Active discussions

Meet the Other Phone. Flexible and made to last.

Meet the Other Phone.
Flexible and made to last.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Talk
Legal matters

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you have any legal concerns we suggest you consult a solicitor.

Original poster

Keeping my son in hospital against my will

434 replies

TaashenMartian · 16/12/2017 01:36

My son was born at 34 weeks on the 14th October with a heart condition. For the duration of his life (2 months) we have been in different hospitals. He is now stable enough to go home until his operation but because me and my sons dad had an argument in the hospital social services are involved and they won’t let us take him home. I have another child (a3 year old) who is still in my care and they have no plans to take her away. I want to know if they can legally keep my son in hospital due to safeguarding issues If my daughter is still in my care? Can I legally self discharge him if he is well enough to go home even though social services are involved? They have no reason to take my children from me as all it was was an argument, hence why my daughter is still in my care. But they are refusing to discharge my son until the case is resolved. Can they legally do this? What rights do I have? I feel if there are real safeguarding issues and my son can not be in my care then surely my daughter can’t either? Any advice would be much appreciated. This is incredibly stressful and I just want my son home for Christmas

OP posts:
Loveactuallyoctopus · 16/12/2017 15:39

There's no basis to assume anyone on mumsnet is telling the truth is there?

Course not but potentially making a situation worse for someone because of that is shitty.

Op has two children she's responsible for 24/7 should she abandon the eldest? I assume social services wouldn't like that either? What is she actually supposed to do?

eurochick · 16/12/2017 15:39

Being at the hospital 24/7 was definitely not the norm at the hospital our daughter was in. We usually visited 2-3 times a day, stating longer to do her "cares" leading up to discharge. And we were there more than most. Bear in mind in nicu you usually can't hold the babies as they are in incubators.

DearMrDilkington · 16/12/2017 15:42

Op, have SS been to your home for a check yet and have they spoken to your dds nursery? How often is your dd at her dads?

Sorry for all the questions but it just gives us a better idea of what the issue is.

curryforbreakfast · 16/12/2017 15:48

Being at the hospital 24/7 was definitely not the norm at the hospital our daughter was in. We usually visited 2-3 times a day, stating longer to do her "cares" leading up to discharge. And we were there more than most. Bear in mind in nicu you usually can't hold the babies as they are in incubators

That's nicu. On the childrens ward you are expected to be there with your child and care for them.

PipLongStockings · 16/12/2017 15:52

You are not expected to stay in 24/7 on the children's ward but you are expected to notify staff when you will be coming/leaving and calling to check on baby when not able to be there.

Loveactuallyoctopus · 16/12/2017 16:00

I've stayed on a children's ward with ds and I was there 24/7 Because I have no other dc, not all the parents were. I don't think they had the facilities ie beds for everyone showers etc. I was in 1 of the few private rooms and was told that was because ds was tiny and basically babies got out in rooms so their crying/night waking didn't disturb the other kids.

Animation86 · 16/12/2017 16:12

I'm just not sure the full story is here. My sister was being utterly neglected by alcoholics and domestic abuse, that even went to court, and STILL SS wanted her back with her parents when she refused (they would be supporting the family)

SS is stretched enough, as is the NHS, so I'm finding this bizarre

Kardashianlove · 16/12/2017 16:37

I can't believe that people cannot understand how it's difficult to be at a hospital 24 hours a day when you also have other children (who's other parent isn't available to look after them)

If i had another baby id find it difficult to be at a hospital 24 hours a day 7 days a week because of my first child and I have a dp who I live with!

I understand how difficult it is, I’ve been there. It’s awful, you feel like you’ve got to choose between your children.

You’ve got to find a way to make it work though, usually people take it in turns as someone has to be there to care for the DC in hospital and be with them. I was just highlighting why it may be seen as concerning, that the OP has been unable to organise someone to care for her DS when she couldn’t be there. SS may be worried that OP will struggle to manage, say when her DS goes back in for his operation, will she have to leave him at the hospital as she has no one to care for her DD. Usually parents do ‘shifts’ but this doesn’t seem the case here and maybe that plus the arguing is concerning. Or SS have made a mistake, who knows.

Those that are puzzled by being there 24 hours a day, if you took your DC to hospital, can you honestly imagine leaving them overnight or for the day? (Obviously NICU is different as you don’t usually have the choice to be there overnight even if you wanted to).

user789653241 · 16/12/2017 16:39

"Being at the hospital 24/7 was definitely not the norm at the hospital our daughter was in."

At my ds's, they were. I stayed with him for a month+, when he was a toddler. But only because I have only one child. I don't know what I could have done if I had more.

iboughtsnowboots · 16/12/2017 16:43

Are social care trying to get a voluntary agreement with you that you will not remove your baby from hospital, or is such an agreement in place? The hospital staff will not allow your baby to block a bed in a ward for very long if they are ready for discharge. I have known it to happen but usually only over a weekend while assessments are being completed after an early birth or while waiting a court order of some type being granted. Being used as social care babysitters/monitors usually makes NHS staff super grumpy. That said I have only known these situations arise when there are serious issues to be addressed often combined with additional complications.

Killerfairy · 16/12/2017 16:46

The family courts regularly do this, remove a child incase of emotional harm, even though there was no proof that it ever exsisted, so it's not a far reach to believe this is what is happening here.

op follow through on the advice you have given and make sure you scrape every penny and more on robust legal support.

Good luck

ragged · 16/12/2017 16:48

"Those that are puzzled by being there 24 hours a day, if you took your DC to hospital, can you honestly imagine leaving them overnight or for the day?"

Yes, over a 2 month period, definitely, sometimes or maybe often. I have a job that pays the bills and gives me a mental break from being a parent. There are many competent other carer adults in the hospital environment. The OP has another child who deserves time with her parents away from the hospital envt.

I knew a woman who had termination when she found out all the (painful, incurable) health problems the fetus would face if carried to term. She had 4 other young children at home and a partner who was useless at home though he worked hard and paid the bills. I always thought, on top of her stated worries about quality of life, how could she manage to visit hospital constantly for potentially years with all the other children to care for, too (one of whom promptly developed his own chronic condition about the same time).

AstridWhite · 16/12/2017 16:56

I'm inclined to agree with LoverofCake

What is interesting is that the OP has responded to other's posts since LoverofCake's post at 14.38 but she has not acknowledged LOC's post at all.

If this were my child I'd be directly engaging with LOC and others with similar concerns and doing everything I could to prove I had nothing to hide. I'd love to think it was an over-zealous rookie nurse or SW at fault here, but sadly I suspect that LOC is onto something.

Original poster
TaashenMartian · 16/12/2017 19:16

I have been at the hospital and haven’t had a chance to post back. Thankyou to the understanding people on this thread. It is IMPOSSIBLE to be at a hospital 24 hours a day when you have other children. I am there as much as I can be. I can’t leave a 3 year old alone at home lol and I certainly can’t have her there 24 hours a day, she can’t sit still for 5 minutes let alone sit in a room 24 hours a day so I can be there. I only just created this account so I could ask for some advice because I thought that’s what this forum was for: mum advice but obviously I was wrong and it’s just a way for mums to attack other mums. All I wanted was some advice from someone who had been through this, used to be a social worker or is a social worker, someone who has children who have been in hospital. A lot of the comments I’ve received have been very helpful so thankyou to those people. Some of you really need to chill out and understand when your hurtful comments aren’t wanted. This situation is one of those times when negitivity really isn’t needed or helpful

OP posts:
Original poster
TaashenMartian · 16/12/2017 19:18

And it’s the social worker who has said that couples shouldn’t argue and that is her concern, not the nurses. The nurses (and doctors) have told us he has no medical need to be there and they want him discharged. As he doesn’t need to be there it is wasting valuable NHS resources keeping him there

OP posts:
AfunaMbatata · 16/12/2017 19:21

Is the child’s father not at the hospital when you are not?

Original poster
TaashenMartian · 16/12/2017 19:22

Ss have been to my home and done that check, they have contacted my gp, my daughters nursery and my health visitor. Every check has been done. We have also had a discharge meeting that wasn’t helpful in the slightest. I have asked why they won’t let us take him home and they have stated it us because I told a nurse at the London hospital we were arguing due to stress and needed some more support. They have also said it is because we are not there 24 hours a day which other posters have agreed is impossible when I have another child. Like another poster has said: what am I actually meant to do In this situation?!

OP posts:
Original poster
TaashenMartian · 16/12/2017 19:24

I just wanted some advice as to whether this is right. If there were more to it I would understand lol but as there genuinely isn’t more too It I wanted some advice as to whether This is normal and whether they can legally keep him from me because of arguments.

OP posts:
Original poster
TaashenMartian · 16/12/2017 19:27

My partner lives and works over an hour away so he can’t be there much unfortunately. We can’t just give up our jobs and other children to care for a new baby in hospital, let’s be realistic

OP posts:
meandthem · 16/12/2017 19:28

Thanks for update - did you ask what documentation the hospital staff have been given to prevent you leaving with your baby? Have you signed anything from children's services? Are the hospital staff maintaining that because of a verbal conversation with a social worker they are not "allowed" to discharge your son?
Sorry for all the questions but children's services do not operate like this and there are legal procedures that they and everybody else has to observe.
Glad your son is doing well, by the way!

Lovemusic33 · 16/12/2017 19:32

I think it’s hard for anyone to comment without knowing the full story and your background (and your partners).

There are social workers and people with more expereance on mumsnet, hopefully they can offer more advice but the best thing you can do is seek leagal advice and find out what you rights are regarding discharging your baby from hospital. SS obviously think there’s a risk, wether they are right or not it’s not our place to say but it’s for you to prove to them. I hope you get your baby home as soon as possible. The only thing I can say about SS (from expereance) is that you need to do what ever they ask you to do to make the situation right even if you don’t think they are right.

curryforbreakfast · 16/12/2017 19:35

I just wanted some advice as to whether this is right. If there were more to it I would understand lol but as there genuinely isn’t more too It I wanted some advice as to whether This is normal and whether they can legally keep him from me because of arguments

It's normal and it isnt what happens. There IS more to it.

Trappedintheglobe · 16/12/2017 19:46

Is your ds in nicu or on a children's ward? I've had experience of both with my ds2 during the same hospital stay actually and on nicu I was encouraged to go home overnight to try and rest, I couldn't stay on the unit so it was either go home or stay in hospital accommodation which is difficult when you have other dc.

Whilst on the children's ward a parent had to be there 24/7.

I would speak to the sw manager and ask for a clear guideline of what the plan/next steps are and co-operate fully.

I hope your ds health improves and things sort out for you.

RainbowWish · 16/12/2017 20:01

Ask for it in writing that your son is well enough to cone home and take it to your lawyer. He should be able to contact/ write a letter to social worker on your behalf.

Original poster
TaashenMartian · 16/12/2017 20:06

The hospital have no documentation from ss to keep him there. I also havnt signed anything from children’s services. The hospital said today that they are waiting for a call from ss about when they can discharge him. They have said they want him discharged ASAP as that is what is in my sons best interest. I have asked today whether they have been told they cannot discharge him or whether they have decided not to for their own reasons. They have said it is because of ss so I am now questioning whether ss have the duristiction to do this. Posters on here have said they don’t and that they can’t legally keep him there without a court order. Today I have asked if they will discharge him, they are going to speak to me properly about it tomorrow. The hospital have agreed that it is at our discretion whether or not we listen to advice from ss to not discharge him as until the have a court order he is still under my care and I have rights over him as a parent

OP posts: