So ashamed of what I’ve done

[Pamzsat]

Hi,I’m 48 divorced with one daughter who lives at uni.

My mum has a form of dementia and moved in with me 2 years ago. She’s struggling more and her cognitive ability is poor now. I adore having her here but it has created a few challenges. I’m stiff employed and my income has dipped as I’m not able to work as many hours as I previously did. My mortgage also shot up last year so things are tight.

about 6 months ago I found myself in a mess with council tax arrears and also an arrears balance on my utilities. I was at risk of being issued a default so had to find £1600 quickly.

mum has a credit card that she doesn’t use so I used that to pay the balance. I did this online. My own 2 cc’s are maxed and I was unable to get another. I set up a standing order to pay the balance back over 6 months. I’ve also used it a couple more times when things have been tight.

im deeply ashamed and know that what I’ve done is fraudulent and morally wrong but I was desperate. I feel like I’ve financially abused mum as she wasn’t able to consent to me doing this. I was just so desperate.

i’m losing sleep and am seriously thinking about reporting myself. Am I over thinking this?

Judging by the amount of likes my post got a lot of people would have done the same.

I agree. I'm not suggesting OP has done anything evil. It's clear she loved her mother, was desperate and just trying to keep things afloat for the two of them.

I don't work in this field so I can't say how someone looking out for financial abuse of older people / safeguarding older people would view this specific situation.

I was simply told by the agency who were providing my grandmother support to apply for Attendance Allowance that they tend to err on the side of caution when reporting to the police. The example they gave which seemed the most extreme to me was reporting someone in their 70s (caring for a parent in their 90s) to the police because they were using the parent's card to do the parent's grocery shopping and there were a lot of payments to a fancy supermarket but on the day the agency visited the older person's home there was no food in the cupboards from said shop. That to me was quite extreme to immediately jump to financial abuse by a family member so I think they can see things in quite a black and white way.

I wouldn't have done the same if I'm honest. I'd have made a plan of repayment with the council and also told them My mother who lives with me has dementia, my income is reduced and I'm struggling, same with the untilities but thats easy for me to say, this poor woman is juggling so many plates she clearly just lost her mind for a minute, in absolute desperation. She felt that as her mother needed these things too, it was OK and I do understand that sentiment if I'm honest. Im also not even sure what she's done would be classed as financial abuse because it was used for things her mother needed but it is fraud as she wasn't the owner of the card, so it's really not a good idea for anyone to ever do it. She needs to close all of her mothers lines of credit as soon as reasonably possible.

You did what you had to and I don't blame you at all. I think you are being way too hard on yourself - where would your mum be without you? How much is she able to contribute to the household? I wonder what the people who are giving you a hard time would have done instead? Easy to do the right thing when you're not in that position.

That proves my point though really they left the relative without necessities.... in this situation her mother needed these things also but I know your only trying to help this poor OP and you could be right. what an absolutely awful situation she's in. Clearly a very good and decent person reduced to severe stress, anxiety and desperation.

The thing is for me I know everyone is saying don't report it and I know she does risk prosecution but given the money is already repaid, I don't think she would be. Of course one can never be 100% but If she is being honest about what this card was used for I don't think a prosecution would be in the public interest, especially if she reported herself and then people would step in to help. Right now she's got absolute desperate guilt and anxiety over this and I'm pretty sure her financial situation won't have improved much either and will likely get worse without immediate help. She can't sustain this much longer.

Pay it back and stop worrying xx

This! You are caring for your mum and you paid it back. So much unkindness here and lack of humility. You feel bad. Nobody was harmed. Be kind to you (clearly others won’t be 😏)

Attendance Allowance is not means tested. No one examines bank statements etc for Attendance Allowance. (I filled up the applications for my mother and then my father. A stroke charity rep filled up my husband's, but I gave him the necessary info.)

If it's not already being claimed, OP should go to Citizens' Advice and have them fill up the form for her. There's a specific way of doing it to make sure that the first application is successful - you have to concentrate on what the person cannot do, rather than what they can do: I was told to describe what the person was like on one of their worst days.

Yes. The OP is an unpaid carer. If she had been unable to pay the bills, the mother would have finished up in a care home and all of her cash would have gone.

I don't know what's being charged now, but when I paid respite costs for my late mother (because of family illness) I had to pay for anything above 4 weeks. That happened twice. On one occasion, I was charged £900 for a week. The other time I was charged £800.

It wasn't the Attendance Allowance assessors going through the bank statements it was a charity / external agency who supports older people and their families to claim the benefits they are entitled to. I don't know if the review of the bank statements is to get a sense of the older person's financial circumstances to ensure they're claiming everything they're entitled to, some of which may be means tested, but this was the process we went through when we received support to apply for Attendance Allowance just a few months ago.

That's why I'm suggesting OP just apply for her mother rather than getting anyone external involved.

Absolutely do not report yourself. Pay it back and work out as others say a fair contribution to her costs from your mum and document that. The law does not require you and your mum to be homeless rather than she contribute to her own care.
(also look into any other support)

Yes, I get that - but if she only asks for help applying for Attendance Allowance, there's no need to go through everything else.

My next door neighbour got Citz Advice to fill up the form for her husband. (He had vascular dementia.) No examination of bank accounts needed.

When my late husband was discharged from hospital, the Stroke Rehab Ward contacted the Stroke Association and one of their workers came to the house to fill up the forms for us. Again, no examination of bank books, etc.

You need to take the necessary steps to make sure it doesn't happen again. Shame is a useful emotion to you right now because it's signalling to you you've done something wrong and you need to take steps accordingly so you don't feel how you do now.

I don't think it's that big a deal to be honest. If you are struggling financially because of the additional cost of keeping her, plus your reduced hours then I think it's fair to use some of her money to help keep a roof over both of your heads.

Is there someone else sharing POA with you? If so I'd sit down and do a worked example of how much she might reasonably contribute, clear it with them and keep those records of how much you are using and the rationale.

If you weren't looking after her, that money would need to be used to pay for care anyway. The thing to do is to do it transparently and on record and ideally with the knowledge and agreement of someone else with POA so it's all above board.

I'm sure your mum would want to help pay her way I'd she was lucid.

You haven't taken the money to fritter on things that benefit you. You've taken it to keep a roof over your shared heads. I think some posters above are being pretty heartless.

Your mum sounds really lucky to have you. Not everyone could or would do all this for their parents.

That doesn't make it right. I presume her Mum does not have POA in place and it will be too late for her to set up now if she does have the capacity to understand financial discussions.

I don't think OP should do anything apart from pay it back, never do it again and then move on from the guilt. Financial abuse of a vulnerable person is serious. Saying it's better than a care home which would cost the State a lot more might be true, but it's doesn't justify it.

OP has been given lots of advice which I hope will help her financial situation.

You have done wrong & you know you have.

But don't make it worse by reporting it. If you fo that it could cause you and your mum a while heap of additional problems and make a bad situation worse.

Don't compound the issue due to guilt. It serves no purpose.

It seems like you are in a really difficult space right do. Do check all benefits and allowances you are both entitled too.

I hope things improve for you.

Op, I don't know enough about the law or your situation to condemn you either legally or ethically. It sounds tough, are you getting any financial support for caring for your mother? In my completely non expert opinion, her accommodation and living costs should not fall solely on you.

I how other posts can advise on whether you can formalise an arrangement where her @money can contribute fairly to your costs in a transparent and above board manner?

Hi, I've read and re read OP's post. In the absence of any mention of carers allowance, etc, it's appears that she's been providing accommodation and full board to an adult for 2 years. And she's used £1,600 of that adult's money towards the costs of that accommodation. £67 per month.

Now I wouldn't have advised her to have done this in that exact manner - she might have put herself in a position of technically breaking the law. I certainly can't give her any assurances, and I pray someone else can

But is using £67 per month of someone's money to feed and house them really worthy of shame?

My 'shame on you' comment was to a poster who said they would do the same, not the OP.

But it's the same thing? What's the difference in the poster doing it and OP, if it's the same thing?

decionsdecisions62 · Yesterday 13:05
Those folks that are saying you are overthinking it are seriously misguided! The courts take a dim view of financial abuse and this very clearly is financial abuse. The law is there to protect vulnerable people against exactly this sort of harm!”

Most people take a dim view of sanctimonious posters. What sort of “harm”, exactly, has OP’s mum suffered? Her daughter has kept a roof over her head.

How can it be financial abuse when the Ops mum isn't paying anything towards her keep? If you're going to do it that way then the op should stop paying anything and allow her mother to fend for herself.

Sorry. Wrong quote.

I was replying to this.

decionsdecisions62 · Yesterday 13:05
Those folks that are saying you are overthinking it are seriously misguided! The courts take a dim view of financial abuse and this very clearly is financial abuse. The law is there to protect vulnerable people against exactly this sort of harm!”

How can it be financial abuse when the Ops mum isn't paying anything towards her keep? If you're going to do it that way then the op should stop paying anything and allow her mother to fend for herself.

That's not how financial abuse works.