I want to appeal CSA decision.

[Essexmumof3]

Ex and I split up 8 years ago - we had an arrangement for him to pay £300 a month maintenance for our DD which he kept to.
DD started secondary school in September and costs rose for lunches, school bus, trips and going out at weekends with friends etc... teenagers are expensive!!
I asked ex for more money to help but he said he couldn't afford it as he has a new wife and 2 other children.
I contacted the CSA and they have done an assessment on him and have come back with £14 a week maintenance !!! How can anyone cope on that? It's a joke - she costs me that a day. I asked them to look at it again and they have come back and said they believe the amount is correct but I can appeal if I want to.
If he could manage £300 a month before surely he shouldn't pay any less now - ex is saying he will pay what CSA want and no more but I can't meet the bills on £60 a month. I know his new wife works so they must have more income than that.
Has anyone else appealed a CSA decision? How does the system work? Is it enough to show what he was paying previously as proof he can afford more? Even if it goes back to £300 a month it would be better.

Well he now has more children.

Yes he has, but as he could afford that money he still can more children or not. His circumstances haven't changed.

Is he self employed?

If he is, it's pretty easy to hide income and he may be doing this to site you for rocking the boat and going to the CSA.

I get £30 a month to raise my son. It is a joke. If you disagree with their ruling they will ask you to provide evidence to back up your claims that he earns a lot more.

No - he is not self employed he works PAYE. His wife has her own company though - can he hide money there ?
How do I get evidence ?

Does she employ him?

That is how my ex does it. He is self employed - contracted to her company, bills her for minimal hours.

I don't know about evidence - I've not pursued it. It wasn't worth wasting my time on.

I think you have to prove that his lifestyle is beyond the means he is claiming to live on. So cars, mortgage, holidays I suppose but how you go about it I am not sure sorry.

Does he have DD overnight? This decreases the amount as does other children. Maybe just try talking to him - explain that that is a huge drop in income for you DD's needs and ask him to take over certain bills if he is unwilling to give you the cash?

Good luck

God - how do you manage on £30 a month ?

As far as I know (from ex pils) he doesn't work for her - but I cant be sure. Can the CSA look into that?
He doesn't have DD overnight - he doesn't see her at all - it was a bit messy when we split and I didn't think it was in her interest to see him - too confusing as she was only a toddler. Then he married his new wife and I didn't want her involved so no contact apart from cards and presents and the maintenance.
I have tried talking to him but he says I chose the CSA so that's what he will stick to.

Sorry to ask but why wasn't it worth your time?

I would get contact going again.
He might be more amenable to you then and agree to pay more than the CSA say.

Did you get advice before you went back to the CSA?

I'm a dad I'd have been devastated if my ex had stopped contact. So perhaps he feels a bit of 'it serves you right.'

I believe he should pay you 15% of his net earnings for one child, so this is what you should get. If £30 is much less than that then you'll have to appeal. Maybe write to your MP. You do realise that the CSA will soon be charging for their service don't you? That means your case will be closed and you'll have to pay up to £100 to reapply, then they'll also charge both you and your ex a monthly fee. Imo you'd have been better off sticking with the private agreement. £300 per month is a huge amount of money. I get £12.50 per month. Try coping on that.

Also fwiw I don't feel you had the right to stop him seeing his child when you split up, unless there was a genuine reason such as dv, drugs or abuse - in which case a court would have restricted contact or only allowed supervised contact. If your DD has just started secondary school and you split up 8 yrs ago, I'm assuming she was 3 or 4 and was at an age where she could have expressed an opinion about seeing him. Did your DD want to see him? Did you not think it would have been 'in her best interests' to keep as much contact as possible with her dad to keep her life as stable as possible, rather than to prevent her from seeing her altogether? And as for you not wanting your ex's new wife to have contact with your daughter, that's not your call to make. She's clearly not some fly by night girlfriend, it's his wife and they have children - your DDs half siblings which, because of your decision, she does not see . If you've ever had/have a partner over the last 8yrs have they met your DD? What's the difference between her meeting a DP of yours and meeting her dad's wife? Same thing, isn't it?

I'm sorry to be harsh but my ex has never seen my DS, despite my best efforts to get him to, and I would have loved for my DS to have a relationship with his dad. I know this isn't strictly what this thread is about but it gets on my nerves when women play god with their children's lives, usually just to get back at their ex after a 'messy' split, or because they are jealous and bitter that their ex has moved on. Two things I really detest are women who stop fathers from seeing their kids and fathers who don't take any responsibility for their kids. I know that contact and maintenance aren't (and shouldn't be) linked but part of me feels that this business with the money is karma. Sorry.

I agree with truckulente in that if you want to improve the financial situation, I'd suggest reintroducing contact. Then your DD can get to know her dad and half siblings (yes, and her stepmum!), and as time progresses her dad may be more willing to discuss increasing maintenance, so this would benefit both you and your DD in the long run. Also her dad would naturally start to pick up the costs when she's with him, which would take some of the financial pressure off you. Is reintroducing contact something you'd consider?

Have you looked at the CSA maintenance calculator here?
I had a quick look and for a parent with 2 children at home to pay £14 a week for a child they don't look after, they would be earning about £150 a week net. Does that sound right?

Sorry but I also think it "serves you right"

You've had a very generous agreement for the last 8 years. One which most LPs would kill for. I've had £50 for the last 8 years and yes my kids costs have gone up too since the eldest started secondary. This doesn't even cover my DD's lunch money but I'd rather have £50 per month than £0 per month.

But the ex isn't a magic wallet and give you as much maintenance as you think you need. There are rules in place to ensure he pays a "fair amount" based on his income. The "fair" bit is decided by the CSA if you cannot agree.

Now the CSA rules and a calculator have been on their website for years so the amount he would legally be entitled to pay should not have been a big surprise.

Also, I assume had they come back and awarded you say £400 a month you'd fully expect the ex to comply. So now he's supposed to pay less you are unhappy that he's complying with that.

If the shoe was on the other foot, what would you do? Let's say you are his new wife? Would you say "Go pay her what you used to." or would you say "Save £240 for ourselves"

In short you opened pandora's box and took a gamble based without looking into the facts and you lost.

Oh and for the record, the new wife's income is not taken into account. Why should she pay for your kids?

'prevent her from seeing him'. Damn phone.

Here's the correct link to the CSA calcultor

If he is PAYE then it is very difficult to "hide money".

You can appeal but appeals are not often successful as you have to have proof that he is earning more than he has claimed. Do you have this proof? Maybe he was paying the maintenance to you from his new partner's earnings? With you going to the CSA, they do NOT include her earnings. Only his. He will have provided wage slips and they would have done an assessment on them.

Unfortunately you chose to go to the CSA so he is fulfilling his "legal obligation".

Maybe he couldn't afford it before. It could be that their calculation is right, it's not as if he's self-employed and not being completely honest about his earnings. He'll have had to provide payslips.

Sorry, that's not much help. I don't get any maintenance but I've managed by increasing my hours at work and making sure I get all the tax credits/benefits I'm entitled to. Can you do anything like that?

Harsh again, sorry, but the way I see it is this is all of your own doing (the contact and child support part, just what you have written about) but you have stopped your child having a relationship with her father and now have cut her child support amount right down by pursuing the CSA because you demanded more money from the man who wasnt important enough to provide any more than financial support to her.

You took a risk in imagining that the CSA would increase payments. You lost that bet. As he's PAYE I seriously doubt any appeal would get anywhere unless you have proof that he's got additional undeclared income.

From what you're written it looks like you've treated your ex as nothing more than an annoyance with a wallet attached for years. Maybe if you had given him a smidge more consideration and not blocked all contact between him and his daughter then he'd be a bit more amenable now.

But what's done is done. As your daughter is getting older, is there any chance you could go for a higher-paying job?

Wow - I thought I might have got a bit more support or advice but it sounds like you all think I won't / shouldn't get anywhere with an appeal.
Regardless of whether my ex has contact she is still his daughter and he should support her financially - which isn't possible on £14 a week.
Why should it matter if his wife was helping to pay the maintenance before? Like I said they could afford it or it would have been reduced a long time ago. They should still be paying at least that amount not a whole lot less.
The reason our split was messy is because he left me for her. I was with him for 6 years then he left and in less than a year had married her. Yes I was upset and I didn't want my daughter to see her father with someone else. I also didn't want to have to explain why he married someone else and not her mother. That woman took my partner and my daughter's father so she should imo be paying for that.
He did get solicitors involved but he never took it to court so he couldn't have cared that much about contact or he would have tried harder. He is as much to blame for the non-contact as I am. I don't think my dd would want to see him anyway its been too long and she never seems bothered about it. I kept in touch with his parents and we occasionally see them but they won't get involved with regards to the money.
Softkittywarmkitty - you say the CSA will be closing all the cases - does that mean I can go back to the private arrangement then or do the CSA assessments still stand and are just paid privately ?
I think it is unfair that he has his wife bringing in money while I am left struggling. I gave up work to be a sahm when my eldest child (not his) was born and I haven't worked for 16 years so the chances of getting a job now are slim to zero.
Looks like I will just have to try an appeal and hope for the best anyway.

Surely when your children are older and you can't claim CSA, maintenance, child credits, child benefit etc. You'll have to get a job won't you? What would you live on?

Why should it matter if his wife was helping to pay the maintenance before?

I never said it should matter, I was just trying to think of a reason how he may have afforded to pay £300 a month for maintenance before you went to the CSA and the CSA don't take into account the new partner's income. So if that was the case, you were getting a good deal before.

Going back to your original questions :

Has anyone else appealed a CSA decision? Not personally, but have read many stories of people appealing.

How does the system work? The CSA wont do any investigating. They will expect you to provide them with the proof that he has more money than he has claimed on the assessment. His wife's money is of no interest to the CSA.

Is it enough to show what he was paying previously as proof he can afford more? No.

"I think it is unfair that he has his wife bringing in money while I am left struggling." - I really think you're thinking about this from the completely wrong angle. Your ex's current partner has no obligations towards you whatsoever. If she has her own company and earns well, then it sounds like she has probaly worked hard to get to that position. Why should she owe you any money? That's a really bizarre way to think about it.

Tbh I'm sorry to sound harsh but it sounds like you thought you could benefit from their lifestyle (including her's, as you have mentioned it more than once on here), and you have come unstuck. Incidently do you work, or do you have any additional means of increasing your contribution. £300 for one child, plus the child benefit and any other benefits you recieve as pwc, will presumably go pretty far towards meeting the costs of DD?

Did you ever have a csa case in the past? Just wondering whether somehow the case is on the old system and that's why gives an amount which you feel isn't directly related to his income in the way the new system is

Can see why you were upset at the split but you chose to avoid contact for your interests not the child's. You'll not find many people (mums or dads) who will support that motive.Parents break up, it happens but you put the child's interests first. Your child would not have worried about her dad moving on - unless you made a big deal about it.Some dads make a very conscious decision not to go to court - they don't want to prolong the hurt. It is not a measure of how much they love a child.

If you sprung the CSA on him then it's likely the assessment is fair. PAYE isn't possible to deny - he must not earn that much and as a dad he only has to be provide a proportion of his income - not all of it. If you are not working then you get help from the state, most likely in excess of what income he has. Please don't be bitter towards your ex - it really won't help you or your child. Try to talk to him but he does not need to be any fairer to you. I think if his wife has been supporting your daughter you should acknowledge that - My guess is she didn't have the opportunity to be a SAHM (which you did) so whilst you might not have the cash you have had time with your children. Sometimes life is about those choices. She made hers, you made yours.

Only way you can look at this is that you have the opportunity to learn from it. No point continuing to be angry. If all your children are at school age then there is an opportunity for you to work - agreed it's not easy but they is a way so don't give up

No I don't work I have been a sahm for 16 years. The maintenance I get for my older two children (different ex) and from the ex I am talking about here plus cb have been enough to pay the bills. But in september cb stopped for my eldest as he left school.
I really won't cope with a reduction to £60 a month and my other ex can't increase the amount he pays.
My children need me there when they come home from school and I have no skills so getting a job would be very hard after all this time. I could only do part time and I'd need all the holidays off because of the children.
This is the first CSA case I have had - was the old CSA different then ?

Oh and I do think his new wife has obligations towards my daughter - she was the OW and caused our split.

£300 a month is a 'good figure' so you were doing well but decided to go for more and as someone else has pointed out you'd have insisted the CSA enforce a higher figure so I think you need to respect this figure.

It's sad when a relationship fails and I can hear you blame him but ...tbh children need parents and blocking his contact was unforgiveable. Why do you think you should walk away with such a precious thing as a child and your ex should get debt?

Essex mum
You can work. Women work with small babies and are lone parents.
You wish to choose not to work which is a different issue. No judgement passed on that but you can work.

It may be hard to find work that suits but the first step is to stop assuming that you cannot work.

"My children need me there when they come home from school" - again sorry to sound harsh but that is a luxury that many parents, separated or otherwise, simply can't afford

You took a big risk going to the csa to get more than £300 and it has come back and hit you in the face, so to speak.

And the only people responsibl for financially contributing towards your child are their parents, not any new partners. Say for example you had left ex for new partner, would you feel that your new partner should fund your child while ex stays at home without a job and minds the kids after school, for example