What do you think about spouses/partners staying overnight on postnatal wards?

[RowanMumsnet]

Hello

The organisation Birthrights (with whom we've done some stuff in the past) are planning a new campaign called First Night, and wanted to know whether it's something MN could support - so we said we'd ask you lot!

Here's Birthrights' description of the campaign:

'Birthrights is a human rights in childbirth charity, and we will be launching a campaign later this year to ensure women aren't left alone on often over-staffed postnatal wards, but instead can choose to have their partner remain with them overnight. We will be researching what's important to women, partners and staff, the barriers and benefits, and working with units who've implemented this policy to draw up best practice guidelines to use as they lobby for change.'

So please let us know what you think. Is this something you'd like us to swing behind?

Thanks
MNHQ

Some years ago I was the victim of sexual assault.

I had an emcs and there were no private rooms available in the hospital, so I was on a shared postnatal ward for 3 days, the first of which was spent tethered to my bed by a catheter - so no knickers, either. I was also trying to bf and had my boobs out all night, and staff came in every couple of hours to see how I was doing, change dressings, check my maternity pads and bleeding etc. I was also panicking about being a new mum, coping with allowing staff access to my body to be able to do their jobs and allowing the baby (essentially a stranger to me at that point) to suckle - I don't do physical contact.

What would I have done, if the other women on the ward had their partners there over night? Apart from actually cracking up, obviously. I was close already.

I am not the only victim of sexual assault I know (I am not even in the minority once you include date rape), nor am I the only very private person I know. I am not the only new mother I know who spent the second night crying and wondering how to cope. Random men on the ward would have rendered the ward an even less "safe" place to be.

As a nurse, I can entirely vouch for the comments who say that relatives who stay overnight quickly start acting like patients. They create more work for the staff; asking for food and drinks when they are perfectly capable of looking after themselves, creating mess and getting in the way. I have lost count of the number of times I have had to climb over a sleeping relative to do the obs on a poorly patient. The best ones are those who unplug equipment so they can charge up their laptop or watch a dvd. There was even one last week who put 'do not unplug' stickers on the plugs to his electronics. Cheeky git.

That is how I read it too Maryz.

Not just that, men take over space where men and women are together.

In the beginning I expect they behave properly, it's women's space, they're not comfortable in it, they're guests in it etc.

Once they become the norm in it and feel entitled to be there, they will colonise it just like they do every other public space. It will be another space where women will be marginalised at the very time they need to be at the centre of things being supported.

I know this sounds like a bit of an esoteric point, but I just think long term issues like this need to be considered. Inevitably they won't be because in general the only people who are aware of them, are feminists. And in the main, they aren't going to be the decision makers in how things are going to be set up. If they were, women wouldn't be treated so appallingly in the first place and we wouldn't need partners coming in to look after us because there would be enough HCP's to do so.

I remember the Mumsnet thread where a respondent was quite proud of the fact she gave her lovely partner a blow job on the post natal ward within minutes of giving birth

he had "needs" you see

Sorry x posted.

Windchime nails it. This will be the norm.

Oh come on Birthrights

I've still got a lot of reading to do, but when I read this ...

Twenty-three mothers and nineteen partners were audited.

... I immediately have huge, huge doubts about the credibility of the trial in question.

To be fair, I should add that as a follow up further feedback was sought, further on in the report. I haven't read it yet, but scanning the pages it looks like we have opinions from 36 fathers and 16 mothers ... so a really full study, then!

Oh yes AF I'd forgotten that one.

We'll have to factor in the blow job requirements as well of course.

So more than double the number of fathers were asked than mothers?

Oh

Kay

I do hope that mnhq tell birthright our thoughts and not just decline to be involved.

Hopefully they might think twice about the campaign.

Not just that, men take over space where men and women are together.

Yes, I witnessed this first hand on the ante natal ward yesterday morning. Dad to be arriving with his partner for their induction, unpacking his things, getting himself settled, his tablet and phone out, speaking loudly, turning the TV on full volume without using his headphones, putting his feet up on the bed. His comfort was clearly his priority. This was on an inpatient ward at 7.30 in the morning with poorly ladies in their nighties trying to rest in the next beds.

I've just looked at their website and feel that this campaign would fly in the face of their dignity in childbirth campaign.

Its no good having dignity in childbirth if you then have no dignity on the postnatal ward as many people here are saying that this is how I would make them feel.

In fact the NHS has a dignity campaign and single sex accommodation is be of the main themes in that.

Nothing to add as it's all been said but it's another 'no' from me.

If private rooms with en suite bathrooms were available to every woman then great, but that's not going to happen so the idea just wouldn't work. I admit I did feel a bit abandoned once my DP had left the hospital but I think a campaign for better and more efficient care after birth would be much more useful.

I agree Basil.
The whole business smacks of some partners making a huge fuss over being 'excluded' and Birthright falling over themselves to essentially pander to the menz.
And the reason maternity care is so pitiful is because women are the ones with no choice but to put up with it.

Still a no here MNHQ.

"I do hope that mnhq tell birthright our thoughts and not just decline to be involved"

Has there been any indication from MNHQ that they are going to decline to be involved? (and, hopefully tell Birthrights our thoughts)

Flisspaps I was adding your comment that you would have liked to be supported by your DH, and that you were sad it didn't happen together and thinking that probably left you feeling vulnerable. Apparently not. But many others clearly do feel vulnerable in the post natal ward.

Sorry, haven't read all the posts (the thread has grown fast!) but I've had several babies and the first night was the most peaceful, always - the well babies at least seemed just to want to sleep, they seemed exhausted - so surely that's nature dictating that mums need a catch up too, without distractions from partners (let alone 'needy' ones. Oh yuk AnyFucker :().

And Ditto what Viva said about NHS and single sex accommodation.

We currently report single sex accommodation breaches as a privacy and dignity breach apart from critical care areas were there is a strong clinical need.

How do they propose to get around that?

I've also seen a partner stay with his gf on the labour ward where she had to remain on high dependency care as she was unwell. Partners can stay on the labour ward.

But he wasn't happy with his chair and kept getting in the bed with her and draping himself over her. She was really quite sick, high temp as well so he was making her worse.

This was explained to him and initially he got out of bed but 5 mins later was back in it again. When challenged again he threatened the staff.

I've also seen men who have secretly stayed behind a curtain in a bay with the intention of staying overnight then creep out and find an empty bed to sleep in later on. Not only does this make more work for staff as the bed needs remaking its not good when you bring a woman from the labour ward to find a random bloke in the bed you've booked for her. She then has to stand there for ten mins while you make he bed.

Maryz, I had the lovely experience of the mother of the woman in the next bed to mine in a double room smoking a fucking cigarette in the ensuite bathroom and an aunt (?) leaving the toilet seat in such an unclean state that I had to wash it down myself before I could use it, less than 12 hours after DD1 was born. And my toiletries were rifled through.

@VivaLeBeaver

I do hope that mnhq tell birthright our thoughts and not just decline to be involved.

Hopefully they might think twice about the campaign.

Birthrights are reading the thread Viva - they're fully aware that this has gone down very badly here!

Jesus.

People are savages aren't they.

No wonder Matron used to fiercely chase them from her ward.