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Original poster

House in will - issues/second marriage

137 replies

needadvice54321 · 18/03/2021 16:21

Hi all

This is an awkward issue that we have and I wondered if anyone knew where DH stands with it. We have no idea, so prepared to be told we're unreasonable.

DH recently sadly lost his Dad. In his will both DH and his brother inherit the house.

DH's mum died 20 years ago. The house is the family home. My father in law married again several years later and he and his wife (my MIL) lived together in the house.

As part of the will, FIL stated he wanted his wife to be allowed to stay living in the house for up to 2 years post his death - absolutely reasonable.

Now here's the awkwardness - obviously now that FIL has passed, the house belongs to DH and his brother. MIL obviously isn't paying any "rent" to live there ( DH wouldn't want to charge her rent) but here's the issue - in the event that there's a problem with the house, who should be sorting it? ie paying? If it's DH and his brother, is it reasonable to request that nothing is done without their agreement?

This week there has been an issue. MIL immediately dealt with it (it could have waited for DH - wasn't urgent), arranged someone to fix it and is now handing the bill to DH and his brother.

DH is unhappy, he feels the arrangement should be that MIL is more than welcome to stay obviously, but she does at her own cost.

FIL left money to her that she has access to now - it was any money in joint accounts. DH and his brother have no access to FIL estate until MIL moves out and they sell up. MIL also has an income and a generous pension, so we don't feel she's being left high and dry.

What do we do? Pay for this? Make an agreement? Or are we obliged to sort this? Do we just suck it up?

OP posts:
Easterbunnygettingready · 18/03/2021 19:21

She isn't loosing a house... Neither is she losing one for 2 years..

Viviennemary · 18/03/2021 19:29

I think that's a bit cheeky of her to assume your DH and his brother would pick up the bill. I'm sure there will be legal guidelines covering this situation. Also other bills. Contents insurance building insurance who is going to pay these. And she should certainly be paying the Council tax. You need to get all this clarified sooner rather than later. But usually the marital home gets left to the surviving spouse for their lifetime. You definitely need legal advice.

Original poster
needadvice54321 · 18/03/2021 19:30

@OneRingToRuleThemAll

It's strange that the will doesn't state the costs arrangements. My will will leave my house (bought pre marriage) to my children, but DH has a right to live there rent free. On advice of a solicitor the ongoing costs are for DH to foot for as long as he is resident.
It's our biggest puzzlement of the whole will, everything else makes sense. It also makes sense to us that MIL isn't just chucked out on her ear immediately- no one would want that. However FIL would have been aware that neither us or BIL would be in a position to be able to maintain the house long term, you just don't know what's around the corner.
OP posts:
Original poster
needadvice54321 · 18/03/2021 19:34

@Viviennemary

I think that's a bit cheeky of her to assume your DH and his brother would pick up the bill. I'm sure there will be legal guidelines covering this situation. Also other bills. Contents insurance building insurance who is going to pay these. And she should certainly be paying the Council tax. You need to get all this clarified sooner rather than later. But usually the marital home gets left to the surviving spouse for their lifetime. You definitely need legal advice.
Yes we're going to get some advice from the solicitor. We originally assumed the house would be left for her to live in forever, but I think as it was DH and his brothers childhood home (so half belonged to their mum) FIL felt it was right it became theirs fairly quickly. They kept everything very separate, only having a couple of joint bits for household stuff. All savings etc were separate
OP posts:
KeziaOAP · 18/03/2021 21:51

After my father's death my siblings and I were left his house with stepmother having a lifetime interest, she asked that we pay all bills including council tax. However my DF's solicitor informed her that all bills were her responsibility she was not pleased.

justasmalltownmum · 18/03/2021 21:57

@VettiyaIruken

I'd give her a choice. She can either live there, rent free but responsible for bills and maintenance, or she can pay them market rent and pay the normal bills (utilities etc) and they are responsible for maintenance or she can move out.
100%
Original poster
needadvice54321 · 18/03/2021 22:03

@KeziaOAP

After my father's death my siblings and I were left his house with stepmother having a lifetime interest, she asked that we pay all bills including council tax. However my DF's solicitor informed her that all bills were her responsibility she was not pleased.
Wow! Did she not used to pay the bills? Was that always your DF's dept?

As far as we're aware bills were always split evenly, they even had an account they both used to put money in for future eventualitys (ie issues with the house/car). The funny thing is that this account is one of the joint accounts that has obviously just passed to MIL - so most of the money she's gained was money put aside to pay for household bills and emergencies, yet now she doesn't want to spend it on that. I don't blame her, it's DH's house now, but it does amuse me that the money was always meant for it.

TBH I'm just annoyed that the Will wasn't clearer, would have made this far simpler. We've never had the strongest relationship with MIL - she has never been a mum figure to DH and has always been a tricky character, so we knew there would be difficult conversations after FIL's death. Not really want you want after such upset all round Sad

OP posts:
Viviennemary · 18/03/2021 22:14

I don't think I'd ask for rent because then you will have the complication of taxable income. She needs to pay the bills. Also I was wondering could she appeal against the two year stay and insist to stay longer. Prepare yourself for that possibility.

Original poster
needadvice54321 · 18/03/2021 22:28

@Viviennemary

I don't think I'd ask for rent because then you will have the complication of taxable income. She needs to pay the bills. Also I was wondering could she appeal against the two year stay and insist to stay longer. Prepare yourself for that possibility.
I'm not sure she would, but it is a possibility I suppose! It's just so bloody messy. The whole thing has been a bit hard, even before we lost FiL. It's put me off remarrying if I become widowed! 🙈. It just makes everything so complicated
OP posts:
WisnaeMe · 19/03/2021 02:58

does MIL have family/children ?

rwalker · 19/03/2021 05:47

She pays all the bills maintenance is down to DH and BIL but they arrange it. She can't just get done what she thinks need sorting and present them with the bill this taking the piss.

Have they had a conversation with here about maintenance?

Original poster
needadvice54321 · 19/03/2021 07:53

@WisnaeMe

does MIL have family/children ?
Yes she has one adult child
OP posts:
Original poster
needadvice54321 · 19/03/2021 08:04

@rwalker

She pays all the bills maintenance is down to DH and BIL but they arrange it. She can't just get done what she thinks need sorting and present them with the bill this taking the piss.

Have they had a conversation with here about maintenance?

DH had a bit of a chat with her the other day about this weeks issue, it's just very difficult- non of us are close to her and she's quite a defensive person, which is fair enough. I think she has behaved all along a bit like everyone is ganging up on her, which no one is, but obviously she's trying to protect her own interests and DH and his brother are protecting theirs.

It's just so messy, her daughter isn't approachable either.

We just can't afford for her to live the life she has always had (sorting things out by getting professionals in to do a job anyone could do) and then just have us foot the bill. Both families have a child about to start university, there just isn't a lot of spare money. Obviously we'd have to sort it if something major happens, but it's the minor stuff that DH and his brother would be capable of fixing that she needs to stop taking over with.

If we'd known this was coming we would have tried to save for it, but probably naively we didn't. We knew FIL had a large pot of money that he always had for household stuff ( he was organised like that) and we assumed that would be continued to be used, as and when necessary

OP posts:
Bluntness100 · 19/03/2021 08:13

I don’t know why people keep saying charge her rent. They have absolutely no right at all to charge her rent. She’s permitted to live there rent free for two years. It’s also their property so it’s their job to maintain their own property. It’s not hers.

Op just speak to her, explain you don’t have the money and any minor repairs to let you guys know and you’ll fix it youtselves for her.

Original poster
needadvice54321 · 19/03/2021 08:34

Blimey no way we'd dream of charging rent bluntness, that's just wrong! I do find it baffling though this situation, what if we were in absolutely no position to do anything in the house for the next 2 years? There won't be many people who can afford to just suddenly have the upkeep of a house thrown at them, told they can't do anything with it (rent it/sell it) but it's their responsibility to pay for any issues? What would happen if we literally couldn't afford to pay for it? Could she take us to court for leaving her in a house that has issues that aren't fixed?! I just find it mind boggling that this is allowed.
If we couldn't afford the upkeep of our own house we'd have to consider whether it's a house we can afford to stay in - we'd have that control. Something goes wrong with FIL's house and it feels like it's tough luck Confused

OP posts:
Bluntness100 · 19/03/2021 08:52

Hopefully you can all discuss and find a route forward. As said, just tell her you don’t have the money and any repairs to let you know, you will do it yourselves if you can, anything major you can always borrow against the property itself.

Is it in really bad repair then?

Original poster
needadvice54321 · 19/03/2021 09:11

In fairness bluntness it's not, FIL/MIL have looked after it beautifully, but it's old so has potential to have issues over the next couple of years - I'm not sure the last time it had a new boiler for example.

MIL just needs to understand we don't have the funds (BIL even less so) to be paying for the luxury of having someone to fix issues that could be fixed by DH. They were a fairly wealthy couple, second marriage late in life, no mortgage etc so both had a decent amount of disposable income. If there was an issue with the house they'd splash the cash and do a bigger job, which is fine for them, but we just don't have that spare cash to keep up with that lifestyle that MIL is used to. It's just not realistic. It's trying to get her to understand that, she just rushed the other day, sorted it out and then expected money to appear out of no where. Eventually we will have spare money when we sell the house, until then there's not much else we can get our hands on.

OP posts:
Soontobe60 · 19/03/2021 09:11

She isn’t paying anything to you in the way of rent. You own the house. She has her own house which she rents out. She has a reasonable income. here’s what I’d do.

Draw up an agreement that in return for her living there rent free she will be responsible for the cost of maintaining the property.
You need to get building insurance on the property as you are the owners. - most likely need landlord insurance.
She needs to pay council tax - she will get the single person rebate too.
State the date that she needs to vacate - is 2 years from the death of your FIL.

Keep it matter of fact. Your FIL didnt think this through, but it needs to be sorted now. I wouldn’t be in a position to fund the upkeep of a second house, even if I was going to benefit from the sale of it in the future. The value of the house could drop in that time frame!

KeziaOAP · 19/03/2021 09:47

needadvice54321

Wow! Did she not used to pay the bills? Was that always your DF's dept?

They had a joint pot for bills etc.

Stepmother also owned a property which she rented out. DF didn't think she would stay in the property after he died as it was quite big for one and would move into her own she didn't and lived for another ten years.

Soontobe60 has a good idea of drawing up an agreement. We had DF's solicitor on side who drew up an agreement re her paying the bills etc., she wouldn't accept an agreement direct from us but did from him.

Bluntness100 · 19/03/2021 09:48

Draw up an agreement that in return for her living there rent free she will be responsible for the cost of maintaining the property

She can’t do this, for goodness sake. The woman has the legal right to live in that property rent free. It’s still their property ro maintain. The will will be legally adhered to.

Why do people keep posting like it’s the ops choice she lived there. It’s not. The woman has a legal entitlement to live their rent free and she’s not responsible to maintain someone else’s house.

Bluntness100 · 19/03/2021 09:52

My daughters a lawyer, she says unless there is a trust then the legal position will likely be the owners are responsible for the repairs, unless the mil damaged something, then she is, she says you should write to the solicitor who administered the estate to advise.

KeziaOAP · 19/03/2021 09:52

This resonates with me

it's just very difficult- non of us are close to her and she's quite a defensive person, which is fair enough. I think she has behaved all along a bit like everyone is ganging up on her, which no one is, but obviously she's trying to protect her own interests and DH and his brother are protecting theirs

I

Original poster
needadvice54321 · 19/03/2021 09:55

I just find it staggering bluntness that this is a law, that someone can live in a house for a period of time, and expect someone to take on the costs that they can't afford. It just amazes me that the people who inherit don't have any protection? If it came to it and the house and our house both needing something fixing but we couldn't afford both - what would we do? Prioritise MIL? Or our own home? It just baffles me.

It's just so bloody complicated

OP posts:
Sundances · 19/03/2021 09:56

How many expenses will there be in 2 years?
I would look into the legalities but prob let it go - I have tenants and they don't demand new kitchens, but repairs or maybe a new wash machine(as it was inbuilt - I didn't need to leave it in).
If the roof needs replaced it's in your interests to do it. I feel just pay up if it's small things.

Original poster
needadvice54321 · 19/03/2021 09:57

@Bluntness100

My daughters a lawyer, she says unless there is a trust then the legal position will likely be the owners are responsible for the repairs, unless the mil damaged something, then she is, she says you should write to the solicitor who administered the estate to advise.
DH is still having dealings with the solicitor, so he's going to have a chat with him next time they speak.
OP posts:
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