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Original poster

Residence dispute with ex H: am I going to be reduced to 1 weekend per fortnight?

289 replies

agingoth · 25/09/2009 22:28

Hi all. I am getting divorced and we are about to go into mediation. H put the petition in which I am going to accept.

My big worry is losing main residence of the kids. We have spent a year separated in London doing strict 50:50 custody. H insisted on staying in the family home so I left as the atmosphere was so terrible and went to live in a flat 10 minutes away, the kids being with me strictly half the time. I was very depressed and didnt' have much fight in me at that point.

I work a long way from London in the North Midlands and now want to take the children with me up there where I think they would have a better standard of living. H is adamant they must stay with him because 'this is their home' and ds1 is settled in school (he is in year 2). My 2 year old is not yet in nursery. They have a nanny four days a week.

I have Mondays off to look after them but have to go up to Stoke 2/3 days a week at the moment to work. If they came to live with me nearer there I would be able to finish work about 4 to be with them. At the moment if with H they are with the nanny until 7pm.

i have offered H every weekend promising to get them down to London to him and more time in holidays. He said no and insists they must stay in SE London and attend the school.

Is he being reasonable? Or am I deluded in thinking I can take them out of London/school?

thanks

OP posts:
amtooyoungforthis · 28/09/2009 20:08

I have no agenda, I am just a divorced mother

The only agendas here are : people think fathers have as much right to parent as mothers and the only concern is the best interests of the children. The other agenda is a man hater.

I'd listen to the many other voices on this thread before listening to the odd lone one

dittany · 28/09/2009 20:08

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Message withdrawn at poster's request.

dittany · 28/09/2009 20:14

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Surfermum · 28/09/2009 20:18

I'm sure Yerblurt will be along in a bit to speak for himself. He has a wealth of experience in the courts as an advocate for parents who are in exactly the same situation as you. He knows what he is talking about.

You might want to take a look at the Families Need Fathers website agingoth. They're not gender specific, they also provide support to women. You're definitely not the first person to be in this position and they may well be able to help you or at least offer some support.

dittany · 28/09/2009 20:24

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Message withdrawn at poster's request.

amtooyoungforthis · 28/09/2009 20:25

'I love the idea that the best interests of the children includes supporting a man who made his children's mother, their primary carer, move out of the family home and is now trying reduce her contact with them to one weekend in a fortnight.'

Which is what happens to most divorced fathers

In a relationship break down, someone will usually lose out in residence, the children always lose out in having 2 parents to support them at home. If you can make 50:50 work and stay amicable, that is best.

If this was a father saying this, the response would be very different.

dittany · 28/09/2009 20:27

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Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Surfermum · 28/09/2009 20:37

But we're not talking about a split that is about to happen. They're a year down the line into the 50:50 and sadly that is what is not going in agingoth's favour - there is no primary carer now. She's going to have to prove that any upheaval is going to be in the childrens' favour. Unless the children are not really coping well with the 50:50 that's going to be an uphill struggle for her.

mmrred · 28/09/2009 20:41

So continuity is 'best' - but not in terms of home, school, day-to-day living? In fact, not in terms of anything except, erm, changing the lives of the children drastically because if you count up the hours worked...Ta Da! We have a primary carer. (Who has been caring for them 'strictly' 50/50 for the past YEAR, incidentally)

Both the parents in this scenario work, so does that mean they can change everything so long as they keep the nanny, who does the bulk of the childcare?

I think very few people have 'agendas' here, but we are all the product of our experiences and beliefs. I believe fathers are as important as mothers, and that a disputed court case is very bad for parents AND children. That's why, along with many others, I'm advocating mediation and trying to be supportive, rather than tell her how pathetic she is, that everyone who disagrees with me has an 'agenda', and encouraging her to get into a fight with the father of her children.

FYI I'm not a member of FNF, although how that would make a difference I'm not clear.

Original poster
agingoth · 28/09/2009 20:59

well, strict 50:50 in terms of nights mmred, but he does not take a day off to look after them as I do on Mondays and he just isnt' with them as many hours as I am, period. I have also had some support from work to take a year off to get the kids through the breakup better and I don't see him ever doing that. Etc.

But that is by the by. If he won't agree in mediation to move at least a bit nearer my work (and from what I can tell from most posters here, the fact that I gave in in hope of a reconciliation means I have given ground I now can't get back, as he now has the status quo in his favour) it looks as if I basically have no option but to leave work...I'm going to need a bloody good financial settlement to ensure that I have enough to live on for whatever uncertain period it is until I can get other work.

I mean, having given up what might be my only chance of a job (I kid not) for the kids, what happens to me when I am a 50 year old divorcee with sod all cash and no career history? Not a lot, I expect.

Or, I make the horrible decision to stay away most of the week with work (as I really want to work full time) and be a weekend and holiday mum.

One thing that hasnt' been pointed out in the discussion of 'equal' parenting is how much harder this sort of decision is to make for a woman. If I were a man moving away from my kids for work I doubt many would bat an eyelid. I also just don't see men in that situation feeling overwhelmingly guilty the way that I would/will.

OP posts:
scattykatty · 28/09/2009 20:59

I personally believe that as OP cheated on her husband, therefore ending her marriage. It should not be him who is expected to move to make it easier for her!

OP needs to understand that her children are settled and she can't really expect her DH to give up the 50/50 agreement for her sake alone.

The children will be happier, settled, spending time with both parents, not spending their weekend up and down the motorway surly she can see that?

yerblurt · 28/09/2009 21:00

Any court would look at the current status quo and may take into account any parenting history.

The fact is that there has been a history of a share care arrangement in place and it has worked for the benefit of the children.

Mum now proposes to uproot this - how would this benefit the children taking into account the welfare checklist as per the Children Act 1989????

Why should dad move to St Albans he will say - and a court will agree with him.

If mum decides to move away then that is her decision and she should make proposals as to how contact is to work if she is a distance away. The children are in an existing family structure, at school/nursery etc (so what if they have a nanny - if the sexes are reversed would that matter? The children are looked after by approproate care etc etc) and should not be disrupted by such a move away from school/clubs/friends/family home etc.

It is up to YOU to show how is it in the child's best interests for this to happen.

I'm not being harsh and contrary to people like Dittany (who seems to be breathtaking in her presumptions and assumptions), I would take exactly the same position if the sexes were reversed.

Whether I am a member of Families Need Fathers (a national charity providing support and advice to parents/carers of either gender and committed to promoting childrens relationship with both parents post-separation) matters not. I would provide the same opinions to either parent regardless of sex. Mostly fathers get a "bum" deal in the family courts and events post-separation. However we must focus on the children.

If you have to sacrifice a bit of your career aspirations, well that is your choice. Many fathers (including me) have had to do the same for the benefit of their kids. You have choices at the end of the day.

To add a footnote, in fact there are many fathers who are the primary carer who act just as bad if not worse than the stereotypical vindictive mother. It just shows that bad parenting and selfish behaviour exists and is not the preserve of either sex.

dittany · 28/09/2009 21:01

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

yerblurt · 28/09/2009 21:02

Any court would look at the current status quo and may take into account any parenting history.

The fact is that there has been a history of a share care arrangement in place and it has worked for the benefit of the children.

Mum now proposes to uproot this - how would this benefit the children taking into account the welfare checklist as per the Children Act 1989????

Why should dad move to St Albans he will say - and a court will agree with him.

If mum decides to move away then that is her decision and she should make proposals as to how contact is to work if she is a distance away. The children are in an existing family structure, at school/nursery etc (so what if they have a nanny - if the sexes are reversed would that matter? The children are looked after by approproate care etc etc) and should not be disrupted by such a move away from school/clubs/friends/family home etc.

It is up to YOU to show how is it in the child's best interests for this to happen.

I'm not being harsh and contrary to people like Dittany (who seems to be breathtaking in her presumptions and assumptions), I would take exactly the same position if the sexes were reversed.

Whether I am a member of Families Need Fathers (a national charity providing support and advice to parents/carers of either gender and committed to promoting childrens relationship with both parents post-separation) matters not. I would provide the same opinions to either parent regardless of sex. Mostly fathers get a "bum" deal in the family courts and events post-separation. However we must focus on the children.

If you have to sacrifice a bit of your career aspirations, well that is your choice. Many fathers (including me) have had to do the same for the benefit of their kids. You have choices at the end of the day.

To add a footnote, in fact there are many fathers who are the primary carer who act just as bad if not worse than the stereotypical vindictive mother. It just shows that bad parenting and selfish behaviour exists and is not the preserve of either sex.

ElenorRigby · 28/09/2009 21:05

Agingoth, Dittany has a well chronicled history of a best dislike of, at worst a hate of men.
Do a search on MN I am pretty sure you will find nothing positive from her about them.

The hate of women is called misogyny, the hate of of men is called mysandry. They are flips sides of the same damaged coin.

You need advice from those without such an agenda.

Others have advised you to find a job near your childrens home and school atm.
I echo that advice. Personally if it was a choice between my child or my career I would chose my child everytime. For example in your circumstance, Id sacrifice academia for teaching in your situation for my childs sake.
As a parent it is never about my needs or wants but about what is best for my child.

dittany · 28/09/2009 21:13

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Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Original poster
agingoth · 28/09/2009 21:14

Elenor, I'd be interested to hear if you'd give a man the same advice. I doubt it.

We pretend there's an equal playing field here, but there isn't.

OP posts:
mmrred · 28/09/2009 21:25

If a man had posted I would certainly have given the same advice - but I would also have told him he wouldn't have a cat in hell's chance of removing the children from their family home. So you're right, there isn't a level playing field.

amtooyoungforthis · 28/09/2009 21:25

I would give elenors advice to any parent, male or female

Funny how you have changed after listening to one lone poster, is it because she is the only one saying what you want to hear??

As a divorced mother, that has shared as much as fathers work will allow, stayed on good friendly terms, no one at fault for the break down of my marriage, where we have always put our children first...I can still say divorce has affected my children. They are almost adults now but speaking to them, they are still affected

Ripping them away from all they know is not in their best interests and will affect them. Please listen to me and all the others

Go to mediation, consider a change of career, put them first

amtooyoungforthis · 28/09/2009 21:28

if a man came on here and said...

I had an affair, my marriage broke down, we have shared residency for the last year, I can only get a job 3 hours away, is it reasonable that I take the children with me as I don't work mondays and am home at 4pm and exwife works fulltime...

He would get the same advice, more likely he would leave here with his balls in a virtual sling!

Original poster
agingoth · 28/09/2009 21:29

ooh, slightly nasty tone there mmred.

I was referring to the advice Elenor gave me on giving up academia for teaching, actually.

OP posts:
dittany · 28/09/2009 21:33

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Original poster
agingoth · 28/09/2009 21:33

getting v nasty now. I may have had a relationship with a man who wasn't my husband but I'm not the whore of babylon. We were actually already separated when I had it but he insisted on calling it an affair and so I go along with the terminology. Forgetting that to most people 'affair' = deserves all shit life can throw at her, etc etc.

OP posts:
ilovemydogandmrobama · 28/09/2009 21:34

FFS -- the OP has gone to great lengths explaining her attempts to mediate. Mediation is contingent on both parties, not just one wishing to resolve differences. Her ex appears to be going through the motions so he can tick the mediation box as in, 'see what a reasonable person I am...'

Why is the OP being given such a hard time? Really? Why is no one suggesting that her ex consider a change of career? After all, academia has much more security than most jobs, plus her ex isn't doing much child care. He is hiring a nanny.

Original poster
agingoth · 28/09/2009 21:34

I would hope if a man came on here saying what I have said he'd get what I have got (until this point)... reasonably balanced advice???

OP posts: