Advice! Exes holiday contact with DS

[JoJo2106]

Hi,

Just wondering if anyone could perhaps help me with something.

There is a child arrangement order in place for my Ds, he is almost 2. Finished in court in January. There are arrangements in place regarding holiday contact for this year and it states it's to be 7 consecutive nights. The thing is my ex is trying to make it longer which would end up making it 9 days in total. My ex and I do not meet or communicate in any way other than via a communication book due to past DV. So this is now getting into a tit for tat back and forward thing in the book which is very difficult and becoming stressful for me.

The thing I would like to know is am i in my rights to stick to just what the order says. It doesnt say anything other than I've to make child available for 7 consecutive nights. Ds is already going to struggle with the 7 nights let alone any longer due to how he is just after 2 nights away from me.

I'm not willing to argue any longer in the book so would just like to know that I'm.doing the right thing by sticking to.what the order says? He seems to think he can do what he likes basically and has no regard for ds and how he would react been away from home and me that long. He just says 9 days is not too long. It is too long for ds because he doesn't see him once he gets home. Ds has also started to show signs of been withdrawn and not wanting to go at handovers so the less time it is the better.

The order says 7 consecutive nights not 8 nights and 9 days. The reason it would end up that long is once they return it would go onto his normal contact weekend which will make it longer, I have tried to say go on a midweek day and come back on a midweek day that way it will be 7 nights. It says nothing in the order about it going into any usual contact time just that hes to have 7 consecutive nights in summer 2019.

Thank you.

It means that you go to mediation rather than court to come to a reasonable compromise.

It sounds like you are trying to punish him rather than protect your son as you don't think your son is in any danger.

As they say pick your battles! This is one I would let go.

I think 7 nights of holiday plus his usual contact is reasonable and I think the courts will agree. I can see why you are upset but as the courts deem him ok to take him away I don’t think you have a leg to stand on.

Any extra holiday days are in addition to regular contact so it would be seen as fine if that's how it's landed. I double checked that. ExP seems content with just 'winning' in court though and hasn't taken up a single day of the extra contact during the holidays that he demanded, possibly because I've been freely offering it. I think the more you resist the more he's going to pull this shit

@Indicative not even sure how that would work as I was exempt from it last time due to DV. Plus we dont meet for the handovers and it's not from my house either. We even had separate waiting areas in court due to DV.

I do worry about ds yes as he had taken him around cannabis use before and driven with him over the limit. He was ordered to do drugs and alcohol tests in court but he waited almost 6 months to do them so it was a complete farce and was out of his system as hed had time to stop. So although I am very worried when hes away we have a court order and he got around the drug tests etc so nothing I can do. And ds is too young to tell me if hes around drug use etc.

Obviously its not totally clear, but I can't see why the 7 nights wouldn't be in addition to the weekend contact. You should let your DS go as the weekend after is also his contact time. He probably has planned it to coincide with his contact weekend, it makes sense if he wants a longer holiday with DS rather than him going back and forth? I don't see how this would mean he's trying to upset you. As someone else said, if he is trying to wind you up, it's working. Send a calm message to show him its not bothering you. There are many reasons he wouldn't just be able to go the week after - different weeks cost more or less, flights or transport costs change, work and other commitments. Most people who have booked a holiday knowing they'd have their child at that time wouldn't just be able to change it at the other parents say so.

The fact you’re unable to communicate directly means your son is already impacted by the conflict. Obviously there’s good reason for that; and it means your son loses out on seeing his parents being civil to each other. He will still pick up on the conflict between you even without witnessing any of it. Small children are extremely perceptive.

The court has clearly decided you are both capable of doing mediation despite knowing the DV history and you could do shuttle mediation if necessary. Mediation is about meeting in the middle though, not about forcing him into your proposal.

It's up to us to decide on dates. It's not to be prior to September but before the end of the year. Either way his normal weekends are going to come into it as that's when he has ds. But up to now we dont agree when it should be.

@MummytoCSJH up to now nothing is booked as we have to agree on dates and if its suitable. Ds is due to start nursery for the first time in September so I'd like him settled in a bit first before taking him out. So that was agreed it wouldn't be in the first 2 weeks at least of ds starting nursery.

He can book whenever he likes once we've agreed, and I know his work is quite flexible as hes changed them before when we were together. But as I say it's working out the best way to do it but it's just arguing.

@MissMalice yes I think it would have to be shuttle mediation I could not sit with him after what hes done and I shouldn't be made to sit with an abuser either.

Yes it's awful that it's like this and up to now my son isn't aware of anything thats gone on with court etc. I just dread as he gets older as sadly I think the conflict will always be there.

Are people missing the fact that the ex asked for 14 days and the court ruled that that was too long, given the circumstances st the time and specified 7 days instead.

On that basis I would take it that the court thinks 7 nights away is the maximum for this father and this child given their specific history and circumstances. Hence the court order.

So op I'm with you, the court order states only 7 consecutive nights, then DS is to be returned.

End of discussion and he can take it back to court if he disagrees.

No, about time, I’m not.
And the court order also doesn’t say it can’t be taken consecutively with normal weekend contact. It’s reasonable to assume that the holiday contact is intended in addition to weekend contact.

It’s all very well sitting on a forum and saying “he can take it back to court” but the current order allows him to do what he wants to do and they could look unfavourably upon the OP for making the booking of the holiday difficult.

The courts aren’t there to micromanage squabbles about whether a child should holiday with a parent for 7 nights or 8 nights.

It’s funny, with CMS posts it’s always “the legal minimum”. The same goes for contact orders - what the court orders is the minimum the child must be allowed to spend time with their other parent, not the maximum.

OP, I really would get specialist legal advice. This is a man who tried to forcibly take a 7 month old from his mother's arms, and has (working off the timeline here) only JUST resumed unsupervised contact. Assuming good intent on the part of the Dad is a mistake here