So he still has his head in the sand about what I am entitled to claim from our marriage.

I said I thought that was a ridiculous amount of money to pay when we already have the Deed of Trust in writing anyway. He agreed and suggested I might ask my solicitor about whether an alternative could be found. Clearly both of us want any agreement in writing, given the way things are progressing.

Then just now, he said to me that 'childcare might be difficult' when we move out of the house as he was potentially going to be working a full time job. The hours would be Monday-Friday 07.30-18.30 which wouldn't leave him any time to have the children during the week. He said he doesn't want to have to work full time but he can't find anything part time and he is 'backed into a corner' because he won't be able to afford the bills on his own moving forward.

At this point I brought up the fact that he will not be paying a mortgage as he will have a greater share of the funds from the house and therefore his bills will be significantly lower than they are now. He gave a bit of a bluster and non-answer by saying that he hadn't fully looked into it yet.

Clearly these conversations are now making me rethink the possibility of pushing for 50% because there's no way I'm going to take on the majority of parenting to that extent without 50% of the equity.

I can also forsee a scenario where he claims he can't get a mortgage in order to get me to agree to the 60/40 split, then goes out and gets a mortgage based on his new earnings from his full time job, buys a fabulous swanky place way better than anything I can afford and then the kids want to be with him all the time.

All very much food for thought and I'm very glad I haven't agreed to anything in writing as yet. I am still waiting for my solicitor to get back to my email of yesterday.

I can also forsee a scenario where he claims he can't get a mortgage in order to get me to agree to the 60/40 split, then goes out and gets a mortgage based on his new earnings from his full time job, buys a fabulous swanky place way better than anything I can afford and then the kids want to be with him all the time

You are still looking at his situation with your logic and morals, and expecting him to do the same. The above is far more likely to happen, because his logic and morals dictate him to get as much money as possible with minimal effort.

He's working 1 shift a week, not because that's all he can find, but because you are enabling him to be a lazy sod. Why work full time, or even part time, when he has a wife that will do it for him.

The same with the dc, why look after the dc when he will have an ex wife who will do it for him. They won't be staying with him in his swanky new place, because his ex wife will look after them. The only time he'll pull his weight is when he realises that his full time job means he'll have to pay child maint.

You really do need to do what's best for you and the dc financially through the divorce. You don't get a second chance to sort it when it's done and dusted and you realise he's taken the lions share of your equity and pension, and left you looking after the dc, sorting childcare, whilst juggling a job and living in a small house and he's living the life of a single man, earning a good wage (because he has no child responsibilities) in a lovely big home with no mortgage

He is only working one shift per week for these reasons;

To claim it will be 50:50 care (it won't be)

To claim he can't get a mortgage and needs a bigger share of the assets

He is seriously playing you and stitching you up and bullying and threatening you into accepting it.

@Bluebeanbag I agree with all of the above who say hold out for a 50/50 split of finances.

My exH said he would defend the divorce, drag us through the courts and insisted I shouldn't get 50%. I held out, he didn't defend and we had a 50/50 split of all finances, including sale proceeds from the house.

He still claimed that his solicitor told him he should get more (which I doubt) but he was agreeing to it in the end because he was such an honourable chap. It was all untrue, he had realised how much fighting in court would cost and got scared. Still talked utter nonsense about how I'd fleeced him but I didn't care.

@TooHotToTangoToo makes a very good point about not expecting him to behave as you or any other reasonable person would. If he's anything like my ex (and it sounds like he is) it's all about winning and making you suffer. Your solicitor is your ally in all this, take their advice and stand firm against the rubbish you will hear him spout over the coming months.

@Bluebeanbag how are you getting on?

Like other people have said then l go for a better split. It feels more that he is inching himself over to appearing to have less income and more engaged with the children. Which is super convenient for him under the circumstances. I struggle to believe he is only able up get 1 shift a week, part of might be also so he’s around more to snoop on what you’re doing? Unless he’s burned his bridges with work as well?

@EL8888 he has burned quite a lot of bridges at work. He hates his job and is very selective about which shifts he works and for whom. It has been a big source of stress for him for many years but unfortunately he is not qualified to do anything else.

It's really difficult. He is trying his level best to get me to agree to what he wants without involving a solicitor and I'm just refusing which is driving him mad.

I told him I wanted to go to a mediator to try to resolve things but he said that we need to have a figure in mind for maintenance payments otherwise there's no point. I said I wasn't going to just agree to anything he proposed because I wanted professional advice, whether that is through a mediator or a solicitor. I said once it's done, it's done so we need to get it right. He got angry at this and started hurling insults and swearing but I just ignored it and eventually he stomped off.

He is desperate for you to capitulate without mediation or legal advice so he can fleece you.

Remember a hint of aggression, call the police and have him removed.

Follow legal advice to get every penny you can forvyour boys future.

You will need it.
Stay strong.

Don’t wait for him to agree to anything you want to do, just go ahead and arrange it. Then if he doesn’t attend/get a lawyer etc, that’s his lookout. Let your solicitor guide you as to the best outcome for you and the dc, and hopefully get on with it asap to spare you further grief from this odious man.