Schenk ein den Wein - as autumn comes to Germany and Austria

[LinzerTorte]

Der Nebel steigt, es fällt das Laub;
schenk ein den Wein, den holden!
Wir wollen uns den grauen Tag
vergolden, ja vergolden!

A thread for all those living in Germany and Austria, and anyone else who would like to chat.

Always good to have an excuse to open some , and this poem seemed quite appropriate!

That made me laugh too Canella and 5more! Actually, a friend and I used to call it Bus- und Bett-Tag when we were in Berlin as we decided that was how we should spend the day.

I like bus and bed day better than prayer and repentance day though

Sorry a very quick post

am useless in German and ds has hit more problems at school

do I stand back and let dh deal with the teacher

any ideas
sorry to gatecrash the tread again,

Just back from the school run - I drove the girls to school today as DD1 is giving her talk about London and so had a huge poster to take in.

Yesterday evening was interesting; it was at our primary school, and representatives from the three secondary schools each introduced their school. The headteacher of the neue Mittelschule gave a really good presentation but as for the two representatives from the Gymnasien... let's just say that the NMS is looking like the increasingly attractive option! People were just laughing in a slightly embarrassed/shocked way at some of the things they came out with. It was things like "The vast majority of teachers at our school are very good but we do have two who are a bit schrullig" or the way that one of them suddenly started talking about Wiederholungsprüfungen (I didn't quite get why it was so funny, but it definitely came across in a negative way).

I wasn't overwhelmingly impressed with the babysitter either, who was very monosyllabic - she didn't say a single word to the DC while I was there, although she did speak to them while I was out apparently. The main thing that annoyed me, however, was that I told her (twice) that the DC should go to bed at around 7 pm, that the girls could read for half an hour in bed but that DS was already tired so would probably go to sleep straight away. We got back at about 8.15 pm to find them all still up! I was too shocked to say anything (and also didn't see the point as we won't be using her again), but I still can't quite understand why she just ignored my instructions. I wasn't so concerned about the girls as it's often gone 8 pm by the time they fall asleep, but DS was ridiculously tired this morning.

Canella What's the U9? And what's a kann kind - is it a child who can start school but doesn't have to? My German friend here keeps thinking that I sent DD2 a year early (she turned 6 in July and started school in September), but children have to start school the September after they've turned 6. DS will also be one of the youngest in his class when he starts school, and sounds quite similar to your DS in that he's very bright but lacking in concentration, and he's not at all interested in sitting down and writing or even colouring in (his KiGa teacher has already said that he might have problems with his fine motor skills at school - he just can't hold a pencil properly at all and refuses to let us help him).

5more The Oxford Reading Tree series is great, isn't it - I've read a few negative things about it on MN but DS loves it. We've got the first 5 levels and DS got up to level 2, although we haven't looked at it for ages. He can recognise quite a few words and is often asking what things say, so I don't feel like I'm forcing him (although Austrians are a bit about children reading before school). However, considering the nightmare we had with reading when DD1 started school and how easy it was with DD2 in comparison, I really think that being able to read gives them a head start and means you have time to concentrate on other things with them (not necessarily school things, but I can already see that it will be writing in DS's case).

x posts Cinders - I've just sent you an e-mail about schools etc. I think that one problem with schools here is that (to generalise) they very often don't see the children as individuals and everyone is expected to work at the same pace, so anyone who doesn't quite fit in will struggle.

It's also difficult when you and your DH have differing opinions; DH and I have quite a lot of "discussions" about exactly how much extra work parents need to do with their children and have basically agreed to disagree (I begrudgingly let him get on with it as I suppose he knows the system better). What does your DH think you should do about the problems at school?

Forget the bus part, I'll stick with bed day!

Only one night feed again last night! Although poor DS had quite painful wind half an hour after he finished feeding and would only settle upright on my chest while I walked around the bedroom so my day started at 4am - 5more how do you cope with 5am every day?! He is having a lovely snooze on my chest now which makes everything ok again. I feel a bit silly moaning as he really is such an easy (if clingy, but that's ok) baby. He's not really a screamer so when he does have a good scream about something I feel really bad. He seems to save his worst screams for when he has taken a quick break during a feed & has gone for all of 10 seconds without a nipple in his mouth. Priorities I guess.... :)

Cinders Sorry I can't offer any advice on the school issue. I hope things work out for you and DS and that it is nothing too serious.

Linzer Maybe the babysitter was a pain on purpose because you said Du What a pain! Definitely best to find a new sitter for next time.
How strange about the 2 Gymnasien. Surely they must have realised? Maybe they were trying too hard to come across as laid back to make themselves a more attractive prospect?

You may well have hit the nail on the head, Later. I think we'll ask our teenage neighbour next time; at least she managed to actually put the DC to bed! (The fact that the one last night arrived without anything to do when the DC were in bed should possibly have set alarm bells ringing.) And yes, the headteacher of the first Gymnasium did say that she wasn't going to try and compete with apples (the NMS handed them out) or slide shows and that she didn't need to as they had six 1. Klassen!

Btw you are perfectly entitled to moan if you have a clingy baby and your day started at 4 am. I moan about school closing on random days that aren't bank holidays (and that's after a good night's sleep), but then I'm just selfish.

DD2 and DS are starting an ice skating course this afternoon; unfortunately the Saturday morning course was already full so we've got yet another thing to fit in during the week. I tried to persuade DD2 to do a course next winter instead but she was desperate to start one now (I think it's Peppa Pig's influence); she keeps going round saying, "Push, push, glide! Push, push, glide!"

Ah at least she was honest! Not a great sales pitch though - I'm not going to bother ase are popular enough already.

I haven't been ice skating in years. My mum ended up with a mangled wrist, held together with pins, & 4 months off work at the beginning of the year after just having steppd on the ice in her brand new ice skates! I think she is a little scared of trying again this year.

After a breakfast of pretzel M&Ms (a Canadian thing, I think, VERY moreish) and a nice cheese & chutney sandwich & a yoghurt for lunch, not to mention the endless cups of tea, I'm feeling a lot perkier and less moany. I managed to distract DS on his playmat (a godsend) while I ate my sarnie & he has started trying to roll onto his side. His poor zebra rattle was punched in the face a few times in the process & Nemo received a swift kick in the chops, but he will get there soon!

*as we are popular enough already

I would say du to a 13 year old Linzer, but I know nothing :) My German is so botched together that people seem to forgive me saying du to anyone but a fully adult total stranger tbh. I would feel odd saying Sie to a teen though. Silly babysitter - I have never left the DC with a babysitter but mine are younger - I have been thinking that at some point, when H is older, we could ask the oldest sister of one of dd's friends, she lives down the road and has been doing her work experience (I can't spell the proper German word) at DS's KiGa. I think she is 18, I say du to her mum and dad and I nod and say hallo to her regularly in passing but haven't really ever chatted to her , so I wonder what I would be meant to say to her???

My older 2 ice skate - dd did the Schnuper course (just 4 lessons) when she was 4, and this is her second winter of enrolling for the full season of weekly lessons - she is quite good (considering she is 6 and only goes once a week from November to March) - rollerblading in summer helps them keep up the skill it seems, as she hadn't regressed over summer this time. DS1 has just started the Schnuper course - he wants to play ice hockey he says! He was a little put out to have to learn to skate without a stick and puk first . Hopefully he will take to it too though as it is a good Sunday morning activity through the winter months, Sundays tend to be a bit depressingly nothing in winter so I am glad of the activity, but I don't know if I'd encourage it if it were a week day thing!

Yay for baby nearly rolling Later - at least you don't have to suddenly start a no Playmobile to be left on the living room floor from now on campaign (I assume ) - that is what Henry starting to roll initiated :).

DD is meant to be doing her hw but keeps distracting herself, better supervise properly...

Hello. I've been lurking but you disappeared off my list again. The baby is keeping me up at night a lot and I have been consequently not getting enough sleep. When I say 'get things done' 5 more, I mean emptying the dishwasher and clearing the breakfast dishes, not cleaning the house ! In fact I am about the house really and it is getting me down. As is the bfing and the amount of times he is biting me really hard! It is making me think of giving up, or at least restricting it to only in the house as it is embarrassing when we are out.
I'm glad you thought the same way about the lace up shoes as I did Linzer! I thought it was a bit ambiguous. I do think getting the kitchen sink cleaned is a good step though. Now I really want to declutter the playroom before Christmas...
Haven't got our winter tyres on here and it is supposed to snow tomorrow, though the summer ones are brand new. Hope it is ok!
Went to Muffins with Moms at dd's school this morning. Doughnuts with Dads was last month! Was quite nice really!
Baby is now crawling all over the place so have to keep a beady eye out all the time. He is quite happy entertaining himself with opening the TV cabinet and sorting through the DVDs!
Hope you are all having a lovely evening!

Lol jenny, reminds me of my 2 when they were 1 they used to love getting the videos out and making a pile on the floor then trying to shove them all back in again and we never had the right video cassette in the right cover!

Oh dear, dd is watching high school musical and it's well past her bedtime. She's had her hair cut today so has spent an hour infront of her mirror trying ways to wear head bands or hair clips. Tomorrow morning will be very difficult if her hair doesn't go right.

All the ice skating sounds good - it's on offer here but we wouldn't fit it in with all the school work. Well, sorry if it snows tomorrow but we've got the tyres on so it can come if it has to..!

Had a great time ice skating in the end; I was very wobbly to start with, but got back into it after a while. The fact that I didn't have any children holding on to me definitely helped; DD1 met up with a couple of friends and skated round with them while the other two did their course. It's quite an expensive business, though; apart from the cost of the course itself (it's 12 weeks so twice the price of the 6-week course on Saturday mornings, which would have been long enough tbh), there's the entrance to the rink for all four of us (DS has to pay too now that he's 5) plus the cost of hiring three pairs of skates. The DC all have their own but DD2 and DS need skates with Zacken (the serrated bit at the front of the blade) for the course, which of course their cheap Lidl ones don't have. I'm thinking of treating myself to some skates with the Intersport voucher that some friends gave me for my birthday - it would just about cover a pair I've got my eye on.

Muffins with Moms sounds good, Jenny. Baking always seemed a very sociable activity in the States; my baby group did a cookie exchange one Christmas, which was great and kept us going for weeks (and I still make the thumbprint cookies that I baked for it most Christmases).

5more I think with an 18 year old where you say du to her parents, you could probably get away with saying du to her as well. I would often forget to say Sie to people when we were living in Germany as we always used the du form at work (which meant saying du to total strangers, the bosses - even quite high-up ones, etc.); I remember feeling quite embarrassed when I said du to the woman we dealt with at the bank (who was about the same age as us, so it felt like she was someone I would normally say du to!).

Later Glad to hear the nice food and endless tea helped cheer you up; DH always laughs about a cup of tea being the answer to every problem in Britain. Can't believe your DS is starting to roll over already - is he doing so very early or is he older than I think? I'm getting confused now that there are quite a few babies on the thread!

jenny my house is the same, I still invite kids over for the kids but am reluctant to invite adults in atm! I have met an American lady from a couple of villages away - native English speakers are a rare commodity here, and she has a baby almost the same age as my youngest. She invited me to hers twice so I had to invite her back here, I had downstairs in an acceptable state, but what does dd do immediately she arrive but invite her 2 year old upstairs to see her room, the mum worries about the stairs so immediately goes with her - upstairs was an absolute shocking state of course ! I never go upstairs in other people's houses unless invited to have "the tour" as I assume lots of people don't manage to have upstairs in visitor-viewable condition... wonder if I'll ever hear from her again!

How old is your baby now? 8 or 9 months? If the bf is getting you down there is certainly no harm in cutting it right back now I would say! I only managed 7 months with DS1 even though he fed fine and I had no discomfort or supply problems or anything, mainly due to dd, who was 2.5, being a total demanding pain every time I sat down to bf tbh! Also though he had been having some formula since I was unexpectedly admitted to hosp when he was 4 months, and so I knew he was much less sicky on formula - no idea why, because it is thicker maybe?

I went to bed at 9 but DS1 woke at 11 with croup and we are downstairs watching Whinnie the Pooh to keep him calm - he was in a right state when he woke up, barking and wheezing and gasping for breath, and was sick everywhere. He is prone to croup, although he last had it in spring, so we know that if we calm him down he is OK. He only wanted me though, DH did get up and try to take him when DS2 woke too and started howling, but DS1 clung to me (and DH is also not good with sick) so DH tried to calm DS2 instead, but he just howled louder - so once DS1 was lceaned up and a bit calmer I took DS2 from DH (stopped crying instantly...) and have both boys down here with me, and neither will go back to sleep... :( ho hum... At least DS1 seems mostly OK now, breathing a bit loud and wheezy but much better, and not barking/ coughing

admylin hope dd has a good hair day tomorrow! One of dd's friends had her waist length, thick blond hair cut to a bob just before starting school, sad in a way but it really suits her the way it is now, though she suddenly looks a lot more grown up!

Linzer everything seems expensive where you are! DS's ice skating is only a 3 week schnuper course for ?20, dd's runs every Sunday from beginning of Novemeber to end of March for ?70 - they are one hour lessons and nobody has to pay admission to the rink if they are doing a course. I just watch as I always have baby with me, but I can't skate anyway - always said I'd learn once DS1 was old enough to do the course, as I used to always have him with me, but then I had DS2 - same applies to skiing!

Will my boys ever doze off? Not quite sure what to do - DS2 was in the travel cot but I tripped over a toy going to get DS1 a drink and crashed to the ground, waking him, and can't get him to go back to sleep with Ds1 up and the TV on, but don't want to leave DS1 alone to settle him upstairs...

yawn...

Oh dear, 5more I hope you managed to get some sleep in the end. Your poor ds1 it's so painful when they have to cough so much that they're sick. I bet his back is aching and his tummy from all the coughing. Ds was prone to croup when he was smaller, we had him tested for asthma and we were constantly giving him mucosolvan from the doctor. The most soothing thing for him was a hot water bottle on his tummy and someone to rub his back.

Sounds expensive business linzer - in a way it's like the Freibad in summer if I remember you saying it costs a fortune to get in. Has anyone been to the cinema lately with dc? It's also getting expensive especially if they beg for popcorn or are dying of thirst and absoloutly need a drink. Officially you're not allowed to take food and drinks in to the cinema but I usually smuggle some Capri sun and sweets in my bag.

This morning at 6.30am dd came to me and told me that her gerbil just died. It had just bit her finger too. That's the 2nd one to go so we've got to organise a double burial somehow (the first one is in the freezer still) as I haven't found a big enough plant pot. Actually I'm going to try and talk her into asking if she can bury them in her best friend's garden. What do you all do with deceased pets?

5more Yes, I think we must be in an expensive area! DH always says we could buy a villa where his parents live for the price of our terraced house here (not that there are any villas in the area where his parents are - plenty on our road, though). I was quite shocked when I added up what the course is costing us; the lessons alone are ?150 x2 for 12 weeks. I'm not sure whether I could get away with not paying for entrance to the rink if I was just accompanying the DC, but I paid yesterday as I was intending on going skating too.

Have just posted on another thread (which you've both posted on as well 5more and Later - the one about moving to Germany), which made me wonder whether it's possible to bring up truly bilingual children. Your DD's English must be more native sounding than the English that my three speak, Later - mine definitely have a slight Austrian accent, use German words in their English, often use German grammar/constructions (DD2 said to me this morning "I want that you..." and I think that most native speakers could tell they're not growing up in the UK. This is despite the fact that I only ever speak English to them, they watch English TV (more than German) and read English books (although DD1 reads more German; with DD2, it's about equal).

I used to work with an English woman who had grown up in Germany and, despite the fact that both her parents were English, she had a German accent - I could never understand why, but do now. Maybe the main difference is that our home language is German (although I do speak to the children in English when I'm addressing them individually); it just feels strange and unnatural for me to speak English to DH (as we met in Germany) - plus I'm not sure I would want the DC to be exposed to his accent.

Sorry to hear about the gerbil, admylin - your poor DD must be very upset. We had some fish a while back which died when we went away for the weekend (I think someone must have overfed them) and we buried them in the garden; DD1 made a little cross for them.

Haven't been to the cinema for ages but I've got to go and buy some cinema vouchers this afternoon as DD1 has been invited to a birthday party tomorrow (actually a trip on the tram into Vienna to visit the Naturhistorisches Museum) and the two girls (they're triplets) would apparently like cinema tickets.

My dc speak German alot in the house and anyway all their school work is in German but when they do speak English they don't have a German accent. They'll watch dvds in English and I'd say 50% of their books are English. They only became bilingual at Kindergarten so maybe the first 3 or 4 years of just English helped?

Ds has a friend from UK in his class but when he comes here they speak German together although the boy always speaks to me in English!

Yes, I'm sure the first three or four years do make a big difference - the DC's English was better than their German (far better in DD1's case) until they started KiGa, when their German gradually started to overtake their English.

I never really notice their accent myself (only in occasional words) but English friends have mentioned it on several occasions. I didn't believe the first friends who commented on it, esp. as we had other friends to stay about a week later who said, "no, they don't have an accent," but a few more people have mentioned it since then so I suppose there must be something in it! And I have three or four English-speaking friends whose DC all have slight-but-definitely-there Austrian accents, so it's not uncommon.

How old is your baby now, Jenny? If it helps, I class emptying the dishwasher & hanging the washing as getting things done these days too (and I don't even achieve that most days).
Muffins with Moms & Doughnuts with Dads sounds like a nice idea.

Admylin How did the hair styling go?

Linzer DS is 2 months old today (9 weeks on Sunday). He can't quite roll yet but is having a good go! I think it will be a little while before he manages it.
Treat yourself to some skates - it was your birthday, after all.... :)

5more Our flat is an absolute state at the moment. We just about manage the absolute bare minimum of clean clothes, plates & cutlery & baby stuff. Everything else has been totally neglected. If someone announces they are coming to visit we swing the hoover around & hide the pikes of paperwork & general clutter and that's as far as it goes.
So much for my idea whilst pregnant that I would clean & possibly even bake while the baby slept. Ha!
I hope your boys dozed off in the end & that you might even manage a few minutes of shut-eye yourself today.

I was so slow typing that last post that loads of new posts appeared once
i finally sent it!

Sorry to hear about your DD's gerbil, Admylin. She must be really sad having lost both of them in such a short time :(

admylin Sorry to hear about the gerbil. We´ve not had any pets die so far, but when I was a child our cats got buried in the garden. I must say I can´t remember what happened to the hamsters and gerbils, so presume my parents probably just threw them away.

5more I hope you managed to finally get some sleep. Ds also suffered from croup, but luckily grew out of it by the time he was 3 or 4.

Linzer I must admit that I can´t hear my dcs accents, but when we are in England people often say they they have a German accent. On the other hand, people here say they have slighty English accents, so I don´t know quite what to believe. They both also use some German sentence constuctions when speaking English. It took me about 3 years to stop dd saying " I want it not," instead of "I don´t want it." It drove me insane.

Later I´m glad you got the feeding sorted out.

jenny Did the snow arrive? It´s been cold enough for snow here, but we´ve actually had blue skies and sunshine for most of November. Today it´s drizzling, but I think the forecast is for more sun for the rest of the week.

We went to visit friends in Stade at the weekend. Unfortunately dh developed a really nasty cough over the space of a few hours and felt really ill and then the friends daughter started being sick and we all ended up going to bed at 9:30pm and no-one managed to get any sleep. A bit of a disaster all round. On the positive side, I think the dc have avoided coming down with the sickness bug. I´m another one who just can´t deal with sick, so always leave it to dh.

i hope everyone has a great weekend.

Just got in from the doc - DS's croup flared up again around 3am, and when DH came down at 6am we decided to give him the emergency suppository the hospital gave us when he had it really badly at 18 months - it worked but I took him straight to the docs after dropping dd at school (we were too disorganised for her to make it to the bus for 7am this morning, plus she was claiming her bag was extra heavy...) had to wait a bit but he saw us without an apt, I mainly just wanted a replacement for the suppository just in case he gets it badly again, and we have that plus confirmation his lungs are clear. I got about an hour's sleep last night I think - Ds1 got a bit more but DS2 decided to be awake whenever DS1 wasn't! I think I will sleep tomorrow... no prospect before as both boys slept to and from docs in the car and are wide awake, and dd will be home in an hour and a half!

admylin so sorry about the gerbil. We had a guniepig that died, and we buried it in the garden - dd was 3 at the time and marked the spot with a large stone. We have tropical fish, an inevitably one dies every so often, but they go in the bin! DS1 did ask to keep one he had been attached to in his bedroom after it died! I am not sure if I did the right thing explaining it would rot... he seemed ok about it, though sad - some of the fish they don't really care either way about but they are attached to others... We have rabbits now and one is a rescue one we brought from the uk, who is quite old, we don't know exactly how old but he was a mature adult when we got him, over 5 years ago - l hope he doesn't die over winter as I don't fancy trying to dig a hole in the icy earth - how heartless of me!

I take my kids to the cinema relatively often, have been 4 times in the 6 months since H was born - we usually go on a Monday afternoon, as it is "Kino Tag" and only ?3 a film - and I just don't offer to pay for H, who I always have in tow, and have never been asked to - guess that will change as he starts looking more like a toddler than a baby, which will be soon... We have an established tradition that the kids get a small Apfelschorle between them and 5 sweets each from the pick and mix, which works out at under ?5 and makes the whole thing a proper expedition and treat without being expensive I think (I have a bottle of water for myself in the changing bag ). I really like taking the kids to the cinema and sometimes I take one of dd's friends along too, other mums seem to think I am a bit mad for taking 4 relatively small kids, but I find the kids always behave really well and perceive it as a huge treat, and kids films in German are about the right level for me to follow! I did make the mistake of taking them to Toy Story 3 on a Saturday, and it was only available in 3D which they charge extra for - that was a bit of a shock price wise, significantly more than double the ?9 for 1 adult and 2 paying kids, that we usually pay on a Monday!

Later I am glad I am not the only one just doing bare essentials in the house - laundry and dishwasher do get done, I empty the dishwasher while the kids eat breakfast at 6.30am (baby has toast as finger food now, and I feed him some baby rice after dd has gone for the bus), everyone has to put their own stuff in through the day and I switch it on before I go to bed - it's the only way that works for me, the minimal work way I find. DD and DS can be persuaded to clear up toys from the floor and hoover in return for star chart stickers, but that is only the living room, hall and kitchen, the hoover rarely makes it upstairs atm! DH does no housework at all tbh, but the big kids do a bit in return for bribes Cleaning bathrooms and putting away the clean laundry are the things I need to keep on top of better!

Boys were playing nicely but DS2 is starting to whinge now, think he is about due a feed anyway...

Oh no, Hupa - I hope your DH feels better & that the bug hasn't spread.
I have a friend from Stade too but I've never been there (I knew him in the UK & he has since moved to Hamburg).

5more I hope your DS is a little better now. I have to admit to being completely ignorant about croup so am off to google it now. Sounds nasty!
I'm considering just closing my eyes when I go in the bathroom now! I give everything a wipe down when I shower in the mornings (I jump in the shower while DS is still asleep & DH is still in bed - I feel like a complete zombie if I don't shower even though I realise it's a complete luxury with a tiny baby) but the floor is in desperate need of hoovering & mopping. I pop a wash on in the mornings but quite often don't end up hanging it until DH is home in the evenings, often not until DS is having his pre-bedtime bottle about 9.30pm.

Another one here who has been to the KA this morning. DD doesn't have hand, foot and mouth, despite being covered in spots and there being an outbreak at her kiga. The dr gave me a prescription for Hustenlöser and barely commented on DD's skin . Anyway, she can go back to kiga on Monday, thankfully, and have another go at catching hfm.

admylin we had a hamster which died while I was still primary school age. I remember mum showing me the dead hamster curled up on some shredded paper in a shoebox and always assumed she had buried it, but it is entirely possibly she just chucked it in the bin. I don't suppose you could get away with that with an older dc, though...

Linzer can I ask a bit about Oxford Reading Tree? Is it a scheme that doesn't use phonics? I've been reading a bit about Montessori-style games to occupy preschoolers and they recommend teaching letter sounds, not names from the start. I know that 2 1/2 is rather young to start learning to read, but DD can recognise numbers and the alphabet is the next logical step. Obviously I'm massively overthinking this, but every time I read an alphabet book to DD and instinctively use letter names, part of me is thinking, should I be using the phonic sounds instead? In any case, I'm sure I will want to make a formal attempt to teach DD to read before she starts school, because, as you say, there's enough other stuff to deal with at that point.

Interesting stuff about dc's accents. I will have to go and look for that other thread...