Plucking up the courage to leave.

[Bluebeanbag]

I've been in a relationship with H for 18 years and last weekend a thread on here opened my eyes to his behaviour. It was like reading a diary of my own life. For years I've known that something wasn't right but he has always successfully convinced me that I was the one at fault. At the beginning I told myself that the massive rows were part and parcel of being with someone with such a fiery temperament (and the making-up sex was so good!). I tried to absorb all the negativity for the sake of the family. I told myself that he couldn't help it; that he was damaged. But i am finally starting to see things for what they are - that he is an angry and controlling man who manipulates me into believeing that my actions are selfish and I am an 'evil bitch'. I actually feel as though I'm going crazy sometimes because he is so convincing.

So on the basis of what i have read here, my own gut feelings and some straight talking from a friend, I have decided I cannot stay any longer. I have booked an appointment with a solicitor tomorrow to get some advice about the DC and house (mortgaged together) but I need to know what questions I should ask, please. I haven't told him yet - I am utterly paralysed by fear of how he will react. He has never been physically violent towards me but his words can feel like being punched in the face and absolutely destroy me at times. Alternatively, he can sometimes go down the route of hurting himself and threatening suicide which is almost worse.

I am so disappointed in your contact with Women's aid.
That is awful to read.

OP, ss have more to be doing than getting involved with a woman leaving her marriage.

This is very hard but I think using your contact with your solicitor to advise you on your best course of action.

He is terrorising you in the home.

There is no question of him being able to accuse you of abandoning the children but I do wonder is texting him rather that discussing arrangements might help.

Please contact 101 and ask for their DA division, for advice.

He is so nasty and threatening.

Can you ask friends and family to have you visit with them as much as possible so that you can have a break from this.

So that you can then leave him with them.

Keeping a detailed note of all dates.

Below are correct, his family will side with him and his daughter will not want the drama and whining of him on her doorstep.

@goody2shooz thank you. I am feeling calmer now following a long cry and a chat to a brilliant friend who likened his behaviour to a kid in the playground - you can't play with my family, you can't play in the living room (etc).

We will see how things go tomorrow. We agreed that it would be my day to look after the DC but he has already announced that he won't be 'banished' to another room in 'his own house' to give me space with them.

I can't believe another day has gone by when I haven't contacted estate agents. It's been a difficult day today though.

@RandomMess you are right. I need to develop some clinical detachment, however much my heart is breaking at the thought of losing half my extended family. I thought we were really close but he is doing his best to drive a wedge. At the moment all I want is to be with the DC on my own but I will want childcare options in the future.

@billy1966 luckily I have a friend who used to work for Women's Aid in another area so I will give her a call to get her view on things.

From previous meetings with my solicitor, she has said that I should seek a non-molestation order in the event that things turned nasty. I hadn't wanted to do this because I felt it may escalate things rather than calming them down. We are going to have to live together for potentially 6 months or more and I need to find an emotionally sustainable way of living.

Get the wheels in motion for the occupancy order

@RandomMess I'm not sure I have the courage yet. He has got in my head again and I'm thinking maybe I am a bitch. I need to re-read the thread, do a bit of the online Freedom Programme tonight and get myself straightened out again. I will make an appointment to speak to the solicitor again though.

His family potentially siding with him has dealt me a blow today. I thought I was one of them. It may just be him spinning things of course.

Also, DS2 has just come up to ask if he can go with daddy to try on trainers tomorrow. We had agreed that tomorrow and Friday would be my days with the DC. I asked DS2 if I could take him if daddy let me know which trainers he wanted but he said he wanted daddy to take him. I felt like if I said no I would be causing another problem.

@RandomMess your manner really reminds me of a straight-talking friend I have IRL 😊 much appreciated.

You need to be factual.

Well your days with Daddy are x & y so you can wait and go with Dad or I can take you tomorrow.

Yes, I will do that moving forward. I had already agreed to let him go tomorrow though. I feel like this is all so new to all of us that they need a little time to adjust. I have just had a quiet chat to DS2 at bedtime and tried to explain about 'daddy's days' and 'my days' and I thought he understood what I was getting at, although it's all the more confusing because we are all still under the same roof.

Incidentally, DS2 was prompted by H to come and ask me if I was OK about him going trainer shopping with daddy, so that's another bit of manipulation to add to the list. He's now using the kids to play on my guilt - oh you wouldn't deny DS2 what he wants, which is time with me to buy him new trainers, would you?

Also incidentally, H has never once taken either of the DC shopping for anything until this point. He hates shopping with a vengeance, particularly clothes shopping but he would probably argue that he is trying to show how he has 'changed'.

DS2 is sad at the prospect of not doing things together. I suggested we might go swimming tomorrow after the trainer shopping and he asked if daddy could come too and I had to explain again. He has gone to sleep sad now 😢

@RandomMess is correct as usual.

Keep note of him never once buying anything for them or going shopping but doing it now to try and alienate you from the children.

Of course he will not succeed.

The thing is you need to be calm and firm with the children about the new mummy days and dickhead days.
They need firm routine.
It will help reassure them that things go on.
Him trying to mess with it will not help the children.
Keep a note of everything.

You are doing great.
Chin up.

@billy1966 😂 dickhead days. Brilliant.

I will make notes.

Thank you all for getting me through one of the toughest days yet.

I have been following your thread with interest Bluebeanbag. I'm in the process of divorcing a similar character to yours. I can see so many similarities in our stories, only I moved out with the children ,(12, 13,16). My advice to you is that you need clear boundaries in the home. It is clear that he will manipulate the children to suit his agenda. And now his agenda is to make life as difficult for you as possible in order to make you go back or punish you for leaving him. Keep a log of everything , dates, times of any incidents regarding the children ect as no doubt he will twist and lie having you doubt your own mind. Get smart about this. Communicate with him through email only so you have a record of what's agreed. Cut off direct communication with him as much as you can. He will use any opportunity to put you down, make life hard for you, gaslight you so just don't bite. Cut off his supply.
Mine was such an ass. He made a big deal out of the how I was handling the kids homework and sporting interests, which he never had time or interest in prior to separation. Found fault in everything. He tried to find any way of getting at me regarding how I was raising the children (I literally did it singlehandedly from day 1 and suddenly now he had such a great interest in them) totally unreasonable stuff. So I just didn't engage in any of the nonsense.
My youngest children think he is fantastic. I want to scream at times how manipulative and horrid he actually is but I don't. I know when they get older they will see things more clearly. My eldest knows more and whilst she has a good relationship with her dad she is well aware of how horrible he is to me. I feel he will pay a heavy price for this down the line.
Just remember you are doing this for yourself and your children and I promise you it will be worth it. He may use them as weapons but you rise above that. Once you prioritise your kids through this you will be fine. They will thank you in the long run. Keep going. You are a superstar.

@Amie2020 thank you. It's reassuring to hear your story. I wish I could see into the future and see how bad it's going to get so I could be prepared. I suppose I should expect the worst.

Although you should never badmouth him do stick to age appropriate truth.

It is very important that you are honest and trustworthy for the DC. When they ask xyz genuinely ask them "why do you think - I'm unhappy/Dad said that - " etc also.

Dad said x is it true? - what do you think DC2?

Does that sound like something I would do/say DC1?

And so on.

It's important that you teach your DC critical thinking, that they learn to hear and listen to their gut.

Read "How to talk so kids will listen, listen so kids will talk" such an important book.

@RandomMess fantastic advice! Thank you. I have been worrying about how to address this problem without bad-mouthing him. I will look up that book.

Another one

"I think Dad is very angry, that doesn't make it ok for him to say these unkind/untrue things about me/you/us. Dad being unkind to me is one of the reasons I don't want to be married to him anymore"

That sort of thing.

Brace yourself for accusations of affairs etc 🙄

@RandomMess I have actually been saying the first part of this one for years. My counsellor always refers to me as the translator in our relationship between him and the DC. I don't want them to think that his behaviour is acceptable and to start copying. So much of it is very subtle and they wouldn't consciously notice it, but occasionally the worst becomes apparent (e.g. road rage which then gets turned onto me).

Well it has been made abundantly clear that he has zero respect for any boundaries with the DC. We agreed that Thursday and Friday would be mummy days. Last night I made pizza and we were going to have a pizza and board games night. DC2 ate one slice of his pizza and played a game of cards with me before disappearing up to H's room to look at trainers online with him. I left it for a bit, thinking H would send him back down once they had finished looking but he spent the whole evening up there with him. H was laughing loudly and they were playing video games together.

My only option is going to be to go back to the solicitor because I just don't think I can reason with him.

Because he is abusive you can move into rented and claim UC inc housing benefit. You need to show that you are taking action to divorce and sell the property etc.

Speak to your local housing officer. They sometimes do rent deposit loans as well.

Make it clear that you are leaving to abuse that is now escalating including financial abuse.

Looks like you can add parental alienation into the mix. Very devious and unpleasant man. And oh we can just imagine his indignation were anyone to say so 🤬

@goody2shooz I've just had a phone conversation with him to that very effect. He said I was accusing him of things he hadn't done and that if it were the other way around, I would make him out to be some kind of monster.

Just had the first valuation on the house and he says it's way too low (unsurprisingly). He said he has poured everything into this house and if I am going to be 'unfair' and not give him back everything he has put into it, then he needs a better price for the house. He says I am shafting him 'like women always do'.

The first part of the conversation started with him telling me how much he loved me again and saying that he was sorry if he was short tempered with me but he doesn't want this and his frustration and hurt is coming out this way 🤯

Stop engaging in conversation stick to emails about facts.

Prioritise getting him out via occupation order or you and the boys out. He is going to draw this out as long as possible.

Emails or text all the way as @RandomMess says, especially if he is going to be vindictive and nasty, then you have it in writing. If you get three valuations for the house he can’t complain they’re all undervalued. Try to talk with him as little as possible, though I know it’ll be difficult in the same house and with the dc.

Oh yes - and the ‘sorry if you felt that way BUT’ non apology 🙄
Yeah, it’s your fault…..again. He takes absolutely no responsibility for anything he does.

You are both right. It's becoming increasingly clear that I can't communicate with him on normal terms at all. There is no point trying to reason with him since his only aim is to win every argument at any cost. I felt like I was being petty by communicating via email but I am seeing now that it's the only way.

I really don't know whether to look into moving out or go for the occupancy order. My stupid 'nice' side always pulls me up short. It's a fight against myself as well as him all the time.