Husband wants to sell my pre-marriage flat to clear debts

[rdsh]

I’m just asking somewhere objective.

I have a flat I owned before I met DH. It is let out and the income is quite good. I do rely on it to a certain extent because I don’t earn much.

DH however wants to sell it: he wants to clear some debt.

I guess I’m just wondering WWYD … I want to keep it but part of that is perhaps because it benefits me rather than the whole family?

I think increase in value would be optimistic now, but it is an asset worth keeping.

Just to be clear - you working part-time and looking after your kids 3 days a week is saving you as a family Xk a year of NET income (i.e. after tax) which is a huge contribution to your combined family life. I bet if you look at that and the fact that you are spending most the money you do have on the kids - your family contribution monetarily is huge.

Then your lifestyle is unsustainable and you need to do something different. If neither of you can earn more you need to spend less. Spending less, might mean no holidays, or downgrading a car or it might mean reducing the debt you are servicing by selling an asset. The point is, you (ie. both of you) have to do something - you can't just keep overspending.

£65k idebt isn't just a 'whoops I forgot the wipes or a £1.50 bottle of water' sum though is it.

You've got a SUBSTANTIAL debt that is either decades old or a significant financial shortfall that will cripple you financially if you don't get your heads around it. You both need absolute financial clarity.

This won't be solved by selling your flat - what will you do next time you've overspent by £65000 pounds?

You have waaaay bigger problems than a forgotten water bottle op.

Absolutely 💯

There's no guarantees when it comes to property. Keep the tenancy and the property. @rdsh

Stay firm on this. Your husband needs to be more open about his debt and not put pressure on you whilst you care for young infants. Every best wish to you.

Its good you are working but DO NOT SELL your flat, just incase it all goes tits up. Speaking from experience! Now divorced

Do you mean you have asked and he refuses to tell you? If so you are in a financially abusive marriage.

You shouldn’t be in a position where the only way to force him to reveal this information is via divorce solicitors…

Op, if you sell the flat and clear the debts, will your dh run up more debts? Or is he disciplined enough to reduce his spending and keep within his income?

If he's just going to run up more debt, I'd keep the flat. You may need it.

Property always increases in value.

Not always, I remember the early 90s, wasn't caught out myself, but knew those who lost their substantial deposit. If one was to sell a property with sitting tenants it vastly reduces the selling potential, thereby a most certain price reduction. If selling the property with substantial debt, there's no wriggle room for the selling costs - just more debt accruing.

You need to accept you are both in debt and that debt accrues interest at high rates. If the income and growth in value of the flat is less than what you are paying in debt interest then pay off the debt capital.

the flat and debt are both marital assets and you need to deal with them in an intelligent way. A start would be getting advice than you are being given here on how to manage your joint situation.

Flats aren’t increasing in value anywhere.

The OP and her husband need proper financial advice on how to manager their debt and assets.

Don’t sell your flat. Husband sounds like he’s not valuing what you contribute. In years to come your flat can be part of your pension, or indeed somewhere to live if you split up. Get some debt management advice and draw up a plan (written) for reduction and consolidation of debts. Increase your days at work - you have to speculate to accumulate and you must think long term. Husband needs to be in agreement to th plan - he doesn’t get a bigger say.

Eventually all property increases in value. I remember the 90s but those properties are now worth much more than they were then.

There’s no need to sell with a sitting tenant. Having said that, there’s a good market of landlords wanting a property with a tenant already set up.

@rdsh - replying to this in response to the joint finances question, but I have read all of your posts.

Joint finances don't have to mean fully joint - but family expenses should absolutely be joint.

Next time DH suggests selling the flat - tell him you will consider it, but only if you sit down together and go through the household budget and look at how it be shared.

That means all household bills, mortgage, flat maintenance and fees, childcare expenses, food, childrens activity, clothes etc, income (wages and rental etc) and savings and debt (but only jointly accrued debts) - also a fair contribution to pensions and retirement savings.

When you are looking at income / expenditure you need to account for the childcare element - so if you were working full time and therefore bringing in a similar monthly income to DH, how much extra would it cost in childcare - that essentially goes onto your income / contribution.

If you want to keep some element of separate finances, you then need to work out proportionately how much you should both contribute to cover those bills / debts and whatever is left from your incomes after that is for you to do what you want with.

For the debts you can look at all options - is the interest terrible or liveable with a clear end date. Can you consolidate, use 0% credit cards etc? If none of that is an option and the debt will just keep increasing, then you may need to look at selling assets or reducing the debt in other ways (different car etc).

Do NOT allow all of the children's expenses to be lumped as your personal expenses - that way madness lies!

But whether DH agrees to doing that or simply shuts up about selling the flat you really do need to get to grips a lot more with your household finances - partly because of a risk around any future split, but also because if, god forbid, something happened to DH you don't want any nasty surprises!

Having helped relatives who have lost their spouses sort out finances when they had no idea what was going on, it is an absolute nightmare to try and do at a very emotional time. If you have a good idea about your household finances, it is one less stress!

I think the flat is a red herring, you both need to rein in your spending, you on day to day items and him on cars .How many cars does he go through?

As a first step, rental income should go directly towards paying the credit card debt. Take some responsibility for it but keep your asset.

Yes but they offer much lower than the market price. It's not worth it. Losing out on say £20,000 is a gamble when the future is uncertain with people who live above their means and don't properly address it.

The interest payments alone on £65k are going to be a heck of a lot more than £400 a month.

The OP sounds very reluctant to work out a budget with her DH.

I think both are responsible for this debt.

I don't think you should agree to sell the flat at this point, but I don't think you should refuse to sell it either. Instead, I think you should tell your DH that you will consider it when you've had an opportunity to review the finances in full. There needs to be complete transparency around income and expenditure so that you can understand how much debt you are in, how that debt has arisen and what other options there might be for dealing with it. If he wants you to step up and contribute via the sale of your property, then he needs to treat you as an equal partner with equal responsibility - and that means that you both need to have a complete understanding of the current situation before you can determine together how you are going to deal with that situation.

Until it doesn"t.

There's no shame or judgement in debt management @rdsh

It's much better to address it head above the sand. x

Why dont you ask them ?

I use whstapp all the time snd psy no attention to blue ticks

would not have a clue how to disable never crosed my mind

if its a date they are not right for you as its game playing
if its a friend ask them
i once blocked s friend and had no idea

Having an electric car through a salary sacrifice scheme saved us as a family approx £14k last year when you take into consideration how much you can play the system. Careful you don't get rid of the Tesla and lose your free hours as personal allowance 😂

Be careful here. If the flat is a pre marriage asset that is 100% yours if you got divorced.

If you sell it to pay back 100% of the debt and your husband, who is responsible for 50% of the debt, will have paid off nothing. Tell him that's why you don't agree.

You can't make any of these decisions without sitting down and working out everything that comes in, everything that goes out (and that means accounting for annual expenses like car maintenance, birthdays, Christmas etc as well as monthly ones). For both of you.

You don't have to have joint finances. I don't with my husband because we find it easier to work this way. But you do have to communicate.

I think to have a reasonable discussion you both have to stop being so defensive. You've both played a part in the debt. It sounds like he's been keen on buying cars but equally, you've not bothered to investigate the financial position and have been happy to let him shoulder it - and to benefit from shiny new things.

You need to work together and get a grip on this. It may be the best option to sell the flat but at the moment neither of you can know because you both have only half the information. It's madness and you need to change - together (or your marriage is doomed).