Baby Removed at Birth Support

[Mumtobe799]

Hello

This is extremely controversial and I feel embarrassed posting but I’m looking for a bit of help. I am due to give birth within the next few weeks and after Social Services involvement throughout my pregnancy, I have been told they will be removing my baby at birth. Baby will be placed with their Dad under an interim court order whilst assessments are ongoing.

Does anybody know what removal at birth actually means? My baby and I will need to stay in hospital for a few days, is it likely I will be able to stay with them or will they likely split us up? These are questions I have asked Social Services but they will not give me an answer.

I would like to breast feed; is this something Social Services have to support as it is in the best interest of baby. My baby is being removed due to mental health concerns, no issues around substance or alcohol abuse so that being in breast milk isn’t a worry.

If anyone with any legal experience or people who may have gone through or know someone who has gone through something similar can help I would really appreciate it. Thank you.

Good luck for the future OP. You sound like you are doing all you can to act in the best interests of your children.

Hi @Mumtobe799 glad to read your updates and that you are taking this in your stride.

Baby is really settled with their Dad and perfectly healthy. They’re also really content when they spend time with me, just sleeps on me while I read lots of stories so they get use to my voice.

your baby is already used to your voice having spent 9 months growing inside you. Sounds like you’re doing a great job

Are you part of baby's Child Protection Plan? Assuming so, I would be hopeful of the aim being regular contact with you.

I am yes, we have regular meetings and conferences.

I don't have anything particularly useful to say here, but just wanted to say that you come across as a wonderful mother and I sincerely wish you all the very best.
My only really minor point is that you seem guilty for 'burdening' your Ex. Had he not wanted another child, he could have taken measures to stop that. Also, it is accepted that women get their lives turned upside down when they have a baby, but male partners rarely feel guilty about that. This is not your fault. You shouldn't feel guilty about this.

Presumably your Ex will be entitled to paternity leave for up to 12 months if you are in the UK? Perhaps he will actually enjoy his time off looking after his baby and being able to spend more time with his other child. Don't assume that he doesn't want time off to spend with his own children.

I appreciate that this may not help at all, but the Calm App has some good sleep stories. I have a bluetooth sleep mask connected to my phone and eventually drift off listening to them. Even if I can't sleep, I still rest whilst half listening to them. They also have a good SOS Panic meditation that is only 4 minutes long but does help me when i'm very anxious. There's also a track that I listen to (it's on YouTube) by Marconi Union, which has been scientifically proven to be the most relaxing piece of music in the world. Perhaps you and your baby can listen to it together. Even if you are unable to relax or sleep, your baby might enjoy it, given the amount of research surrounding babies responding to music in the womb.

Sorry that I don't have any particularly useful advice, but I admire you enormously for being able to speak so articulately and openly about your experience with mental health issues.

As I say, wishing you all the best. Xx

Hi OP,
I just wanted to wish you and both your children well.
My daughter had psychosis in pregnancy, and it was heartbreaking to witness.
I hope everything works out for you x

Just coming back as I saw your update, it sounds like you're doing all the right things and I'm glad you're staying stable.

I agree with PP's suggestion of asking SS the hard questions and nailing them down to specific dates, exactly what they mean by "risk of becoming unstable" (we all have a risk, even those who haven't been diagnosed with anything, it doesn't mean they have to proactively remove every child in the country).

If there's a good time to do it, I'd also query exactly why they've made you do the DV work, is it box ticking for them so they look like they're doing "some work" with you (I had this where they sent me on a really stupid very low-level course that was totally irrelevant to me as they wanted to look like they had done something) or is there some genuine concern about DV? I wouldn't ask about these in a belligerent way, just in a "so we're on the same page" sort of way. I just think when someone has a mental illness they have limited energy and wasting it on something irrelevant to tick a box seems really silly and like they could overload you at a point where you need to focus on getting better. I wouldn't say all that, I'd just ask for the rationale of doing the DV work with you.

I'd personally query it all in next the CP meeting if there is one before court, because there will be a chair there who will record everything properly, unlike if you just ask the social worker informally e.g. on the phone.

On long-acting contraception, have you considered the implant? How do you react to progesterone? I find a combination of the mini-pill and my bipolar meds have kept me the stablest I've ever been but obviously everyone reacts differently to hormones.

I'm just thinking if you can pin down that the episodes only happen when you're pregnant/pp and you can show that you're using long-acting contraception by the time the psychiatric assessment/court stuff is happening, you might be able to show that you're proactively managing the condition. It doesn't need to be forever, if you meet Mr. Actually Supportive in 10 years time you could revisit it, but it might be an alternative to the Mirena coil if you aren't suitable for it for any reason.

Thank you so much for this!

I don’t want to get into it but the DV is somewhat relevant as the relationship between myself and my children’s father is currently not positive, I can understand why professionals feel some work needs to be done.

I was on the implant several years ago and I bled the entire time. I’ve never done very well on contraceptives which is why I think a non-hormonal coil might be best.

I actually have a meeting this week so I’m going to address the situation and ask about timescales for stability and risk etc. I understand there will always be some risk but surely if I’m stable for 6, 12 months court goes on for and then the likely couple of years they’ll be involved for (likely on a CP/CIN plan) after that, SS cannot continue to say there’s a substantial enough risk in 2-3 years time to still be heavily involved?!

I am just so worried as I know how to mitigate risks, I know about warning signs and have insight but SS keep saying I don’t understand the risks, signs or have insight even though my mental health teams are saying I do? I feel like I will never be able to do enough to satisfy them the risk is manageable if I’m honest.

Insight is a fairly straightforward thing to evidence - have you asked SS how specifically you don’t have insight into these factors? From my experience the opinion of the mental health team carries a lot of weight, particularly if you are seen by a psychiatrist and a psychologist.

To quote them they state “you don’t understand how much your mental health affects your children”

I absolutely do understand how my mental health affects my children, neither of my children have ever seen me in a mental health crisis because I’ve protected them from this. My children live with their Dad due to my mental health and that is something that is unlikely to change in the near future. I understand it’s different as most split families children live with their Mum but in 2025 there’s all different types of family dynamics.

It’s very difficult to agree with a Social Worker that your mental health is ‘emotionally abusing your child’ but at the same time I’ve understand that mental health can cause emotional harm in children, although I try my absolute best to shield my children from any negativity around my mental illness.

@Mumtobe799 To me (as a psychologist) it sounds like you can clearly articulate the potential harms, and you can continue doing this with your mental health team. The system creates such distrust and anxiety, continue to be as honest, open and communicative as you have been. You are doing brilliantly in navigating a very flawed and complex system.

Maybe and I could be wrong. Your body language behaviour doesnt show through to match your words. Maybe some coaching might help

Ss work on what they can see i have found

Gently OP, do you think this might be part of the issue if you’ve let SS know you might want to try again for children?

Being pregnant clearly makes you very poorly and is damaging your children and it’s happened twice now. It’s very sad but you being pregnant is clearly a huge risk to your kids, new and existing, so if you’re telling SS there’s a possibility of it happening again this might be influencing them. I think your sole focus (even in ten years) needs to be on the children you already have and not doing anything to present risk to them.

Gently OP, do you think this might be part of the issue if you’ve let SS know you might want to try again for children?

I'm sorry to say that there's probably some truth in this - if SS suspect that you are considering further children even many years into the future they will likely take a dim view - and use it as evidence that you aren't fully focussed on the children you have already

Hearing that you feel you have completed your family and are making plans for reliable long-term contraception is what they'll want to hear

Unfair as that might be

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I can't speak for all social workers and some may take this kind of view but it would be judgemental, misguided and cruel. Social workers should hold the belief that change is possible and nobody should be written off now and forever!

You're missing the point

It's not about the OP's capacity to change her behaviour

It's about her innate pre-disposition to episodes of severe mental illness related to pregnancy - sadly that's not something she can change about herself or something which will change with the passage of time

She can only mitigate against relapse by avoiding further pregnancies

Like I say it's unfair

It’s very difficult to agree with a Social Worker that your mental health is ‘emotionally abusing your child’ but at the same time I’ve understand that mental health can cause emotional harm in children, although I try my absolute best to shield my children from any negativity around my mental illness

I'll attempt a 'translation' of this

I think what the SW is trying to say is that when you are well you do not emotionally abuse your children and are fully aware of how your mental state impacts their wellbeing

But when you you start to become unwell your mental state begins to impact on your childrens wellbeing - even tho' that's not your intention

IDK maybe I'm wrong

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They might mean that the fact that the children have to live apart from you due to your mental health is in some way abusing them as you're not fully present as a mother in their lives. Not sure I agree with that, but it's possibly amongst their thoughts.

Good luck @Mumtobe799 I feel for you. I had post partum psychosis after the birth of my son, it was a scary time and I ended up under a section. My children stayed with exh who I was married to at the time and I resumed their care when I left hospital (28 days)
I fell pregnant, unplanned, and dd was born soon after my son's 8th birthday. I was weaned from all the medication I had taken since son had been a baby during pregnancy and had never felt better. Plan was to restart after dd was born and to watch and wait. However I had a huge allergic reaction to a tablet I had taken for years and so left hospital with dd medication free. I was terrified, psychiatrist plan was to let the reaction calm and then start new medication (I appeared to have severe sunburn that was weeping and painful in places)
I was still well when the reaction calmed so psychiatrist decided we would wait. Long story short but I never restarted any medication (although had been advised I would likely need to take it for life) and although he wanted to discharge me earlier I continued to see him until dd's first birthday.
Ds and dd are now adults and there has be no recurrence of either depression and psychosis. Wishing you well.

I have not told SS there’s a small possibility I might want to try for another baby in my thirties if I was married, stable etc. I have been on my own for both of my pregnancies so there is a part of me that would love to experience a ‘proper pregnancy’ it’s very likely I won’t have another child, I guess a positive pregnancy with a loving partner is something I always thought I’d experience.

Trying to find a surgeon to sterilise a me is going to be really hard which is why I am going to have a copper coil which will last 10 years regardless. The court proceedings should take around 6 months and I’ve been told there no chance a surgeon will go back in after a c section within the next 6 months, especially as I am young, still classed as vulnerable with my mental health so there’s issues around consenting for a surgery like that, plus the NHS wait times.

I received an up to date report this morning and it is a lot more positive! It doesn’t actually mention insight at all and states I’ve been stable and working with social care (this is the first time something positive has been noted which I guess is good). I’ve really been working on having a positive relationship with the social worker and it seems to be working, I hope!

That sounds like a much more positive report, so keep on doing what you're doing. Good luck.

That's good news about the latest report @Mumtobe799

Also good that you've not shared your musings about more children

Great news about the more positive report!