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No cash accepted

263 replies

greenose · 04/12/2024 22:02

I've posted about this before and it is getting worse. Takes kids into London today to spend some pocket money off grandparents. Goes yo Pizza Hut and its card only them the glossier shop and they don't Even have tills 😡 you put details into the iPad and pay contactless. I don't understand how all these business are getting away with refusing to accept cash.

OP posts:
janfebmar87 · 05/12/2024 09:25

My mil will only use cash. Two weeks she went to the back and took out £250. She wanted to do a big shop and some Christmas shopping. Before she had spent a penny someone swiped her purse.

Absolute scum bag, but no way to get anything back. If someone had stolen her card and used it she would have had a good chance of getting it back

LoafofSellotape · 05/12/2024 09:32

I make a point of paying in cash when I can, I don't think people realise it's more expensive oyn the long run to pay by card even though it might be easier, businesses just put their prices up to cover the cost.

DogInATent · 05/12/2024 09:34

PhilosophicalCheeseSandwich · 05/12/2024 09:15

It used to be quite common in a few places I've worked for Doris From Accounts to do the bank run to the night safe on her way home - unpaid after her paid hours had ended, and in her own car without business use insurance.

I have a friend who works for a national chain of shoe shops who still has to take cash to the bank once a week. She goes in work time, but has to use her own car to get into town and then carry a big bag of cash tucked in her own bag through town. And then get bagged coins from the bank to bring back to the shop.

It's not a huge amount these days I don't suppose, probably less than £1k, but it's a hell of a risk for her and the business to take. I assume the risk of doing that outweighs the cost of having a security company come and collect the cash.

The risk is that Doris From Accounts has an accident in her car, she's found to be doing the bank run, isn't insured for business use, and as a consequence her insurance company doesn't pay out. Adding business use is generally free for most policies, but you have to ask your broker to add it.

DogInATent · 05/12/2024 09:34

LoafofSellotape · 05/12/2024 09:32

I make a point of paying in cash when I can, I don't think people realise it's more expensive oyn the long run to pay by card even though it might be easier, businesses just put their prices up to cover the cost.

Edited

You know cash isn't free? It has costs and fees too, it's not just cards.

WillowTit · 05/12/2024 09:39

withdraw cash
go shopping
less chance of over spending
simple

senua · 05/12/2024 09:51

I used to embrace all the latest tech but feel like I reached a saturation point with it and now choosing to go back to a more simple life.
Agreed. Also it's all organised for the benefit of the big companies, not us. Parking fees are an example of this, where it seems that every car park has a different App that they expect us to download. Cash is much simpler because it is universal. That's the whole point of it!

I can't believe the poster who does everything on her Apple watch with, it seems, no alternate backup ('another Apple watch' does not qualify as an alternate!). I have a variety of debit & credit cards (with different providers) and cash.

DysonSphere · 05/12/2024 10:09

I've had times when I was dirt poor, I mean DEAD broke, where having money in my account was a liability because I got a fine from my bank if I spent over a certain amount by even a quid and only having cash got me through.

Ethics aside:

Cash helps the poor make extra money they do not have to declare. Sometimes it's starve or look after your neighbours dog or child for an extra £30 quid in hand, or sell your mothers bracelet she gave you for rent money. That's the reality.

Cash helps struggling startup businesses keep more money for reinvestment

Cash helps immigrants survive who can't get an account. Frankly even the honest poor citizen sometimes struggle to get a current account or cannot get one. Quite disgraceful.

Cash helps vulnerable women in prostitution.

Cash helps the self-employed make money flexibly

Cash helps support the homeless

Cash helps charities

Cash helps fringe political parties and fringe political newpapers

Cash facilities the grey market and yes, the black market

Cash is flexible and cash is related to personal liberty.

You may be opposed to some or all the above, but like it or not all the above facilitates the economy. The economy is served by people having fiscal flexibility. Take away cash and people will resort to bartering. For women particularly that scenario has the potential to be very bad.

Removing cash is also a bad idea because it makes all your spend open to surveillance and vulnerable to being curtailed. If you think 'well don't do anything wrong then' it's worth remembering that what is 'wrong' is always open to change. We have seen that even in supposed democracies emergency powers have been drafted in to penalise people for protest by blocking their accounts. Not just on that measure, but attempts made to block accounts of people donating to causes considered politically unpalatable or the accounts closed by the banks themselves because of the social and political affiliations of the banking CEO. Nigel Farage a couple years ago had his account blocked and furthermore that personal information was leaked to a journalist. All well and good, but not when you are compelled to hold money in your account because there are zero alternatives. I will never forget those images of people in Greece lining up in front of their banks to try and retrieve their money when the economy collapsed, and the banks closing or refusing to allow them to empty their accounts

Cybercrime is being used as a source of soft warfare, and it looks like we are only increasing tensions with our neighbours. When your banking app goes down, or the central bank AI system messes up and you cannot get your money from the hole in the wall, you realise you do not, in fact, have money. You have theoretical money. You have numbers on a screen.

Getting rid of cash is a bad idea at the most basic level of community interaction. It's bad for personal liberty. It makes you 100% reliant on your bank, and on the human rights ethos (if you think byt the ordinary person won't ever have their account snooped on, don't forget the last government requesting banks inform DWP the moment a person on any sort of benefit hold money above the threshold for any reason and the right to check the accounts of affiliated persons to the account holder) an instant commitment of your government, and NGOs.

In effect I see cashless the way Americans see giving up the right to bear arms. You have no buffer between yourself and possible tyrannical government. No buffer between your hard earned money and targeted cybercrime, possibly less ability and agency to support causes or political parties that are socially or politically frowned upon.

Once we create that reality, and remove those freedoms the tide will never be able to turn back and we'll never get them again. You're left with bartering or some other means of exchangeable currency and frankly I don't governments or businesses would want that.

ILoveCustardTartsFromTescoBakery · 05/12/2024 10:14

Excellent post @DysonSphere

I have to ask though (sorry OP, hopefully I won't detail your post too much), if a cyber attack meant nobody had their bank accounts for a week, surely shops would refuse to sell anything at all?

Even to those with cash? Because it wouldn't be 'fair' and could cause civil unrest, surely?

OneOliveEagle · 05/12/2024 10:17

I remember being stranded in Prague when both myself and partner had our cards frozen (as we’d not told them we were going abroad). No cash.

The cards couldn’t get reinstated by the Bank’s! Spent the rest of the holiday waiting outside Western Union whilst the Banks transferred cash as they wouldn’t send more than £300 each time 😭

Another time … separated from partner in London. I squeezed off the tube, he didn’t make it. He was carrying my bag that held everything. I stayed where I was, but he didn’t reappear and there began a couple of hours of backwards and forwards on the tube. Went to find staff. They wouldn’t let me use their phone to message him 😭

When you have these experiences it never leaves you - and you don’t make yourself so vulnerable again. Always have options!!

senua · 05/12/2024 10:18

Spot on DysonSphere. You only have to read The Handmaid's Tale to understand what can go wrong.

iridescentsnowflake · 05/12/2024 11:02

As as a PP has posted, one of the top BBC news stories today is that 1 in 5 shop purchases are now made using cash.

Cash should be accepted for so many reasons.

I’ve been in multiple situations where the systems have gone down and shops have been accepting cash only. Technology is great when it works, but we all know that it doesn’t always!

BorgQueen · 05/12/2024 11:15

Good luck to you lot who don’t use cash, what will you do in a prolonged cyber attack or Carrington type event ?
How stupid do you have to be to give away the last bit of freedom that is having and spending cash?

You don’t need to be some kind of super prepper to see what could happen.

DysonSphere · 05/12/2024 11:23

ILoveCustardTartsFromTescoBakery · 05/12/2024 10:14

Excellent post @DysonSphere

I have to ask though (sorry OP, hopefully I won't detail your post too much), if a cyber attack meant nobody had their bank accounts for a week, surely shops would refuse to sell anything at all?

Even to those with cash? Because it wouldn't be 'fair' and could cause civil unrest, surely?

Good question.

To answer we should look to how people and businesses behaved during covid. People put themselves first and shops did not prevent one person buying 10 bottles of cooking oil and 20 packs of toilet tissue or multiple bags of flour for their own personal use. NHS/essential workers/elderly/disabled who couldn't get out and buy were left with nothing. It was all mega profit for the shops. Not until ministers started requesting supermarkets put controls in and there was a hue and cry about it, were people restricted to buying only one or more of a product, but still people continued to get away with liberties. There was also massive fraud on the part of businesses/falsely self employed requesting bail out money, which the government has conveniently chosen not to pursue retrieving.

So it would not be far fetched to conclude that in the event of a major cyber attack or some other disaster businesses would at least initially continue to sell for and receive cash, only thinking about their bottom dollar until some sort of intervention prevented it. Even then there would be people willing to sell unofficially for cash.

DogInATent · 05/12/2024 11:36

BorgQueen · 05/12/2024 11:15

Good luck to you lot who don’t use cash, what will you do in a prolonged cyber attack or Carrington type event ?
How stupid do you have to be to give away the last bit of freedom that is having and spending cash?

You don’t need to be some kind of super prepper to see what could happen.

What do you think you're going to buy?
Who are you going to buy it from?
What value do you think cash will have?
Cash has no inherent value in a SHTF type event.

BorgQueen · 05/12/2024 12:03

It would for a couple of days, people would be in shock and denial - a couple of thousand ££s in cash would see me gathering supplies while others wait for the power to come back on. Fags, booze and drugs would become currency.

senua · 05/12/2024 12:07

DogInATent · 05/12/2024 11:36

What do you think you're going to buy?
Who are you going to buy it from?
What value do you think cash will have?
Cash has no inherent value in a SHTF type event.

I'm guessing that you live somewhere very urban.

HalfMoonLight · 05/12/2024 12:12

INeedAnotherName · 04/12/2024 22:42

I don't. Too many banks have IT failures and people can't access their accounts or get bills paid, or supermarkets have till failures so people can't buy their food. It's happening more and more.

I mean this has never happened to me and I'm nearly 60, love not having to carry cash around. I think those who want cash to stay are either elderly, which is understandable, or earning a bit on the side.

SapphireOpal · 05/12/2024 12:36

greenose · 05/12/2024 09:24

As others have said the likes of go Henry and rooster cards arnt free, then it's the chore of taking all there birthday/Christmas and pocket money the bank to get it put on the card. Dd has ASD and loses absolutely everything so whilst she did have a go Henry I found I was constantly having to replace missing cards. Gone are the days that they can go out and spend pocket money on what they want 😡

So you'd rather she lost cash than a card?

You can get kids accounts that are free. Kite is free through Starling if you have an adult account with Starling for example.

DogInATent · 05/12/2024 12:44

senua · 05/12/2024 12:07

I'm guessing that you live somewhere very urban.

I've lived urban and rural.
Cash would have less value in a rural community than an urban one.

Imagine the SHTF, someone offers you cash for a bottle of water. What value is the cash to you vs. the bottle of water?

Thevelvelletes · 05/12/2024 12:47

HalfMoonLight · 05/12/2024 12:12

I mean this has never happened to me and I'm nearly 60, love not having to carry cash around. I think those who want cash to stay are either elderly, which is understandable, or earning a bit on the side.

I've saw it a few times certain bank cards not able to be accepted so it's cash or phone payments method crashing.
When these things are happening on a regular basis along with other IT systems playing up it would be naive to dismiss the possibility of outside forces poking about testing our cyber security.

snowlaser · 05/12/2024 12:56

DogInATent · 05/12/2024 12:44

I've lived urban and rural.
Cash would have less value in a rural community than an urban one.

Imagine the SHTF, someone offers you cash for a bottle of water. What value is the cash to you vs. the bottle of water?

Cash only has value because it can be exchanged for other things - but that's equally true today as it is in a SHTF scenario.

If you don't need that bottle of water, sell it and buy something else. If you need it, keep it.

I think there is a place for both cards and cash. I certainly like cash as a "backup" in the SHTF scenario in which Russian cyber criminals take down our banking system. The world doesn't go Mad Max overnight but at least we could still keep the wheels turning if we had cash.

senua · 05/12/2024 13:15

If you don't need that bottle of water, sell it and buy something else. If you need it, keep it.
Yeah, bad example to pick!Grin. I live near several springs so I have access to water; it's not a scarce commodity to me. The cash from bottled water could buy more (empty) bottles (so I get even more cash from the townies) or food etc etc.

DysonSphere · 05/12/2024 14:22

HalfMoonLight · 05/12/2024 12:12

I mean this has never happened to me and I'm nearly 60, love not having to carry cash around. I think those who want cash to stay are either elderly, which is understandable, or earning a bit on the side.

Nope. It's about more than cash itself. For many it's about freedom and people of all ages are concerned about that, just as people of all ages were concerned about curtailing of freedoms in the pandemic. Cash represents something ubiquitous, and actually you cannot truly dispose of a manual means of exchanging goods for value. Well at least no society has ever done it.

One or two major cyber attacks and money along with perhaps bartering would very quickly come back in vogue. I believe it temporarily came back in vogue during Covid lockdown, and that wasn't as severe as a cyber crisis. What's the first thing people do when they get wind that their shares, or their bank, or the economy is going to tank? They liquidate, withdraw and convert to cash or gold,silver etc as quickly as possible.

DowntonFlabbie · 05/12/2024 14:28

It's not about freedom. You're no more or less free using cash, it's ridiculous.
The people posting FB about keeping cash to stay free...they're the same idiots talking about being sovereign citizens and calling people steeple fir getting COVID boosters. It's just that vague paranoid inability to understand what's actually happening self important bullshit.

Nobody is taking your freedom away. Chill out

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