DH and money -How can I get through to him that young children are expensive?

[imsureiusedto]

My DH is obsessed with the idea that we are on the verge of ruin. It’s putting intolerable strain on my marriage and I keep questioning if I want to be with him at all. When I raise it things improve for a while but a few weeks later revert.

We have two children who are four and one (two in midsummer.) I think it’s since younger child was born that this narrative started appearing and it’s now seeping into everything. He is constantly complaining. I work three days a week and I earn just under £2000 (I am talking in terms of take home pay.) He works full time and he earns more than double that, but I do also have a rental property which brings me around £450 so that helps. So we obviously earn well.

After a while I decided that I just wasn’t going to talk money with DH and that I’d pay for what I needed and in effect act like I was single from a financial point of view. This sort of worked for a while but this month has been an expensive one. So yesterday we spent

DDs swimming lesson (I pay for kids swimming)
DS soft play (he can’t swim at the moment due to an ear infection but I obviously didn’t want him to miss out)

Then I took them into town. My shoes broke on Friday so I was going to get a new pair. DH gave me his card; I stupidly said yes. Bought my shoes (£30) and lunch for the kids at m and s.

Then DDs dance - I paid for.

I am absolutely fed up of it. Does he think they can’t eat or that their activities should be curtailed when we earn well?

No yiur major issue seems to be that even though you are married and have partner he doesn’t seem to want to support you

and the decisions as to how these things work seem to be how he wants it to work not you

you don’t like the way it is set up and I don’t think I blame you for that but you seem to think that nothing will change that - why? Why can’t you say you aren’t happy with this set up and things need to change

Slightly off topic but I'm staggered at the number of posters saying swimming lessons are unnecessary/ a luxury/ not essential. They are an absolutely vital life skill, wherever you live. And if you live in London like 90% of mumsnet seem to, you may not live in London forever, and a lot of the "free" stuff people keep
Saying op should be doing may involve knowing how to swim for safety.

But thinking it over, even if your debt repayments are massive, you're still going to be left with over £1,000 a month to cover food/groceries, kids activities and clothing. So it must be that he's monitoring what you are spending from your own account rather than you using his card routinely. And that is most definitely abusive.

I'm struggling with how debt built up during MatLeave if the op only has to pay for her personal stuff and stuff for the DC. In a worse case scenario, she had nothing coming in for the last 13 weeks but could have converted 4 weeks of that to holiday pay. So 90% of earnings for the first six weeks then about £150pw for weeks 7 to 39, and she also had £450pcm private income.

When I was on mat leave I think I recall barely needing to spend anything with a dh who paid the mortgage and household bills. If I'd built up debt in the op's shoes I think my DH would have been, and quite rightly, mightily pissed off.

The nub of this for me is that the dh, despite paying the mortgage and the utilities, etc, has bale out money at the end of the month when the op has more month than money left. If I were the DH I think I'd be pissed off too.

I agree they are a life skill but not at age 1.

How are swimming lessons for a 1 year old essential?

@RosesAndHellebores the earlier the better! Certainly should be started before three

That's a want not an essential. It's good to do if you can afford it, but it's not necessary for a toddler to have formal swimming lessons.

@cockywoof at the risk of detailing the thread, if it is at all possible to start swimming lessons at one year old (usually it is a group activity developing water confidence) then it absolutely should be done, and clearly in this case this family have the money and means.

The highest rates of death by drowning are amongst 0-4 year olds

I think it depends on the child. Both of mine are strong swimmers but from 2 to 4 needed just to be playing in the water for confidence as they were both quite fearful of it. I taught both to swim by the age of four and the lessons came when they started school and were more about technique.

Why?

I have no issue with swimming lessons as a nice activity for the OP with her baby (and they can afford that so great) but neither of mine (who are both county level competitive swimmers) had lessons that young.

Why doesn’t he take the kids out so he can see how expensive things are?

Why doesn’t he go to Tesco so he can see how expensive laundry soap is?

Why is he interrogating you about how much you spent at Tesco? How does that even happen? Is he checking the balance immediately and then getting sniffy about it?

Why is he scared of debt, but was happy for you to accumulate debt while on maternity?
But he’s ok for you to work less ( because it benefits him). And you pay for nursery costs ? I suspect because at some level you both agree that the kids are more your responsibility than his.

I agree with the poster above who said you are walking into financial ruin. You are gradually lowering your earning potential while simultaneously absorbing more costs for a quiet life.
This is a man who values money over the wellbeing of his wife and children and this IS financial abuse.

Is this not part of the problem? He isn’t seeing any of the day to day expenses for the children.

What happens with days out for the children like to an attraction? Do you pay for yours and the children’s tickets and he for his own or does he not join family outings?

The highest rates of death by drowning are amongst 0-4 year olds

But if they fell into cold water swimming lessons won’t help them.

No suggestions sorry but that does sound a miserable to way to work finances in a marriage and I don't blame you for not being happy about the lack of transparency on his finances or the arguments or judgement is causes when you try discuss or need money from him.

You said you had previously considered divorce. Is there positives about him?

You really need to get to the root of his worry rather than just brushing it under the rug. Even if he is being unreasonable, go in with an open mind and listen to his worries. And his to yours.

You may have different spending styles, at a minimum you definitely have a different view on money right now, so work out a solution around that.

I personally think the best way especially with different spending styles is split the joint costs, then have your own money to do whatever you please.

He has his own money and if he doesn’t want to spend it on parking or ice creams whereas you do (not saying YABU here) he can do that and save it.

If / when you have that worked out you can begin to discuss joint savings, joint plans etc but work out the basic day to day first.

Money can be a difficult think in relationships and it takes time and communication!

Good luck op 💐

PS I’m a tight northern lass and it peeves me to pay for parking so I’ll avoid at all costs - with your partner on this 😉😂

He sounds hard work. Is he able to communicate about other things? I mean, is it just money that sets this off? In my experience, money is like housework - it is easy to be blind to what you don’t spend on (do) and the person who does most of it tends to have a much more realistic idea of how much things cost (how long it takes).

It’s a shame he’s so against the idea of a joint account. What works for us is having a joint account with a pre-agreed amount that we pay into every month. We use this for mortgage, bills, food and anything which is loosely a joint expense (the “other” category always comes in higher than you’d expect - pharmacy costs, compost for the garden, etc). But our salaries are paid into our personal accounts and we pay for personal expenses and commuting costs from those. This works well as there’s transparency around joint spending but we can each get our hair cut/buy presents without the other one seeing what it costs.

What helped in our case was delegating kids’ spends. I would ask DH to pick up some vitamins, those bananas, a new multipack of socks, etc. DH had a very naive idea as to what could be spent in a month on “stuff which doesn’t fall into a neat category” until I started doing this. Now he questions less.

If he wouldn’t go for that, I’d be tempted to overload him with information. You’ve just spent £15 in Tesco, here is the receipt, can he point out what was unnecessary on it? Etc.

Don't reduce them.

I'm not clear who pays for the food shopping now. I thought the DH was paying for that and the op just for top ups where then issue was the vicarious spending around it on parking and ice creams.

i pay for most of the food

Do you have a source for that? I can't find anything to support that online. UK stats are saying teenagers are the most at risk.

I can see drowning is the number one cause of death in kids 0-4 in the UK but that includes drowning in the bath (and that's the most common place drowning occurs for that age group).

https://www.rlss.org.uk/news/new-report-shows-sharp-increase-in-child-drownings-in-england-with-children-from-minority-ethnic-groups-and-families-from-deprived-areas-most-at-risk

Your biggest, ongoing, mistake is not listening to others views.

We can see what you are conditioned to accept isn't right.

Why shouldn't he pay for his kids?
What does he spend his money on?

@Huskytrot i am striving to be fair and while i think I’ve had a hard time from some I also think he has and finding that balance is difficult.

I do agree I can spend more than I mean to through ‘oh we need milk, best get some oranges too while I’m here, oh and some cheese …’ I also think I’m not the hugely profligate spender I’ve been made to be and I do contribute, paying the childcare (not a small amount) and paying for the food and goods like shampoo and toothpaste and cleaning products.

I also think DH isn’t quite the demon he’s been made to be here but he is impossible to talk to and I’ve given up. It’s frustrating and that’s what this thread is borne from.

He won’t change so it really is put up or shut up. At the moment honestly I often feel I’d be happier apart from him but the children wouldn’t be and obviously they are more important.

Considering you buy a lot of lunches out I’m not surprised.

The relevant information is how much your DH pays to for the rest of the families bills, but you’re choosing not to share that.