TTC no.2 after successful IVF for no.1

[Chocoholic85]

Hi,
I’m just after some advice and to see whether anyone is in the same boat!
Just found out that my 3rd FET failed.
We are very lucky to have DD who came from our first fresh transfer. We were also very fortunate to get 5 frozen embryos from that round so have been trying for a sibling. 1st FET was BFN, 2nd was a chemical pregnancy/early miscarriage and 3rd now is failed. Down to the last two and starting to feel the pressure and also wondering why on earth it isn’t working?!
We have unexplained infertility so nothing was ever found with our initial tests and I was 34 when we had out first IVF round so odds were in our favour. I read somewhere that at 34 around 50% of embryos are abnormal so I guess out our 6 maybe the last 3 were all abnormal. I’m also worried something has changed since I had to have a csection for DD. I did have an ultrasound which showed the scar had healed fine and there no niches, I’m wondering if there are adhesions that might not have been seen on the ultrasound though.
Would love to hear any advice for what to do next or from anyone else in a similar position. Thanks x

@loulamay im so sorry to hear about your embryos, of course it'll be a shock and with six you will have hoped for one or two to be ok. Im sure it will take a few days to adjust. It's such a hard journey. I hope Malaysia is amazing and youre having a wonderful time.

@KLM25 I think I've always done 5 days progesterone too. Your lining sounds good, glad you got some reassurance regarding the follicle!

Thanks @SErunner, we're having a lovely time and I'm finding it a bit of a distraction which is good! I'm waking up quite a lot in the night to go and check which is annoying but if I don't go I just lie there worrying. I'm sure the scan will come round quickly enough.

@SErunner I'm ok! Onto another cycle too and ovulation is approaching 🙏 really hoping this is the month and trying to manifest it but I know it doesn't work like that Haha!! How long you been trying? X

Glad you're having a good time @Eggling. Hope you get a bit more settled sleep soon. I understand the anxiety though and it's hard to switch it off. Your scan must not be too far away?

@Swirls346 yes same here, not far off ovulation hopefully although I've given up doing any testing etc to check. I came off contraception in spring 2019 and haven't been on any since. We had our daughter via IVF in summer 2021. But actively trying to have a sibling for a bit over a year. We had two failed transfers this summer but are having a break for now. I've never conceived naturally so don't have much hope but our consultant very much supports us trying naturally for now and says it's possible we could. We're saving up to do another fresh round next spring/summer hopefully.

Fingers crossed for both of you @SErunner and @Swirls346 !

@Eggling so happy to hear that you're having a nice time, despite the worry. Do you have the Calm app or anything like that to listen to? I sometimes did that in the first trimester and it didn't erase the worry but it helped ease it a little occasionally.

I emailed our clinic and they were as surprised as we were about the results - said the embryos were all top grade and they are putting it down to terrible luck. I asked about trying again and they fully support it. A tiny part of my cynic brain thinks that they would say that because of course it's more money for them, but having done some reading on actual percentages of euploids by age, I think 6 decent embryos should have definitely yielded one or two that we could have transferred and so I think I am going to do another retrieval (we have budgeted for 3 goes) and hope that our luck changes next time. I can't decide if we should try and squeeze it in before Christmas or wait until January. I think I will ask them if it will make any difference and go from there.

I just went for a run! an actual run. Amazing. DD is with her grandies - we told them the results and they have been wonderful and just told me to relax and they will look after her and feed us - so nice to have a break from the day to day chaos and endless jobs :-)

Glad you enjoyed your run @loulamay and that your in laws are being very hospitable! Running really helps my headspace. What was your reasoning for doing PGT-A? Did they come back as aneuploid or mosaic? I was reading the HFEA update the other day after the piece on BBC news. It only really recommends use of PGT-A for those with recurrent miscarriage. Might be worth a read if you haven't seen it already? www.hfea.gov.uk/treatments/treatment-add-ons/pre-implantation-genetic-testing-for-aneuploidy-pgt-a/

To add, really glad your clinic are supportive of you doing another round if that's what you want x

Thanks @SErunner , yes I’ve decided to take the Lubion at around 2pm as that seems to work well logistically! With a few previous transfers I took it at the same time as the Clexane after our little boy had gone to bed, which felt hard going, so it feels easier to do them separately. I’m doing one pessary when I get into bed and the other one in the morning, they’re not quite 12 hours apart as advised but I’ve decided not to worry too much about that. They’ll be testing my progesterone Monday anyway.
I also meant to say, I was sorry to hear your period arrived, I know it would have been disappointing. Fingers crossed for a new month and a different result!

@Eggling Glad to hear you’re having a good time. I expect you’d be checking more if you were at home, so it’s bound to be a bit of a distraction, plus great to have some sunshine too 😊 Have you got a scan organised or will you wait to sort it out when you get home?
Thank you, yes 5 days of progesterone seems pretty standard doesn’t it, so I’m not sure why 4 days was suggested. It’s all sorted out now anyway. My latest query has been about embryoglue. I think they used it for every transfer I had in Prague, obviously with varying success. It’s never been mentioned at my new clinic but it’s a little niggle in my mind so I’ve emailed them this morning to see what they say. Not sure if any of you guys have used it? It seems to be yet another unproven add-on but because it worked for me the first time I can’t help wondering if I should ask for it again.

@loulamay Really glad to hear that your clinic have been supportive and you’ve got the beginnings of a plan. Sounds like a good idea to ask them about the timings. I’m sure it wouldn’t make much difference to delay it another month and go after Christmas if that works better for you logistically.

Yay for going for a run! Are you near the sea where you’re staying? I’m picturing beautiful sunny surroundings! Although I always enjoy a run with a different route whatever the surroundings really. It works wonders for my headspace too, I’m really missing it, but don’t want to risk it at the moment. My OH is doing a 10k tomorrow morning (he’s dreading it as feels he hasn’t trained enough) so we’re all going along to that and I’ll see how well I can entertain our DS whilst he’s running ☺️

Fantastic as well that you’re being well looked after ❤️ Your in-laws sound wonderful and just what you need at the minute x

Thanks @KLM25. I actually have been feeling much better and thought I'd got into the 'what will be will be' headspace. But then this morning when I was out with our daughter she started talking about babies and sisters and brothers. I could see it coming but the 'whose my sister' 'when I have a sister' was still a bit of a dagger to the heart. I know it will be a topic that will come up but this is the first time I've had to deal with it. Hopefully she'll move on to something else soon!

thanks @SErunner - all aneuploid annoyingly! If any were mosiac then the clinic have a geneticist that you can talk to apparently but we didn't even get that chance!

5 miscarriages and one chemical pregnancy to my name sadly. I just couldn't face the trauma of another one which is why I will only transfer embryos I know to be euploid. Although the six that haven't; made it is super upsetting, to me, that represents the avoidance of 6 potential miscarriages, so I feel better that we know where we stand at least.

@KLM25 we're in Perth and not far from the beach although my run was around a little lake near my in-laws' house. Weather is lovely and warm but not too hot - perfect!

I'm so sorry @loulamay. That makes perfect sense then and yes I can see how in a strange way knowing you've avoided more heartbreak is a good thing. I hope you can have a lovely break - definitely make the most of the in-laws support!

Anyone else cursing the clocks going back?! This is the first time she's been old enough for it to cause a huge issue really. It's going to be a LONG day.....

I am back after a break from this thread as I had a failed FET from my 2020 round and then a failed round of IVF in July. Anywhere our next cycle is booked for December, and I have just found out I am pregnant despite us having male factor!!!

Ah @SErunner its so hard when they talk about babies and brothers and sisters. It does feel a bit different than trying for the first in that you're trying to give them something as well as you. Im sure she'll be on something else tomorrow! Well done for handling it though.

@KLM25 I've never used embryo glue, I did look at it at one point and I think it's one of those things some clinics like and some don't - I'm sure I read that some US clinics use it as standard. Worth asking about anyway!

@loulamay it makes sense to think of the embryos like that, I guess it's a small silver lining in a way though not one you'd hope for. Glad you're getting a plan in place.

@Purtyburty congratulations! I've heard of this happening to quite a few people. Have you spoken to your clinic about next steps?

We fly home tomorrow and I'm quite looking forward to a bit of normality (and nursery giving me a break 😅). My scan is next Thursday (9th) - I obviously have every possibility on my mind and it still feels ages away but I know it'll come round.

Thanks @Eggling. It's a hot topic of conversation for the time being so we're just going to have to ride it out! In fairness the more she says it the less it's affecting me! Hope your flight goes okay. Yes time off with no childcare is a bit of a double edged sword isn't it! I love having more time with our DD but am then very glad of a break once we're back into normal routine 😬😂 will be thinking of you and wishing you well on Thurs x

@KLM25 sorry I missed the question re embryoglue. I've never used it either. My clinic aren't big on add-ons I don't think. They have them on their price list but don't seem to encourage them. I'm not sure the evidence supports its use but equally im sure there's no harm if you want to for reassurance? Like @Eggling im sure I've read some international clinics use it as standard.

@Purtyburty congratulations, wishing you well with this journey. Hope all goes smoothly for you 🤞😀

Aw that’s a tough one with your DD @SErunner, sounds like you’re handling it really well though and like you say, the first mention of it will always be the hardest and then it won’t upset you as much.

Thanks to you and @Eggling for the advice re the embryoglue. It became an easy decision in the end, as I emailed the clinic at the weekend and they got back to me quite quickly to say that they don’t currently offer it. So I was quite happy with that and feel like at least we’ve saved some money! It’s impossible to know whether it helps implantation or not. It was silly really, it was because I’ve been trying to perfectly recreate our successful transfer - but I was thinking the other day that I had acupuncture before and after that transfer, and I stopped having that a few transfers ago as I wasn’t finding it particularly relaxing. Never mind the whole added expense of it as well. So I was never going to be able to do things the exact same way. My medication and timings are the same so I’m happy enough with that!

On that subject, I now have one little embryo onboard ❤️😊 I was quite nervous this morning, about my bladder weirdly, as I don’t think I drank enough water last time, but I still didn’t want to overdo it this time round and be really uncomfortable! It all worked out ok though. They project a picture of your embryo onto the wall just before the transfer and the embryologist explains it all. Anyway I thought it looked like it was hatching and the embryologist confirmed that it was, so that was a surprise and gave me some hope, possibly misplaced hope, but I’ll take it! They also gave me a picture which didn’t happen last time, so I was quite happy about that, and I honestly walked out of the clinic feeling on top of the world ☺️ I’ve calmed down a bit now, I’ve had a bit of a walk and I’m just going to chill out tonight and have an early night. Flying home tomorrow afternoon.

Hope you had an easy journey home @Eggling. I know just what you mean, it’s nice to get back to the normal routine sometimes. Hope you’re feeling ok and the days go quickly until your scan.

Hope you’re having a great time @loulamay, the weather sounds perfect. It’s been quite sunny here in Barcelona so that’s been great, feels strange to be wearing short sleeves and sandals when it’s November tomorrow.

Congratulations @Purtyburty, that’s wonderful news, will keep everything crossed for you x

Ah fantastic @KLM25! Glad you have a lovely embryo on board, hopefully getting nice and snug in there. It's great you're feeling positive, ride that wave as long as you can!

We had a rough journey home, there was a couple in front of us on the plan and around half an hour in the man in front of me turned round and shouted at DD for kicking his chair. The thing is she hadn't - she wasn't behind him and her legs didn't reach! She had kicked his wife's chair by accident at the start of the flight and I told her off and kept her legs away from the chair after that. What she had done was get her water bottle out of the seat pocket and put it away a few times. Anyway, he kept on and eventually I said quite firmly "she is two years old and we are doing our best" to which he replied "well it's not good enough". I then cried for about an hour as I'm obviously a pathetic hormonal mess. Cabin crew were nearby and actually had a word worth him about it and he apologised to me (somewhat grudgingly). They were travelling with their family including grandchildren so it's not like they knew nothing about kids, and DD really wasn't being naughty at all (she was annoying as toddlers are but she was really good all things considered), I get her using the seat pocket might be annoying but a) that's part of commercial flying and b) he could have had a calm word with me rather than having a go at a 2 year old? Everyone else on the flight was extra nice to us after and DD seemed not to understand he was being mean (and got a few fruit shoot so she was happy). Anyway, a minor thing overall but not nice to end things on a sour note. It was ridiculous how I just couldn't stop crying though, I felt so stupid 😅 I've never been good at getting "told off" but literally being told my parenting wasn't good enough definitely touched a nerve.

Oh @Eggling he sounds horribly unreasonable! Glad the cabin crew and other passengers supported you. Easier said than done but I would definitely try and put it to the back of your mind - there are just some nasty people on this planet! As you say, she's 2, what exactly was he expecting? Very surprising behaviour as he was travelling with young children too. Sounds like you handled it really well. Tears totally acceptable - it's horrible being targeted in public.

Delighted you've got an embryo on board @KLM25! And sounds like all went as well as it good. Glad the decision was made for you re the embryo glue too - that makes it easier! When do you fly back? Jealous of the bit of sunshine, it's tediously rainy here at the moment.

Aw @Eggling, what bad luck to end up sitting behind an idiot like that. I swear these people forget they ever had young kids themselves. He was the one misbehaving, a grown man who should know better and the fact that the cabin crew had to have a word with him about his behaviour says it all. I hate confrontation too, so I can completely understand why you were upset, especially with your hormones being all over the place! I bet you’ll feel much better tomorrow once you’ve had a good nights sleep and you’ll just be able to look back on the lovely week you’ve had ❤️
Thank you! Yes I always quite like this part, let’s hope I can keep the positivity going for a few days at least 😝 x

Thanks so much@SErunner! Yes it was great not having the option of the embryo glue as then I didn’t have to worry I’d made the wrong decision ☺️ Flying back tomorrow afternoon. Don’t have to check out of the hotel until 12 so it’ll be lovely not having to rush in the morning x

Thanks both of you, yes I'll probably have forgotten all about it soon! I'm headed for bed as soon as I get DD to sleep, hope you all have peaceful nights x

Unfortunately I am bleeding and cramping this morning. At the clinic now but I'm fairly sure this is another loss. I feel completely numb to be honest, I can't believe this is happening again. DH is distraught.

@Eggling I am so sorry. Keep us updated with what the clinic says. Sending huge amounts of support and strength x

Thank you @SErunner. We've had the scan, there is a yolk sac and fetal pole with a heartbeat but quite a large subchorionic haemorrhage. This is roughly what happened last time. The consultant was very good and they simply can't say at the moment, I am going back in for a scan on Tuesday provided nothing major happens between now and then.

@Eggling I am sending you all of the luck and good vibes that I can possibly muster. Seeing the heartbeat is a good sign though? I'm so sorry if I missed any messages about your previous loss, it but hopefully the bleeding now is just being caused by the sch? Keep us updated when you can xxx

PS. wanted to punch your plane guy in the face.

Thanks @loulamay, I had a previous loss in February where bleeding started at 5 weeks spotting then big bleed at 5+5 where I thought I'd lost it, then a scan a few days later showed a heartbeat but lots of blood and I'm fairly sure the pregnancy ended that night although it wasn't confirmed until my next scan a week later. The miscarriage was then really drawn o it and took about a month to resolve. So it's hard feeling like I'm back with that uncertainty again. I think on the plus side the heamatoma (sp?) seems to be away from the yolk sac but it is quite large, and obviously any bleeding is worrying and traumatic. The consultant was really clear that there's nothing we have done that could have caused it and we just have to wait and see, I had bloods done too so waiting for a call about those and guessing I might have to repeat the hcg. I've told my line managers who have been lovely, and a few friends I was due to have a spa day with this weekend as I just want to be resting at home now.

I’m so sorry to read your update @Eggling, it’s extremely tough to go through this uncertainty. Tuesday must seem like an age away. Really pleased that you saw a heartbeat and they’ve identified the cause of the bleeding, plus that sounds like a really good sign that it’s away from the yolk sac. Glad work have been supportive, resting at home is definitely the best thing at the moment.
I’m sending lots of love and obviously keeping everything crossed for you x