Dissatisfied by expat life

[Froginboilingwater]

Our family lives in Asia as an expat, and I'm increasingly feeling that this isn't good in the long run. I wonder if I'm "wasting away" through lack of social contact, career opportunities and all the other things that add to a full life (hence my username).

To give a sense of our situation, I'll provide some background. DH, our two children, and I moved to Asia through his work. Prior to this, we spent five years living in Norway, also through DH's work. DH is German and I'm British, and he works for a big multi-national (albeit one headquartered in Germany). Materially we have a good life (free housing, good salary, schooling paid for, and we have built up a good financial buffer), but I feel like I may regret this in the long-run.

I knew when I got together with DH that this career was his dream, and to begin with, it was exciting. I met him in Germany, and I'm not averse to travel and seeing the world. There have been good things about being in Norway and now Asia, with some travel (which is now easier after Covid), so I don't want to knock it all.

I've been able to get remote work (I'm not allowed to work in the country) which also is quite interesting. I don't really have progression with it, but I can use to my technical skills to some extent. But I see former colleagues and friends getting promotions, and I can't help feel jealous.

DH can go into the office and meet with his German colleagues, will visit factories of suppliers around the country and has a demanding life. I on the other hand, work at home, and while I do things like go to the gym, or take my laptop to a cafe to do some work, I feel very isolated. Because of my remote work, I end up working late hours to have meetings after the children have gone to bed.

The other problem is that after our posting, the plan would be to go back to Germany, where I'd still be a foreigner. Living overseas, I don't get an opportunity to really practice German at any great level, and I don't feel I'm integrating or building a network in Germany. I feel at this rate, I'll always be an outsider, a ghost, whether I'm in Germany, or on another posting.

I look at British expat groups, but it seems very much about wives going for cocktails in the middle of the day (sorry if that seems unfair), and that's not me. I have technical skills.

I love my DH, I value his career, I realise it's important to him, but with all this, I also feel a little distant from his. We have two very different experiences of our expat life, and I don't know if I can do this for another 20-30 years.

Are there positive steps I can take to change my mindset, or is the problem simply too great? I wanted to post here because I think in AIBU/Chat, I'd get responses of "go home", but here, there are people who have lived the expat life, and like me, do see the benefits and drawbacks.

OP, if you are in China, could you not obtain permission to teach English? Either ad hoc as a conversation tutor one to one, or in a school or adult ed centre? Unless things have changed a lot since Covid (I appreciate they might have done) there were loads of opportunities to do this a few years ago. It was something DH and I were considering doing for a year once DC had left home. You could at least study for an online TEFL or EFL qualification, if there is no TEFL centre near you,. which would be useful in every country you move to.

I had the same life, this is what I’d do differently, all opinions purely my own:
• Don’t do more studies. You’re already well qualified. Know that UK has changed and you could arrive here in your late 40s/50s if you needed to and get a good job in your field. All sorts of big employers have Returner programmes for the sake of diversity. Hold onto your field even if tempted to deviate. Have seen so many women change and results mediocre.
• Prep and take German GCSE or German state equivalent. As a PP said Germany is a super place right now and somewhere you could have a nice future. Don’t do Mandarin unless you find an exceptional non-native teacher or BF, and even then huge time drain.
• Buy property jointly with your DH. Norway or Germany or Switzerland, somewhere to come home to which is also luxurious between postings or in summer. Also look at city centre apartments to buy. A great project and laying down memories for DC.
• It’s a facile comparison to compare your career to DH’s, don’t. There are 8 billion other people in the world. Take a step back and just compare it to your field and where you plan to be. You have ample time to work 10 or 20 years in your field later.
• Don’t underestimate hormones. I did and really overlooked their impact on how I felt and my outlook on the world, home etc.
• Travel to Japan, S Korea, wherever in Asia you love, so worth when in Asia.
• Invest your time, energy, love in DC and their paths and interests and skills and education. Their world is so competitive and you’ll be grateful you’ve done this when they get to uni age.
• Sometimes highly educated women really overthink things, constantly planning on improvements and tweaks and changes. There is alot to be said by being less hyper-aware and deliberately resisting these urges, and just get up each morning do the job and continue. Alot of men get on well in life by being more of that tendency. Purely my own view and I don’t
expect everyone to agree.
• Make a few Chinese BFFs, esp if your children are also friends.
• Do not on any account underestimate the value of your family’s regular and very high income. Have a very clear, ongoing financial plan with your DH for investing all this. Be frugal. Enjoy having a lot of savings. Have seen many leave this enticed by “consulting” and the lack of regular, very high pay packet is a big loss and difficult to recuperate that situation once lost.

@venetiane , thanks for the advice. Without outing yourself, what did you do? Did you go back to the UK or stay in Asia?

Asia - beautiful EU country - Asia. Not London, due to safety concerns and general dirtiness and poor public services (when you’re used to a beautiful EU country or Asia ifkwim). However, know that UK is where your A levels / Degree / CV will be best understood & welcomed even in future decades, I think.

@midsomermurderess - “charging off dead ends like bewildered wildebeests” - Brilliant 🤩. Thank you- but sadly your post is very true and explains why people wanting respect for themselves or others seem to be inapable of treating users with even basic good manners

I think you probably need to get to the bottom of your dissatisfaction. You could do plenty of studying/working/volunteering in your situation. I was an expat for 6 years and an expat “wife” for 6 weeks….the novelty soon wore off of the 11am gins and brunches. There will be other communities doing other things/interests/hobbies so maybe engage with them?
for me i realised it wasn’t all about the easy expat life/money ….I wanted to come home, and be near my parents as they were getting older. I wanted to have kids growing up in the U.K. and replicate my childhood…not international school and drivers/nannies.
I still toy with the idea of going back expat every now and then. Pros and cons. I think it’s tough when you feel you’re giving up such an “easy wicket”

They are crying out for teachers in many regions of China. Could you sit a CELTA/TEFL and go in to English language acquisition teaching in an international school a couple of days a week? Schools will arrange the appropriate visa for expats however I’m not sure of the process over there and if it can be applied for if you’re already in the country. If it can, it could help you to meet a wider circle of people and forge a greater sense of identity there before you move back in a few years. Could even look into an IPGCE if you are skilled and/or trained in a teaching subject area. Might not be for you or even possible at all, but could be an avenue worth exploring.

I was a trailing spouse for a decade. With dh’s first posting, I didn’t integrate and we were only there 6 months. It was pretty lonely, no other trailing spouses from the company and I quickly realised I needed to do things differently.

The next time, dh was involved in a new start up with several trailing spouses, a couple of Brits, Americans etc. This was in Germany, pre kids. I did love it there. I studied German part time and through language schools, taught English part time to adults and found a good friend through teaching. The neighbours were friendly.

Germans tend to warm to you slowly and decide if they truly want to be friends so I didn’t really have many German friends, more acquaintances as I didn’t have the time to properly network. Had we stayed there, I could have progressed with the teaching as the pay was better than I’d anticipated but would have proved difficult with children as I worked various hours, including 7.30 am starts, driving round here and there until I started to pick up training work, going off to train at a hotels in Germany or abroad for large companies. Of course, we then moved again so that put paid to that.

My German was pretty good in the end. I was at the language school all morning in class lessons and met some interesting people from all different countries. None were trailing spouses but several were mothers so they fitted this in whilst the children were at school. The pace of the first level, Goethe Institute Grundstuffe, was rather slow as many only had a basic education. But it was worth it for the experience. Perhaps had I gone into the city, it would have been faster, which I did for the Mittlestuffe and I didn’t end up completing as we left. The pace was faster, a different demographic, with more of a college vibe.

As for women, mothers working, we lived in a village and a couple of our female neighbours did have good jobs. I forget doing what as this was 20 years ago. Another was an artist. I know at least one of these women had family support and the artist had adult children. Dh’s company also employed local women at the start up, which became Global Head Office for the client. The idea was start up with key players, who then moved on with locals replacing them. Then there was me, a TEFL teacher, who did earn a lot of respect from the various companies I worked for.

Whatever you do in Germany, it is easier when the kids are older. German schools of any age just seem to send kids home if there is no teacher or some other reason and expect you to be there, even now, from what I’ve read on MN. Children walk to school from very young primary alone and I was also surprised that school was predominantly early mornings and done by late lunchtime even in secondary. It may be different with international schools.

As for now, you’ve had a lot of advice. I would say integrating more would be beneficial to avoid the loneliness. I know you have work colleagues but it’s remote. Don’t knock the lunching circuit too much. I went on the odd one with the expat neighbours at one location. I’d have been bored stiff regularly but all these things serve a purpose. It’s perhaps also much easier in Asia in a way to integrate without your dcs as childcare possibilities, I imagine, where you are are easier to find than in Germany.

You’ve had some more up to date advice for integration as everything we did was very much face to face. We also loved in various European locations rather than further afield so I won’t even try. Above all, show some self care and be kind to yourself, as that will get you through the difficult times.

I do and have heard expat to describe Asians (and others!) in the uk if they are brought over by their company. For example Toyota had a reasonably large Japanese expat community. Go look at the international schools, there will be expats all over.

There isn’t a large expat community in the uk as the uk has a highly skilled workforce available and companies have to justify bringing overseas people in.

I will also question your thinking, why did you go straight to someone from overseas working in a manual job (builder) rather than equivalent skill level eg computing, finance, management, engineer, scientist?

Retires to Spain are immigrants (everyone has agreed in this) the fact some of them call themselves expats is on them.

The grass is not always greener. Loneliness can be tackled. I don't see it as a reason to throw away your marriage or for DH to give up a good career he enjoys. Plenty of threads on here about British people finding it difficult to make friends in adulthood. I'd say your working hours are part of the problem, so maybe go part time. Or look at getting a remote job for another company, one where you can stick to what are daytime hours in your current country of residence. You might "only" be there for a set period but it doesn't sound as though you're trying to integrate properly either with locals or expat community. Nothing is perfect but you have a good standard of living and a good marriage. Lots in the UK don't have that. The UK is struggling, all it's systems are knackered and it's society is broken IMO. People are largely selfish, there's lots of misery and moaning. Lots of jealousy, laziness and nastiness. Lots of great people as well who are happy and living their best lives, but those ones are also likely to be too busy to be actively looking for new friendships or have the time to put in to new people. I don't think you'd feel any less of an outsider here TBH. Get yourself a private pension though.