Spouse deciding to retire early, spending our savings

[bestcoffeepot]

Not sure where to post this really, AIBU, relationships or money matters.

After being furloughed last year, briefly working again and then being made redundant, my spouse seems to have decided not to bother working any more. They are almost 55 so can start to draw the pension from former employers shortly.

They won't discuss the matter with me at all. Things went downhill fast in the relationship during their time on furlough when I naturally expected that they'd be doing the bulk of stuff around the house as I was having to work harder than ever at that time. They do about as much round the house as our teenage kids (don't get me wrong, the kids do enough but I'd expect a SAHP to do a great deal more than their own kids)

The thing is we'll be dipping into our savings every month if they are just receiving a reduced pension amount because of early retirement. The redundancy pay sum is half gone already having been used to balance the budget each month since they stopped getting a salary.

It's like we've saved all these years (a chunk of those savings are needed to contribute to the kids Uni years almost upon us) and, with no discussion at all, one of us has just decided to spend those savings now, on funding a "pottering about", retired lifestyle whilst the other has to keep working with no chance of a gradual decreasing of hours as they age/approach retirement (as we'll need every penny).

It's the lack of discussion over the matter that appals me. Those savings were created my me as much as them even though I was the lower earner as I covered most of the day to day house and child related stuff whilst also working full time.

I have lost all respect for them and I'm feeling trapped because having unburdened myself to a friend, they suggested that divorce will only increase our combined costs with 2 homes to run etc and cost us in solicitors fees too.

What can I do, realistically ?

@Ratherly

Sex does matter - there's huge structural inequalities still! Pay gap, pension gap (time off for children). Oh for it not to be true and this be genuinely neutral situation!

Indeed.

"Unconscious bias" my arse.

I repeat, women do not behave the way this spouse is behaving. Men do.

That's not unconscious bias, that's fact.

@Bluntness100
Women’s earlier state pension entitlement, along with there being a state widow’s pension but no equivalent for widowers, and family allowance being paid to the mother were not ‘sexist nonsense’, they reflected the economic realities of the twentieth century.

*I repeat, women do not behave the way this spouse is behaving. Men do.

That's not unconscious bias, that's fact.*

Oh they do and then they play the victim card by saying their partner is financial abusive. I've seen it happen, women already have a longer life expectancy than men yet it is amazing the number who retire at an earlier age than men. Also you are categorising by a protected characteristic of sex. Would Mumsnet allow the same inaccurate generalisations based upon race?

I can totally understand at that age wanting to take a step back from a high stress high paid role, but to do and contribute nothing when your spouse is working full time seems bizarre when there are so many jobs available at the minute. I could pick up a coffee shop gig tomorrow if I chose to, and get an office temping job within a month.

I'd love to retire- I'm 51 - but unless our finances change dramatically I'm not doing that until age 60 ( and I know I'm lucky to be able to go for that number compared to the younger generation). DH is a contractor and earns more and was talking about retiring mid 50s, but now he has used all of our savings to buy a very expensive car - I said that was fine, but no way was he retiring before me then or until the coffers had been refilled. I am however encouraging him to drop to 4 days for more of a balance.

@Eddielzzard

When adults are of working age and can't afford to retire early, it isn't a gender issue. If you're capable of working and you need the money, you work.

Since they won't talk, the only option is action. I would certainly start restricting access to savings. I'd also start contingency planning quite openly so that your OH is fully aware of what's happening. Tidy up the house for estate agents valuations and get them round. Schedule a meeting with a solicitor to find out your rights. Hopefully your OH will be jolted into action when they see you are at the end of your tether.

That'll go two ways:

1. They crap themselves and start looking for work or at least engage in a discussion.
2. They ignore it all.

At that point you'll at least have a much clearer picture of what your options are.

I agree with this. If they think not working but still spending as normal while eating into savings is acceptable, they'll never work again. I don't care if you partner is a man or a woman, to place such a huge financial burden on a partner and not even engage in conversations about it is just plain wrong.

Have you laid it clearly on the line for your spouse? As in straight out said that this attitude has caused you to lose all respect for them and start planning a divorce? If so do they still just walk away and refuse to discuss?

They won't talk about it what's left is action. Schedule with a solicitor and start to work out what you can do.

And unconscious bias isn't what it is. Recognition of structural sexism is what it is. Women on here are criticised for 'misandry' while the rest of the world goes on it's merry way being horribly sexist. If we behave 'equally' and the world is sexist, the result is sexism. Feminism is there to recognise that we don't start from parity.

FFS.

I repeat, women do not behave the way this spouse is behaving. Men do.

Sorry but this is completely sexist and untrue. I’ve seen it happen multiple times among acquaintances. And it is even in my own family.
My SIL refused to work from the day she got pregnant. My BIL begged her to work. She refused, said her life purpose was to have the baby then raise the baby and after that be a grandmother. He struggled constantly working extra jobs as they are working class. He had a heart attack and open heart surgery two years ago and was told to work fewer hours or risk dying. She has still refused to work.

Wow. A bit late now, but as a warning to others, I've always been taught the importance of having your own money. I wouldn't dream of having a shared savings account with someone else, spouse or not. Even my grandparents had their own separate accounts and money.

@MidnightMeltdown

Wow. A bit late now, but as a warning to others, I've always been taught the importance of having your own money. I wouldn't dream of having a shared savings account with someone else, spouse or not. Even my grandparents had their own separate accounts and money.

How does this help at all, the OP’s case? The money that’s being burned through is partly redundancy money - that wouldn’t be in OP’s account. And OP has explained that even if she had TOTAL control of the joint savings, they’d be going down now as there simply isn’t enough money coming into the pot. I agree everyone should have access to their own money, but it’s not a relevant observation here.

@bestcoffeepot I would ignore your friend and properly cost up divorce. The process isn’t necessarily expensive itself.

Would you come out with less money in a single person household? Yeah, probably. But I’d rather have full control over a lower sum, then live in a stressful shitshow with a higher sum. 🤷🏻‍♀️

You’re mortgage free, so I’m guess quite a lot of equity in your house. Possibly enough to buy a smaller / less desirable location outright. If not, you’re under 55 and you work, so big chunk of equity as deposit and small mortgage. You’ve got state pension, your own pension… and you might gain from pension with him equalising too. Plus the savings.
Cost it. Decide from a position of knowledge, not fear.

(Once you’ve ruled out whether this is a fear driven glitch that can be resolved, but it’s not sounding like it)

@PlanDeRaccordement

I repeat, women do not behave the way this spouse is behaving. Men do.

Sorry but this is completely sexist and untrue. I’ve seen it happen multiple times among acquaintances. And it is even in my own family.
My SIL refused to work from the day she got pregnant. My BIL begged her to work. She refused, said her life purpose was to have the baby then raise the baby and after that be a grandmother. He struggled constantly working extra jobs as they are working class. He had a heart attack and open heart surgery two years ago and was told to work fewer hours or risk dying. She has still refused to work.

Difference being that she probably did majority of housework & childcare which OPs OH is clearly not doing/has not done - OP stated that they themselves (god how awkward!) did majority and when kids were younger.

I do find guessing if OP is male or female is interesting but I don't think relevant to the rights and wrongs of the situation. No way should one partner decide to retire at the expense of the other.

Apart from university, perhaps you could ask your spouse to tell the children the things you can no longer afford to buy them like holidays.

You’re clear what you want: to minimise your further financial loss and ‘opportunity costs’. And that you think divorce at some point is inevitable.

See a lawyer! They will be able to advise you on the former aim.

The longer you subsidise your H the less money will be left for YOUR future and the DCs.

Less than ideal for the DCs, but they will be OK.

My father did similar - quit a job without prior discussion, with no job to go to, then was picky about what to apply for, 2 years unemployed.

mum - who wanted to and did stay married - was open with us that she was very angry with him and that his choices meant there would be much less money available for university expenses. We applied for grant (old times!) then loans.

It was actually a helpful eye opener: helped me understand the long term financial implications of marriage / having DC with someone. Value of money, retaining my own earning ability after DC.

And now, OP, time for the gender reveal!
Or should I say sex.

What it boils down is no one should subsidise someone else unless they're absolutely happy to do it. This works in all scenarios- male or female. Both sexes can be workshy. And looking after the house and kids etc.. is no excuse. Working people have to work on top of housework and organising children.

Thankyou to everyone for putting up with the gender neutral irritant. I know it makes one's brain have to work harder when reading such a thread.

I have raised the issue of anxiety/depression with OH. I've suggested taking a lower paid/lower stress job, a part time job or even vocational work (unpaid) but just get the silent treatment.

The kids know I am angry about it. They're bright and realise things won't be as comfortable. The youngest asked "if you get divorced, can we stay here in this house ?" The oldest already has a part time job in retail and can hopefully transfer to another branch in whichever city they end up at Uni. The others will have to follow suit, it won't be an option going forward.

I feel like a horrible person. If OH had say, an alcohol problem and wouldn't seek help then I'd feel less awful splitting the family up and leaving them to hit rock bottom on their own. If this turned out to be a genuine mental health issue then the whole in sickness and in health promise makes me look like a shitty person leaving to avoid them dragging the whole family down financially by opting out of working life in general.

I cry more and more, any time I'm alone now really. I'm a mixture of angry and scared.

@bestcoffeepot

Thankyou to everyone for putting up with the gender neutral irritant. I know it makes one's brain have to work harder when reading such a thread.

I have raised the issue of anxiety/depression with OH. I've suggested taking a lower paid/lower stress job, a part time job or even vocational work (unpaid) but just get the silent treatment.

The kids know I am angry about it. They're bright and realise things won't be as comfortable. The youngest asked "if you get divorced, can we stay here in this house ?" The oldest already has a part time job in retail and can hopefully transfer to another branch in whichever city they end up at Uni. The others will have to follow suit, it won't be an option going forward.

I feel like a horrible person. If OH had say, an alcohol problem and wouldn't seek help then I'd feel less awful splitting the family up and leaving them to hit rock bottom on their own. If this turned out to be a genuine mental health issue then the whole in sickness and in health promise makes me look like a shitty person leaving to avoid them dragging the whole family down financially by opting out of working life in general.

I cry more and more, any time I'm alone now really. I'm a mixture of angry and scared.

You aren't a bad person. Letting him take you all down in the name of sickness/health is not noble.

These are precarious times and you are at a stage in life where do-overs in terms of replenishing savings/assets get really difficult. You must preserve what you have.

There's also the disrespect. Where's his worry about the vows he made to honor you???

I get the paralysis someone in his shoes feels but you aren't some nosy stranger - you deserve answers and cooperation. Without that you are right to make plans to mitigate the damage.

Have you tried putting it in writing to your OH? The facts, what it means financially, and how it is affecting you?

I have a MH issue. It’s my responsibility to get treatment when it affects myself - including with respect to work - and others in the family. Being unwell MH wise is not an excuse to behave as your spouse is behaving.

Silent treatment is emotionally abusive. You’re not the one behaving badly here.

It doesn’t matter what others, beyond yourself and your DCs, think.

Your spouse’s behaviour is unreasonable. That’s on them.

Take action quickly to retain as much as you can of your savings.

OP you're not a horrible person. It must be terrifying to see your future dreams disappear before you and have to work longer because the person who allegedly loves you, expects you to bankroll their early retirement.

You can't go on as you are, so the only thing that may shock your DP into taking some action, is you starting the motions of separation.

Oh and please put us out of our misery is it an H or a W - doesn't matter either way, but it would be good to know.

We don't need OP to tell us it's a man.
There is a perception that mumsnet is full of man-hating feminists who can't possibly give an objective opinion if they know the sex of the person in question. Woman good, man bad. So in this scenario our opinions of the badly behaved spouse are only valid if we don't know he's a man.
It's bullshit.
He is being unreasonable and if a woman was behaving this way (which is extremely unlikely) then she would be unreasonable too.

I really think you need to leave them. They are being hugely unfair and selfish.
You can't live like this. It is already breaking you down. It will only get worse.