Husband wants to sell my pre-marriage flat to clear debts

[rdsh]

I’m just asking somewhere objective.

I have a flat I owned before I met DH. It is let out and the income is quite good. I do rely on it to a certain extent because I don’t earn much.

DH however wants to sell it: he wants to clear some debt.

I guess I’m just wondering WWYD … I want to keep it but part of that is perhaps because it benefits me rather than the whole family?

In fairness to the OP, I think the Easter activities (which sounded like ice creams and Easter trails, which isn't an outrageous expenditure) were really her way of saying what sort of thing her money goes on. I'm not sure they are the real issue.

If she could have said "Tesla" instead of "ice cream" she probably would have.

Do not sell the flat until you have your budget under control and a better financial setup between the two of you.

Currently, you have the safety net of being able to sell if needed. But judging by your posts, it seems likely you'd clear the debt but gradually rack it back up again. So you'd end up no better off and have no safety net.

Well, £65k is an awful lot of debt to have accrued on normal, everyday expenses. In your position I would be concerned that selling your flat for £95k to clear it, would leave you with only £30k and that will soon disappear too if either/both of you don’t change your ways. Before you know it, you’ll be accumulating more debt and be back to square one. You and your DH must acknowledge the need for change in how you spend.

If you're getting an income from your flat which is benefitting the family hold firm and keep it. He would need your cooperation if its in your name. How is your marriage generally? If you think uit might some day be your FO fund definitely don't sell.

If you have joint debts are they on credit cards, if so make a plan together how you'll clear the debt. Set yourselves a timeline to clear it. Remind him your earning potential has been compromised due to havibg the children.

If the car is paid for via salary sacrifice then you don't own a car - you are likely leasing the car. Your DH might have paid a downpayment for it but it will be still likely be leased

That’s all good, my DH is very frugal, I’m more of a spender. I’m the higher earner and can usually find ways to boost my income. The thing is though, me earning more doesn’t give me carte blanch to spend. Significant spending decisions are joint decisions, I don’t assume I can spend more because I earn more, nor do I think DH should spend less because he earns less - we’re a team and both bring different things to the marriage. We don’t make a big purchase unless we’re both equally happy with the decision, and we’re jointly accountable.

Even high earners need to budget, or they get into trouble pretty quickly because money isn’t finite.

This!
And start thinking differently. Have ice cream at home and take cheap snacks out with you, for example.

If she trusts him, then sure, that would be the way to go. However, based on what OP has written, I wouldn't trust him and would want my own advice.

extravagance is what got you into this mess. buying you a spa day is an example of how your DH has his head in the sand when it comes to spending

as is buying cars without discussing ...

Keep it. It is yours. And it is your income
look after you.

Your flat is an income generating asset his car is costing in interest and depreciation. The sensible choice would be to massively downgrade in electric car.

He needs to be transparent including interest on all these loans/debts.

He is earning money because you are raising his DC.

OP, please get more financially savvy, start with communicating with your husband/partner, you both have to be on the same page when it comes to clearing debt, list it all down, he has to tell you this regardless of who earns what, then go and see a financial advisor, yes you will have to pay but if in the long-term this saves you money or gets you out of debt then it will be worth it.
Don't undervalue yourself and what you do for the family and inside the home, equally understand and appreciate what your husband/partner brings to the relationship.
My Great-Gran used to say to me 'when poverty comes in the door, love goes out the window' and she is right, nothing worse than debt and being in relationship where you are not communicating about it or you find resentment building.
This can be fixed but I think you both need an expert to point it out to you and to advise what you both need to do to get it sorted, it may not necessarily be selling your flat. Good Luck.

I would say compromise. Use the £400 income to pay off the most expensive debt first. eg. Credit card. That way you still keep the asset and cutting the interest owed will help

Worst time in many years to try selling a flat, what happens if the tenant doesn"t want to move out, what happens if the tenant moves out you can"t sell and can"t find another tenant? How do you replace the income stream?

Selling a property is expensive and if there's sitting tenants, it's lengthy and expensive. Plus you will not get the full market price.

I definitely would not sell with a DH who does 100% of the finances and poorly by the sounds of things.
Need a very clear budget, understanding your bills. House in joint names? Identify ways to reduce spending and apply to reducing debt. Your earning less to provide childcare is costing you and the other property has a balancing effect on this.

And he can't insist you sell your flat!
A few points -
As others have said you need to have an oversight of your joint finances. He can't insist you give up an asset but won't share where his income goes.
If you have cars on finance then these will eventually be paid so won't be a debt forever.
Could you take over some of the management of the flat to save money on fees?
Look on Money saving expert for budgeting and to see how other people became debt free

Maybe approach it with him in a different way than previously. It sounds like you are a bit defensive as you feel you do spend too much. You are pissed off about the car. He is annoyed as he thinks you spend too much. He is latching on to the flat and wants to sell as a bit of a knee jerk reaction.

So maybe say something along the lines of “can we sit down and discuss finances etc with no blame or accusations in a clean slate way and figure out exactly where we are so we can have a joint plan going forward?” He may be a bit toxic about it all and he will be defensive about the car. He may be panicking a bit about the debt. Point out that if you don’t have full access to everything you are working blind.

If he won’t even do that you have a much bigger issue than just debt.

Am afraid if overspending, and not paying any of the mortgage I can see his point. I also understand the reluctance in selling your flat and the safety net that brings. Are you on the deeds of the house you share? Because I'd not sell up until you are on those. Protected somewhat through marriage but I'd like it more certain.

End of the day though, if the debts and the high interest on those debts are too much and are really dragging you and your hubby down, it makes sense to sell up. Anything left over must go into some savings though for the unexpected, not to keep living the level of life you are and cannot currently afford.

So the real underlying issues here are that you are not able to discuss money together and neither of you really seem to have a handle on your finances or where your money is going either.

£65k is a lot of debt for anyone. It's really concerning that you don't know the precise amount or what form that debt takes. How much of it is the car, for example? Does he actually own the car or is it a leasing arrangement?

(As an aside, I've been looking into dh's employer's salary sacrifice scheme for electric cars recently and even with the tax savings, it's really not a cheap way to finance a car. So I'm not sure I'm buying the argument that it's saving you money)

What would happen if you said, dh I'm worried about our finances and that we need to get a better handle on them - this weekend I'd like us to sit down and go through it all?

Dave Ramsey's Baby Steps might be useful for you (it's a bit American in parts but there's a UK facebook group which is great) or Rebel Finance School. Money Saving Expert is great for budgeting advice and making sure you have the best deals on everything.

re your previous issues with budgets: the key is not just setting a budget and making sure it's realistic but then tracking your spending in real time against it and adjusting both the budget and the spending as you go. Overspent on food shopping this month? Better spend a bit less on something else to balance it up. The other way people often come unstuck is not anticipating more occasional expenses - Christmas is a really obvious one. Ideally you need to be budgeting a little bit each month to these, so that when they roll around the money is there to pay for them.

I wouldn't even start to consider selling the flat until you have all of this under better control. It's actually very empowering taking charge of your money, you will both feel a lot better for it, I promise.

Edited to fix typos

Exactly, UK borrowing costs were hitting 20 year highs this morning, a flat or a house is not like a bank account that just produces money when you need it, losing a paying tenant to risk the flat maybe not selling and all the costs that could involve, double council tax etc. or selling for a lot less than you expected would just be counter-productive in this environment.

Sending love OP, don't sell your property and as gently as possible, what your DH is doing is financial abuse if he's not being transparent about money and debt yet expecting you to sacrifice everything you own to clear it.

If finances are not completely shared and debt transparent, then your property should not be considered a shared asset either. Please get eyes on the debt he may be in more trouble then he's alluding to. Xx

This is not uncommon, seen it a lot on MN.

Men who want the benefits of individual finances AND the benefits of shared finances from their wives. "What's yours is mine and what's mine is my own".

Either its shared in which case you have as much say in car purchases etc and the right to veto and you can discuss selling the flat to benefit you both. OR they are seperate in which case a debt he took on to buy a fancy car is his problem and you can (and should) refuse to sell the flat to clear it.

You are wringing your hands over a bit of daily overspending when he is dropping £20k on a car and buying expensive gifts.

Keep it, you clearly need the income from it. It will also increase in value. At the same time have a good look at your finances. Draw up a plan to pay off your debts and start living within your means.

If you're in a lot of debt and paying interest, sell the flat