MLM Bot Watch 36 - Those who think it's ok to tell white lies soon become colourblind

[ReformedBot]

36 Lies to reel you in...

1. They will tell you that you will have time freedom in this business. Two weeks later they will tell you the business won't work unless you do.

When it's a business event they will not accept excuses for you missing it and will set an example by missing their child's first birthday or telling you a story of how they once shit themselves in white trousers on the front row at success day because they were poorly but didn't want to miss it.... You will know quickly that the unspoken rules is 'no excuses on success day's.

Please add your own below!

Thanks for that thoughtful post, Toobusy. I assume that you've encountered such damage - to all parties - first hand but to see it afresh and here is quite gutting.

@twenty I have to ask what do your children think of their mother’s involvement with MLM?

@Twenty I am so sorry that you and your children are dealing with this, and that your wife has been sucked so far in.

Does she go to all of the success days and team meetings? Has she managed to 'earn' a Chairman's Bonus cheque and gone on one of the fancy trips?

Yawnbot has been in for about as much time as your wife, have you drawn parallels between your wife's earnings and Yawn's? Point out that it's not how hard you work it's how quickly you can build a team and keep replacing those that have left. Yawn has been trying to recruit older people who are in lots of debt, which shows she has had to sell her soul to get where she is.

I agree with the counselling suggestions.

I am actually finding it really hard to offer advice. It's so obvious to us all here, yourself included, that she is and never will make money in FL. It's quite obvious, there are facts to back that up, plus her own experience at 8 years of getting nowhere and spending her own money trying to fake it.

Does she have any friends or are all of her friends in FL as well? Is there anyone close to her who may be able to talk some sense into her?

.... has been trying to recruit older people who are in lots of debt....

Dear Goodness.

Yes Cozie, unfortunately I have come across many people in Twenty’s position. Some of the things I hear are just dreadful. There is just no reasoning with people once they are deeply entrenched. Partners and friends become the enemy.

Leaving someone in this type of relationship is very very hard. I think it must be similar to leaving someone who has depression or a physical health problem. You know you need to leave them but you worry what will happen to them. You remember what they used to be like and you can’t help caring for them.

It is encouraging that she has taken on some freelance work and she must recognise, even on a very shallow level that she needs to make real money. I would be very concerned about what debt she may have run up and not told twenty about. In cases like this, it is when people split up that they realise the extent of the loans and credit cards. One man found his wife had built up about £500,000 of debt without him realising. She was a pretty high up bot that looked successful on the outside.

Thanks all for the advice, there is quite a lot to respond to, but I'll try.
In terms of FL and the kids, as far as they are concerned it is "a job Mummy does". I have always been careful not to denigrate or undermine what she does in front of them, as that would be unfair. The main issues have been around her forcing products on them, such as kiddie multivitamins stuffed with artificial sweeteners (which she otherwise would avoid like the devil), or slathering them in lotions that have been banned from resale because of links to contact dermatitis. Generally, she has (very reluctantly and with bad grace) conceded on those points, except the foul gloop that the company seems to hinge around (despite a study concluding that ingesting the stuff is not recommended, especially for children under 14). She is otherwise a great, affectionate and attentive mother, but there is a massive blind spot there (and an anti-vaccination obsession that has been a bone of contention- again, not in front of the kids).
We are not married, we have lived for twenty years in a flat rented from my family, she should therefore have no concerns about me being after her inheritance should we split, any arrangements involving her moving out would involve full access to the kids, neither would I expect any kind of maintenance should they live with me (which is the likelier outcome, given practicalities).
I have a feeling that the secretiveness about the inheritance is two-fold: telling me how much of it she has spent subsidising the FL would force her to confront in black & white how it's not working, and keeping the unknown quantity makes it harder to make practical plans for moving on.
In terms of friends, I think I said earlier that we stopped socialising much as I couldn't bear the constant promotion of FL to friends and strangers alike (I think a number of people quietly dropped the invites, I don't blame them). We have pretty much separate circles now; if any of 'my' friends who also knows her tried to raise this with her, I don't see it going well (I also find it difficult to raise, almost as though I'd be being disloyal- that's certainly how she'd take it).

Thank you, Toobusy. I seem to recall the story of the man you mentioned.

Thanks for that, Twenty. It took some courage to write all that, I'd guess.

You must disentangle the money ASAP, I feel. Whatever else happens.

@toobusy- I have also read the huge financial debt horror stories. In this particular case, I am confident that she is not in a massive hole (I am sometimes sorely tempted to take a peek in her folders, but it feels wrong). She has, however, been digging into her inheritance.
Her 'faking it' has been on a very modest scale. The 'goal board' that has been taunting me for years contains pretty mundane stuff, all of which we were able to afford before FL, and would comfortably have afforded were she on a minimum wage job (which she needn't be, she is competent and conscientious at whatever she turns her mind to - a godsend for the parasites at FL, as she will give it her all).

You still love her? Deep down?

Sorry.

It's probably very complicated.

@cozietoesie- too much crap has happened. When I found out that, as I was sitting there, distraught and trying to take in that my mother had died, she was typing 'woohoo, just been promoted to manager, so excited', I never felt so lonely. Something broke that cannot be fixed. When I raised this, she was defensive rather than apologetic.
No matter how much I think of her as a victim, and I do, that will never leave. She is fundamentally a good person, and a great mum to our kids, but I'm out...

@Toobusytowee - I am only too aware of the cultish stuff.
The initial love-bombing, the gradual indoctrination into a community with it's own, distinct values, the shutting off any (albeit mild) voice of criticism or caution, the "sacred texts" all initiates have foisted on them, the leader-worship, the rallies where a sense of collective hysteria and belonging are whipped up, testimonials of paths from darkness to enlightenment are endlessly repeated and the potential wealth on offer is paraded, the various gurus offering true paths to the promised land, the daily rituals and mantras that serve the purpose of reinforcing the message (as well as enforcing a level of sleep deprivation that will cloud critical jugement), the belief that all passes through development of the self towards the ideal, rather than a rational analysis of circumstances and fact (believe it enough and it will come true - if it doesn't, you need to work on believing it more)...
I have been aware of all for a long time. It's like watching a train crash that you are powerless to do anything about, as any attempt to raise concerns is not only dismissed, but strengthens and comforts the initiates vs detractors (haterz vs those who understand) dynamic. My OH always had a tendency of digging in her heels and not listening to the substance of what was being said if anyone disagrees, taking things ad hominem rather than dealing with facts, so fertile ground for this stuff.
It does amaze me how quickly the process takes hold. After the first FL rally she attended, I asked how it went; the response was "Oh, you'd have hated it, it was all a bit American style raah raah for my liking... but very inspiring..."

I hate the way these companies use your vulnerabilities against you

‘Identify your why’
‘Dream/ goal board’ at the first ‘coaching’ meeting, means you are then open to manipulation by your upline. Awful

I saw yawn’s post about how happy she was to scam some poor struggling retired people. She has absolutely no conscience the con artist.

@Norma27 - yes, even in the festering moral swamp that is the higher levels of MLM, she is special...

Good afternoon! Anyone on here who has experience of - or knows someone with experience of - losing money in a crypto Ponzi scam, please can you PM me (hun!)?

I’m thinking One Coin, S Coin, USI, MassCryp or any of the others that Wig/Sleaze/Broke’s Ex have pushed over the past 6 months.

Thank you!

This is an interesting post www.mumsnet.com/Talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/3195004-Gross-misconduct-AIBU-to-report-this-college-tutor?trending=1

@ladiva1971 That should come with a warning for those with high blood pressure.

That is disgusting, absolutely disgusting, I hope she goes to absolutely everyone she can and gets his arse fired. It's bad enough to do that to any young person, let alone a vulnerable one.

I'm absolutely livid on her behalf.

Ladiva I am livid about the thread you mention. I hope the OP makes sure the college hilights the risks of MLM loud and clear to their students and that heads roll.

@Ladiva1971 - Did I say swamp? It's a cesspit.

@twenty she really is special. Makes my blood boil yet makes herself to be some sort of victim of bullying. She is one of the biggest bullies of all.

It's absolutely vile, there need to be some serious investigation over this, knowing the poor lad is autistic, therefore very vunerable. MLM schemes should no way be allowed to infiltrate schools or colleges. Young people cannot be roped into believing that the only way to be successful is to invest X amount of money for a business in a box. My son is 18 and at college, and I would go fecking nuts if he came home with some MLM leaflets. I hope the OP of that discussion gets it sorted. I shall be following that thread with great interest.

While the tutor is not the victim here, hes been convinced to risk his job for his upline/top bot.

Hes probably been convinced that hes SAVING his students from JOBs and debt.

He'll be another casualty himself

I am looking forward to million$checkbots live @9, I am dying to know what he is doing. I shall have my ready.