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Legal matters

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Original poster

Estranged husband life instance (family pocketing it)

178 replies

LooUpdate · 21/05/2019 07:55

I separated from my husband about 3 years ago. We have 2 young children. Sadly he passed away in the spring.

He had life insurance through his employers. His family are "managing it". I've asked if I will have access to this money and they say no, it's not for daily living. They said they will spend it on things like the children's schooling and holidays. (That's great but daily living is surely even more important?) I even said I was willing to provide receipts to prove I was spending the money on the kids.

I am now the sole parent with 90% of the overnights (grandparents do the 10%). I never divorced my husband.

My question is: even if my husband has specified that he wanted his family to handle the life insurance money, do I have any rights to it as his wife (and mother to his children).

OP posts:
LizB62A · 03/06/2019 22:45

My understanding is that any "expression of wish" is just that - an indication but the life insurance company don't need to abide by that.
I'm sure you can make a good case as you were still married and they are his children.
Good luck.

lifebegins50 · 03/06/2019 22:50

Was your Husband contributing financially whilst separated? Are the family making any payments such as CMS?

Berthatydfil · 04/06/2019 07:57

You may have a legal basis to claim the money on behalf of the children who are his dependents.
You really do need to see a solicitor ASAP

prh47bridge · 04/06/2019 08:43

My understanding is that any "expression of wish" is just that - an indication but the life insurance company don't need to abide by that

That is correct.

You may have a legal basis to claim the money on behalf of the children who are his dependents

Not from the life insurance. It will almost certainly be written in trust which means it does not form part of his estate and the trustees of the life insurance fund can do whatever they want with it (within reason). As the OP was still married to him at the time of his death she should inherit his estate but neither she nor her children have a legal claim against his life insurance.

As I said up thread, if the life insurance has already been paid out the OP isn't going to get anywhere. She can't make the life insurance company take the money back from her husband's family and give it to her, nor can she make her husband's family hand over the money. If the money has not yet been paid out the OP is in a better position to persuade the life insurance trustees to pay the money to her or put it in trust for her children. But if it has been paid out it is too late.

The questions the OP needs to look at in my view are:

  • did her husband have an estate and, if so, what has happened to it? As they were still married, the first £250k of his estate should have come to her with anything beyond that shared between her and her children (assuming the OP's ex was in England or Wales). His family may not like that as they were separated, so it wouldn't be overly surprising if they have ignored the law regarding intestacy.
  • has the life insurance money gone into a trust for her children? If so, what are the terms of that trust and who are the trustees?
Xenia · 04/06/2019 10:44

You need details of the trust and ideally a copy of the form the husband filled in to say who were his preferred beneficiaries - probably his wife and children, not his wider family although if he were in the middle of a separation he might well have change the original expressed beneficiary.

Lochroy · 07/06/2019 21:15

How did you get on, OP?

Sayyestothecake · 07/06/2019 23:09

Op things like this make my blood boil and I hope you take proper legal advice on this.

Original poster
LooUpdate · 08/06/2019 09:49

Okay, I have had confirmation from his work, and it's not good. Here is what they have said:

"Having looked into this matter, I can confirm that the life insurance company have carried out your husband's wishes with regards to his life assurance policy. Your husband nominated his sister as the full beneficiary of his life assurance policy. He had requested that the funds were managed by his sister on behalf of the children."

I'm shuck up. Actually shaking here. His sister lives 100s of miles away and never sees the children. She has no parental responsibility for them. Is this legal?

OP posts:
CatPunsFreakMeowt · 08/06/2019 09:53

That doesn’t sound good OP. What was he thinking?

ArnoldBee · 08/06/2019 09:56

Have you applied for bereavement support payment from dwp?

VanGoghsDog · 08/06/2019 09:59

Sadly, yes, that is legal and the trustees have done the right thing.

PotteringAlong · 08/06/2019 10:00

Yes, it’s legal. She’s not controlling the children, it’s the money. Whether she has parental responsibility or not is irrelevant

Original poster
LooUpdate · 08/06/2019 10:02

Bereavement support is £100 per month for 18 MONTHS. And yes I've got it. Not really lifechanging though.

What was he thinking?

We had separated and he hated me I guess. But I suspect family manipulation was a HUGE player as when he originally discovered his diagnosis he wanted the funds to come to me and said so in a phone convo.

Are there any mechanisms in play to ensure she spends the money on the children? Or does she have free reign to spend it however she likes?

OP posts:
Original poster
LooUpdate · 08/06/2019 10:06

Why was everyone mentioning intestacy further up the thread if it does not apply to life insurance?

OP posts:
titchy · 08/06/2019 10:06

She would have to demonstrate to the trustees that the money has been used for the children. Ask them what sort of thing the trust could pay for, and what mechanisms there are to ensure it is used for the children's benefit. Also confirm when it will revert to them. Aged 18 presumably.

Is there any money in the estate (the trust is not the estate btw)? Property, savings etc? If so that should come to you.

vdbfamily · 08/06/2019 10:09

Is in not possible to make contact with his sister saying that you understand that she is managing this money on behalf of your late husband and asking how she would like to proceed from now. For example, if they have expensive school trips away or a hobbie they would like to take up. Were there things he was helping to fund whilst alive? She may just invest it until they need driving lessons/car/ house deposits etc which will benefit them eventually but I get your frustration . Presumably as his wife , if he died intestate, you would inherit anything else he had in the way of savings/ car/ valuables?
You would hope that if you were struggling with the kids, the sister would assist. Another idea would be to ask her to pay the equivalent of any CSA or other financial support you regularly got from your husband.

VanGoghsDog · 08/06/2019 10:15

People were mentioning intestacy because they didn't understand the situation and should not have answered.

That only applies to the estate, not to the life insurance.

Original poster
LooUpdate · 08/06/2019 10:23

Is there any money in the estate

Apparently not. He had a lot left to pay on the mortgage. His sister said she was going to sell the house to pay off his debt. This is all I know.

Is in not possible to make contact with his sister saying that you understand that she is managing this money on behalf of your late husband and asking how she would like to proceed from now.

Yes. I did a few weeks ago. Here's the conversation:

Me: Do I get access to this money? I have the kids every night except for 2 nights per fortnight when Grandad has them so I can do nightshifts at work. I need support for them. I can provide receipts if necessary to prove all moneys are spent on the children.

His sister: We want to be as supportive as possible but the money is for the children’s future as per Husband's wishes. The money is not for everyday living. If the children need anything specific i.e private assessment for daughter's autism. Grandad is being very supportive with childcare, making sure they have their dinner before they are dropped home. He had even bought clothes, shoes etc. All of this has a cost to him. You will have to support the kids. Husband had to do this on his own without any help from you for many years.

(She's referring to when I was a stay at home mum).

OP posts:
user1486131602 · 08/06/2019 10:31

Unless you are completely divorced or he left a will specifically disinheriting you, then you are, as his next of kin, entitled to the whole of his estate. If he has left a will you can ask for a copy of it from the probate. If not, contact his employer. You may be asked to prove that you were still married at the time of death, but you will be regarded as his next of kin. I believe you should see a solicitor. How did his family become involved? Separated or not, unless it is clearly and lawfully defined that you are excluded. YOU, not them are the one that inherits and handles his estate. Even if he has left a will, it may not be valid, also something you should check into, if it is not the entire estate goes to YOU not them.
I am certain of these facts.
Good luck

Original poster
LooUpdate · 08/06/2019 10:35

There is no will. And no estate it seems. Only the life insurance, which his sister gets on behalf of my children as he nominated her.

OP posts:
user1486131602 · 08/06/2019 10:36

Apologies, after reading the other posts I can see that you have posted further relevant info! That I hadn’t read before!

I’m sorry to say, it looks like the money will be managed by your SIL.

user1486131602 · 08/06/2019 10:45

So, after paying your mortgage for many years, the house has no equity? Telling his sister it was to be sold is NOT a will. You now get to make that decision not her. Did he not have life assurance attached to the mortgage, people usually do? Being a SAHM doesn’t mean you contributed nothing. Get a solicitor. Just for info ....my mum passed with a will that left nothing to me. ( not what she expressed on her death bed in front of my sister) the will left was not valid. Sister takes me to court to get all funds. Probate says 1/2 each. I was expecting nothing and yet was given a inheritance.
If there was no will, thenYOU, as his legal wife inherit everything.
Please get legal advice.

titchy · 08/06/2019 10:47

Well the life insurance is the kids not his sisters.... it sucks but it's not there to enable you to pay your mortgage/rent to keep a roof over their heads. School trips, piano lessons could be used for it. Otherwise it's theirs when they're adults.

If there's a mortgage on his house though it's likely there'll be some equity which will come to you once sold, although funeral costs would have to be covered first.

timeisnotaline · 08/06/2019 10:55

Presumably there will be a little bit from the house after the sale. see a lawyer as that money will be all yours.
Agree the life insurance is legal.
I would plan a roughly monthly email request to the sister about expenses coming up such as music lessons, sports equipment, holidays, school trips, just to see what she says . If she is very obstructive presumably down the track you could challenge the trust management.

Original poster
LooUpdate · 08/06/2019 11:16

So, after paying your mortgage for many years, the house has no equity?

He was really crap with money and got a really crap deal on his mortgage. He was literally paying £500+ per month on a 2 bed flat.

Did he not have life assurance attached to the mortgage

How can I find out this information without needing to contact his family? :(

If there was no will, thenYOU, as his legal wife inherit everything

What if there was nothing to inherit?

it sucks but it's not there to enable you to pay your mortgage/rent to keep a roof over their heads.

Why is that? Surely a roof is more important than piano lessons?

I would plan a roughly monthly email request to the sister about expenses coming up such as music lessons, sports equipment, holidays, school trips, just to see what she says . If she is very obstructive presumably down the track you could challenge the trust management.

This is very useful information, thank you. Things like music lessons and holidays seem so frivolous though? I would love to take them on holiday but cannot afford to do so :(

OP posts:
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