ABC IVF thread continued

[StarryHannah]

Our other thread is now full so thought I would start this one to continue the chat.

@Beaglemum91 I'm waiting for my period so I can start meds for FET so that is really helpful information about the embryo transfer process. Thank you. Did you have your partner on Facetime or anything for it?

@Icsi2021 so excited for you xxx

@Hoping4baby21
I did the rubella with the NHS as I was referred to the fertility clinic at the Whittington and we did all the tests there. But then NHS waiting is so long that I decided to go privately. After I've given all the details ABC was fine with that.

When do you do the THS test? Is it before the treatment or while you do the scans during stimulations? I can ask the question.

I am taking sick leave, HR told me to do. I want to keep my holidays to go abroad over summer for a nice relaxing holiday after IVF.

@Clapham4 I wasn’t great today really but it’s still raw. I think the pressure of not having to work with children until next week is helping just not looking forward to the withdrawal bleed but my partner and I have spoken about doing another transfer in the school holidays so there is no pressure of having to hide it from work people. Hoping all works out for you getting onto ABC! Xx

@lawandgin Thankyou xx

@Hoping4baby21 yes it really does feel like that! I am 28, but my partner is 41 so pressure feels there as he doesn’t want to be a older dad which I do understand and going through this process you know how important it is to TTC before your time runs out. Xx

@unCliche totally relate there, as awful as it sounds if you knew what the issue was then you can accept it and find a way past it but with this situation you constantly over think it and blame everything when really it’s just nature and when naturally conceiving everything says it’s 20% success rate every month but the people who get pregnant after one time just make it looo easy 🙈. It’s hard when you know your partner has an problem because they automatically blame themselves no matter what you say to make it better. When my partner did his sample it was borderline low, no reason for it just happened like that and then he kept saying to me if i was with someone else I wouldn’t be going through this. Just such a viscous over thinking cycle, that puts so much pressure on a relationship. Xx

@kittyfantastico21 ahhh user! That is handy with Wimbledon going somewhere else for bloods at Harley street is annoying but totally first world problems and it isn't that far in reality just a lot of back and forth. When I did my TSH they just gave me a form and I paid there and that was that. Should surely be able to do the same for progesterone.

@unCliche I used some sick leave days - said I was having medical treatment it was on a Thursday and I work Monday, Tuesday, wed. So I was off but told them treatment was on the following Tuesday. Then I took 3 days of annual leave for after transfer but it worked out like an almost 2 weeks off for me to cover the whole period. I would take some time off if I was you . This is an intense process and it was nice not to deal with all their crap at the same time. I did not feel comfortable telling them exactly what was happening and it is none of their business but for a few days (up to 7) you don't need a sick note so they don't need a reason other than medical treatment or say surgery which is what I said.

@Clapham4 have you had your baseline scan? They also let you proceed with you AFC which they do at the baseline scan. I didn't need to do AMH blood test because of it. So i don't think it would mean you can't move forward. Unless I'm missing something.

Ladies doing a FET did they tell you meds are in addition to the FET price? They said that to me and I can get meds from another pharmacy (ASDA is cheapest by the way)? And I think I recall her saying bloods aren't included either if I remember correctly. Is that right?

@Francesmalin that's good of your workplace it should totally be classed as sick leave. I tried to get note from my doctor but they were being difficult and it wasn't worth the stress at the time. And 3 days leave is ok. As I'm part time I don't need to use holiday for a lot of things. TSH needs to be down before you start so they know to add the medicine to you order.

Finally got my AMH this morning. It’s 18 so I should be good to go!!

Aaaannnnddd now I’m terrified🙈

@Francesmalin TSH has to be done before you start. The level can take a few weeks to come down once you start taking the medication so if it is too high you'll need to take thyroxine for a few weeks and then be re-tested.

@Hoping4baby21 I don't think any blood tests would be included in the FET cycle price. From my consultation it sounded like they don't generally do any blood tests as standard in a FET cycle because they're only really looking at your lining. Yes, they also told me meds would be extra and that Asda was probably cheaper!

@Clapham4 great news that your AMH is fine! Taking the first step to get started is really daunting but just take it one thing at a time and remember that the end goal will be so worth it. And we're all here to listen and help you cope with your fears!

@Clapham4 Yay, congrats! I think it's normal to be terrified, I felt really weird at my scan yesterday, like is this really happening! I had my consultation this morning. The good news was I have been accepted and that my TSH was normal (2.25). The bad news and the news I was definitely not expecting was that I am not immune to rubella! I know I've had all of my childhood jabs so they've said I can either prove that, be re-vaccinated or send a waiver to say that I acknowledge the potential risks and want to proceed anyway. I am currently on hold to my GP surgery (42 minutes and counting....) to see if I can get hold of my vaccination record. So annoying! AF is due next week and Lucinda said we won't have everything ready by then so it looks like I'll be starting end of July/early August (periods are a bit hit and miss).

@lawandgin I had the same earlier this year! Apparently after 20 years it can wear off so I had to get my rubella vaccinations redone for when I was pursuing the NHS route as you have to have rubella immunity. Really annoyingly it’s 2 vaccines and the tell you not to try those month (after researching there’s no basis for this). Not sure what ABC will say with wait times. But I spent hours researching and the rate of Rubella is so low in the UK so if I was in your shoes I’d sign the waiver rather than go through the hoops and lose out on time. Lots of women who conceive naturally will no longer have rubella immunity and be none the wiser, we just know because it’s a requirement. ENTIRELY your own personal decision though on what you do! Really glad everything else was okay xxx

@Clapham4 I'm kind of glad I'm not the only one as DH gave me that look of "it could only happen to you" :-) I completely agree, I am not going to be re-vaccinated. I know I've had it done, rates are low etc. I will try and get copies of my vaccination records but if I can't, I will just sign the waiver. I don't want any further delay - we are away at the end of September so then we'd need to wait until the end of October which I'd obviously rather not do!

I've managed to get medical leave at work. I got really emotional telling the department P.A. (via email) that I was having IVF but she was lovely and told me if I needed extra days off to recover, that I should let her know. I WFH anyway so I can always get back onto my laptop after a scan or something.

DH also did another semen analysis and his count has doubled! He no longer has low sperm count, however his morphology has gone for 4% to 3%. I'm in half a mind to keep trying naturally but I think his numbers are great for IVF either way. I also worry that there could be something wrong with me and his sperm is only half the problem.

How's everyone doing anyway? Most of us are just waiting for our cycle to start right?

@unCliche that is great!! What changes did he make to get such an improvement?

What tests have you had? Is there anything so far that has indicated an issue with you? I know Dior. This process the mind likes to overthink and play tricks so it's easy to look for a reason or explanation.

I'm having a very meh day and I can't put my finger on it. This fertility stuff is such a mindf**k. I keep flipping between not going forward with surgery and going to FET is the right call to what if it wasn't and there is something wrong with me that we need to do the surgery to find out. I'm also ovulating today and might be a little sad that it's pointless and futile and feels like a waste. I get ovulation pain so can't ignore it and I track with OPK before fertility treatment so I can be fairly sure of my period and start date. Ive had a few cycles where my period went rogue and I don't plan to be caught out like that again with the am I pregnant am I not mind tennis! I've just gone and brought myself some new books to read so I can get buried in them instead of overthinking everything.

I think this thread most of us are in limbo so not much action going on.

Hope everyone is doing ok!

@Hoping4baby21 He cut back on caffeine and also reduced his alcohol intake. We've both been very active now that summer is here, which is always a good thing. I told him he needed to take control of his own fertility so he looked into vitamins and bought the one that he felt was best for him. He's been taking it religiously for almost a month (without me "nagging" him) but it's difficult to tell if it's the vitamins that have made the impact.

I've only ever had blood tests and scans. Maybe it's worth having a HyCoSy to have my fallopian tubes checked? I had a small 1cm fibroid but it seems to have disappeared. Ovaries and endometrium always looks fine. I ovulate every cycle and AF always shows up on time, although my LP is short so could have hormone balance issues. I've been on progesterone before and that didn't do much to help my LP, I even started spotting on them. AF is generally painless and flow is pretty steady, but endometriosis might be something to consider because you don't always get symptoms.

It's so hard! Trying to make sense of the unknown. There's always that "what if?" question because we must know if there's something wrong with us. I think you should go for the FET. You have the embryos and it won't matter if there is or isn't something wrong with your tubes. If this is something wrong with your tubes, you'd need IVF anyway and if there's isn't anything wrong, you'd probably still continue with the IVF, unless you wanted to continue trying naturally. I'll be ovulating in a few days. I also get ovulation pain so it's hard to ignore what's happening in my body too. DH and I will probably DTD and hope for the best this cycle. Enjoy your books! I should probably get back to reading if I'm going to be having a busy few weeks of IVF!

@unCliche that is awesome! And good on your for saying he should take it into his own hands. I too had to have a frank convo with my husband a while back that I shouldn't have to remind him. I'm about to put my body through a lot and you can't even take some tablets. He's been on it ever since.

You are right and I do feel going for the FET is the right call. I had a few conversations with the nurse the main things I was worried about was hydrosalphinx and endo although I have no symptoms. They said they would see hydrosalphinx on the scan (change of missing it is slim) and endo large areas they would see it on the 3D scan but small areas they wouldn't. I don't have symptoms so I'm trying not to worry to much about it because I think I would just drive myself crazy. I imagine you wouldn't have it as they either would have seen it proud would have some symptoms. But I'm not a medical professional.

My AF is regular (few wonky ones due to stress) I do get cramps but flow is good and it isn't full of clots or anything i use a cup lol so have got to know my flow very well since then!

I'm not doing the HyCoSy right now because like you said it doesn't affect IVF. Just have to trust the professionals and so far my cycle went well no sign of egg quality or sperm quality issues so although not successful we did learn some stuff we didn't know before.

Good luck trying naturally this cycle especially as the sample improved so much!

Hi all,

wondering if anyone of you with more experience have some insight because I just am unable to to find real answers.
I am 33 and started an egg freezing cycle with ABC IVF Hardley street. So far I am really disappointed. Doctor was unprofessional (not introducing herself, not having time or giving much information) My scans and amh all seemed fine prior to starting my cycle (AMH testest 15.4 and a 2 months later 21- weird I know, no one can explain it it seems) But I was shocked and distraught this Friday at my first scan that I only had 13 follicles and only 5 were growing. I started on 150 IU ovaleap and after Friday's scan upped to 220IU. I have no symptoms what so ever. Previously my AFC had been 20 and 16 respectively. Even the doctor seemed shocked and unclear on what to do. I am really upset as I hoped I'd do this once and forget about it. I'm now thinking they're approach to scan me only after 5 days and not tailor the dose to me was a bad idea. They keep trying to convince me of quality over quantity but Im only freezing so no idea of quality untill I use them, so surely it's better to freeze more. I'm super desperate and distraight because they then 'all of a sudden' said my AMH results weren't that good and that since I'm over 30 my fertility is rapidly declining month on month. A month ago they assured me the AMH and my age were good. I don't know what to do and have no one to talk too. So not sure of the treatment I should be getting and what this unexpected lower number of follicles means? Have another scan tomorrow (today is cycle day 8) and I am dejected and lost all hope of a good collection. I was hoping to freeze at least 15. I read alot of women on this thread who seem to get a good amount of eggs, just wondering how you all got there. Thanks, Sil.

Hello, I wonder if sb could chare with me how much you had to pay for one IVF or ICSI cycle all in. They seemed to be the cheapest online but when I rang them it appeared to be not the case and their representative on the phone sounded annoyed with me as I was asking all the prices for separate bits. I'm looking at doing ICSI cycle including leftover embryo freezing and storage for at least a year. Thank you

@sil19 sorry you are feeling disappointed in your cycle. ABC as well as create focus on mild IVF and so the aim is to get quality eggs vs quantity of eggs. Each cycle differs and so although you AFC is high (similar number to mine) you may not always see a ton of eggs comes through once on stims. Potentially if I was starting on the same cycle they say my 25 AFC I would have had more. I got 7 eggs retrieved and those 7 were in the lead from the first scan on day 5.

I believe day 5 scan is normal across clinics of you think about it you start stims on day2 so that's only 3 days of injections and for it to do its job. As they increased your dose you may very well see more come through but may not. I get how that can be disappointing especially as you wanted it to be done. My experience however is that those eggs were good quality and the number of blasts or frozen embryos is inline with those who do congenital IVF but gets loads of eggs at retrieval. They still only end up with a few blasts. This speaks to the quality issue when on high doses of stims.

I know your situation is different as you are just freezing eggs and the thaw success rate is different but potentially with mild the same is true better quality equals better thaw rates? Don't quote me that is just speculation.

I don't think any of us have gone through anything different than you have so if anything it is just how your body reacted to the stims or what your AFC was right at her beginning of your cycle.

If you would like to focus on getting as many eggs as possible and you will go again potentially ABC is not the clinic for you and more congenital IVF would be better.

I would add that they DO tailor the dose to you, most will be on 150 but that is based on research that this dose for most will garner the same response as if they were on a higher dose. You can look into those research papers yourself as well. They also tailor it on your BMI. There are people in this group who have been on higher doses. As you AFC/AMH was good they wouldn't do a higher dose to avoid/minimise OHSS risk.

From what I know and I don't know your specific age but an AFC of 20 is good so not sure why you were being told it isn't. I haven't had my AMH taken and don't know much about it but I believe to correlated with AFC, so if your AFC is good I would be surprised your AMH is not.

Finally, I found the nurses really good to talk to and have a lot of knowledge so I would write down all your questions and go through them with the nurse or at a scan. I really hope they are able to reassure you and that your egg collection goes well. It is a hard thing to go through with so many unknowns. Each time is a learning process and should you need another round you will be more informed and able to make choices that reflect this acquired knowledge. Best of luck!

@yustynne I found their prices pretty clear on their website and it breaks it down for IVF cycle and and IVF/ICSI cycle. Have a look at their prices page. Freezing and storage will be about £995 for two years, £795 for 1 year and £395 for 3 months. Meds are included for a fresh cycle. I would still say they are cheaper because a cycle elsewhere would be about £6 before the ICSI and the storage.

Thx @Hoping4baby21 I have my day 8 scan tomorrow. Btw I'm 33. I'm worried about quantity because I know eggs don't survive thawing as good as embryo's do.
What has frustrated me about abc has beeb their information and my dr. They were clearly surprises and shocked by my results in the scan and I was absolutely not prepared either. They don't really make it clear that they won't do a stronger approach if things dont go to plan. As im new I had no idea what to expect.
But most of all the way they suddenly changed their tune when my scan was below expectation really bothered me. First my afc and amh and age were fine. Then all of a sudden my amh was borderline and I'm above 30 so its not going to be great. Then they indicated my fertility was prob rapidly declining which is why my follicles had gone down. But no explanation was given I was ushered out of the office and told to get councelling instead of explaining what was happening.
I don't think ill go with them again. I wasnt planning on doing a second cycle. I now think I prob have to. My next scan is tomorrow I will bring up my issuea and demand someone take the time to explain my results and their approach. But rn im just dejected and feel like i wasted money b4 I even got to the finish line. Im also not feeling any cramps or anything which contributes to my feelinf that nothing is happening.
I really dont get why im on such a low dose. I have quite a high bmi as well so the meds have to work harder for me as it is. Have you done multiple cycles with them? Do they change their approach the 2nd time?

@unCliche great news on your husband's improved SA results! I'm sorry you've been feeling worried about something being wrong on your end. I hope you're feeling better today!

@Hoping4baby21 hope you're feeling better about things today!

I think with IVF because we know so much detail about what's happening in the process and know so much about all the variables and factors and all the things that could go wrong, it's really easy to assume that one of those things will go wrong even if we have no evidence to suggest that. I'm pretty prone to anxiety anyway but IVF is definitely adding a whole range of new things to worry about. For example, this weekend I spent time fairly convinced I had: toxoplasmosis, endometriosis, a cervix that won't open meaning they won't be able to do ET at all, and that because I have a retroverted uterus, if I make it as far as an early pregnancy scan they won't be able to see anything so they'll decide it's an ectopic when really it's just too far away to see on a scan. I have no reason to think any of these are likely to happen! But because I want this to work so much, all I can think about is all the reasons why it might not. My wife always says 'don't meet trouble half-way', much easier said than done, but I think as you both don't have symptoms/evidence from tests you've had of anything being wrong, try to hold on to the positive evidence you have and remind yourselves of all the reasons why IVF could work.

@yustynne I think ABC will still come out cheaper overall as their cycle price includes drugs while other clinics don't. The only extras I've paid for (on top of the cycle package price) have been embryo storage and a FET cycle (at a discounted rate) because I was at risk of OHSS so couldn't have a fresh transfer.

@sil19 I'm sorry you've had bad experiences with ABC so far. I hope your scan today goes better than you're expecting! Hopefully some more of the follicles will grow as you get towards the end of stims, especially now your dose has been increased. I wouldn't worry about no symptoms - I didn't have any symptoms until the couple of days before EC (and at that point I was high risk for OHSS). Definitely talk to the nurse at your scan about your feelings and ask for some clarity on their approach. I hope they can answer your questions and help you feel better about your treatment.

@sil19 I see, I'm sorry you weren't able to get the answers you need or the clarity you need. I have found the nurse Edyta to be really informative and patient and nice.

I don't think ABC would change much next time around but perhaps they would give you a higher dose so it might be worth you going elsewhere if that is what you decide.

I feel the comment about your fertility declining rapidly is a little hasty especially with no further explanation as to WHY they are saying that.

I think a lot of this process is feeling comfortable with your doctors and clinic and if you don't feel comfortable then I think you should move on. Even if you get 7 or 8 eggs that is still more than you had before which are frozen. You then do another cycle elsewhere and have that batch as well.

The tricky thing is they don't know HOW you will respond until you go through a cycle. I highly recommend researching things yourself as it helped me feel more in the loop with what was happening and decisions being made. I understood the process more. They do this day in day out and don't explain all the finer details which for some is overwhelming and for others reassuring. I fit into the later category. That might help you aswell. I hope it all goes well for you in the end.

@kittyfantastico21 you could have been describing me there in your post! I do the same but your wife is right and I keep going back to that myself. There is currently no evidence of these things so I have to trust in the science, the process and the professionals. Until I have information that indicates otherwise.

My friend had a dream the other day that I did have a hydrosalphinx and that was the problem, when she told me this I was like erm your not helping! But then she explained in her culture if you have a bad dream about someone you tell them and it won't come true. Anyway I've put it to bed now based on all I know it doesn't seem likely that is the case.

I'm sorry your anxiety is being triggered it sucks. I've found that when it becomes to much I avoid all infertility related stuff online and spend more time away from my phone, I'm sure you have your own ways to try and help as well.

@Hoping4baby21 Hope you feel better1 & @kittyfantastico21
thanks both for your help.

Had my 2nd scan this morning. Looks better now, and did talk to the nurse about what had happened during my last scan and she cleared everything up for me and took the time to explain everything. Thanks so much also for your insights, I was so distraught after the lack of information given and the nurse was quite good about receiving the feedback. I do think they are very wrong for letting patients leave upset like that and without information and some of the things that were said to me. With the right information the massive panic and stress this weekend could have been avoided.

Just to make everyone aware if you are choosing ABC; 150IU is the max they give to start with so if you are doing a cycle with them and don't respond or respond well to it. They won't do a 2nd cycle but refer you somewhere else as they won't change the protocol to up the dose from the start.

Hope everyone is doing well in their cycle. My ER is likely this weekend. Don't know what I will do next as I know I won't have as many eggs as I would like. Also not keen on paying double storage fees.

@Hoping4baby21 thank you, and I'm sorry you've been feeling anxious too. I do try not to be online so much in the evenings/weekends. I feel like the pandemic is making all of this so much harder because I can't do all the things I would usually do like go to the theatre, cinema, see friends etc so life has been reduced to only work and IVF! At least there's lots of good sport on TV at the moment to distract me a bit.

@sil19 I'm glad to hear your second scan went better and that the nurse explained everything. I hope your EC will give you better results than you're expecting. You could perhaps pay the storage fees at ABC for the shortest amount of time (3 months I think) and then move your frozen eggs to a new clinic if you decide to go elsewhere so that long-term you'd only be paying to store eggs at one clinic.

Just thought I would give you an update about going forward.

Had my review today and the consultant was lovely and made us feel very reassured. He was very apologetic for the after care although it was not his fault. My counseling session was cancelled last week 3 minutes before it started as my patient coordinator missed an email from the counselor being double booked so that topped it all off.

We are going ahead with a FET next cycle as we are both teachers and want to make sure it is in the summer holidays. The consultant said that my lining was just under 7mm from the last scan I had even though I was told is was 7.4mm.

He said for my next transfer I will be on a higher dose of medication to thicken the lining. I did feel like my withdrawal bleed was very similar to my usual bleed. I was expecting to be in pain but didn’t feel a thing! Our next embryo, if all goes well, is a 4BB which he said was good.

Hope you are all okay.

@Hopeful1234567 glad your review provided you with some reassurance. Who did you meet with? I havent see a guy at ABC Harley Street? Maybe you are with another clinic or I just am not aware which is totally possible (as if I would know them all lol). Glad you can go on your next cycle as well - do you know when that might be? Will you be mid July like some of us?

I'm having a really meh day. I went down an IVF internet rabbit hole and I'm not really sure why it is getting to me, if anything what I saw was reassuring for our specific situation so far. But I did stumble on a child free space on the internet and adoption space and they had not very nice things to say about people who go through IVF. It always shocks me that people think that way. I'm someone who thinks as long as you aren't hurting anyone do what feels right for you. As if we are putting ourselves through all of this for some asinine reason our loss or grief or desires are unnecessary and somewhere people are judging and laughing at us. Oh is makes me so fucking mad. All I can say is DONT go looking for it, I didn't but stumbled on it and I knew I shouldn't have clicked the link. Curiosity killed the cat I guess.

Even little things like people being outraged about people throwing baby showers. I mean if it isn't your thing fine but the comments like people are just being grabby for gifts blah blah! Never mind them wanting to maybe share their joy and celebration with people they love and care about. It's the harsh judgement for me. Anyway rant over on that. Stay off the internet people theirs some not so fun stuff out their! I mean people are seriously mad at having to buy a friend or loved ones baby a gift! Like a pack of baby grows don't cost the earth. I'm so confused! Even outside of the gift you don't want to celebrate with them? Why? No one ever talks about that part though? It always it's tacky, it's unnecessary, it's grabby blah blah! Am I missing something?

If I'm ever so lucky to be pregnant I will be celebrating all the things in the lead up and people can participate or not. I think I would have earned the right to my obvious joy at that point and f**k anyone who thinks otherwise!

Well I think I needed to get that off my chest loool! Rant over. 🤦🏽‍♀️

@Hopeful1234567 it's good to hear that the consultant was reassuring and that they have a plan to improve things for this time. I hope you've managed to get another counselling session after yours was cancelled, and that that's helpful too. When will you be able to start your FET cycle?

@Hoping4baby21 I'm so sorry you stumbled into a bad part of the internet. I will never understand what people get out of being cruel to/about others with a bunch of strangers online. Those people who are being judgemental will never understand and probably can't even imagine how we feel and it shows a real lack of empathy and compassion that they could be so cruel about people who are simply making a different choice to them. At least the internet has also given us supportive spaces like this one where we can chat to people who are going through the same thing and can cheer each other on. Hugs to you!