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Infertility

Our Infertility Support forum is a space to connect with others in the same position, discuss causes, treatment and IVF, and share infertility stories of hope and success.

Uber barren ghetto, elite squad 9th battalion

314 replies

bananafish81 · 11/03/2018 13:12

Thread 1 here

Welcome all to the barren ghetto, elite squad 9th battalion. Sgt banana reporting for duty.

  1. The first rule of uber barrens club - uber barrens only. Secondary barrens have by definition graduated to the parents club. Unless you're facing the very real possibility of a childless future, at the end of the road after multiple failures, the 9th battalion isn't for you.
  1. Second rule of uber barrens club. No false positivity. No 'stay strong, you'll get there'. No 'it'll all be worth it when you have your baby in your arms'. It's very likely we won't get there and won't ever have a baby in our arms, so it's cruel to remind us of our greatest fear, and the reason we're here in the first place
  1. If you're a former member of uber barrens club, no trite offering of 'have you tried..?' If you've graduated then members of the 9th battalion are delighted for you, but this is supposed to be our safe space. Just because it worked for you doesn't mean it will for us. This is a thread for support amongst kindred uber barrens. Not well intentioned but unhelpful advice
  1. If club members get a BFP then that is fucking BRILLIANT. We know the abject fear of miscarrying. I personally know I'm more afraid of the next cycle succeeding than failing. But uber barrens club isn't the place for early pregnancy scanxiety. If you don't feel ready to join a preggo thread, then why not set up a 'multiple failures but just got BFP and completely shitting it' thread. Hopefully we'll be along to join you soon
  1. Repeat. No pregnancy chat in uber barrens club.

Unfortunately prev attempts at a safe space for uber barrens have been pissed all over by flagrant disregard for the above. It hurts. We just want ONE safe space where we can be scared, and hurt, and know that we're not alone.

OP posts:
bluemoonchances · 05/06/2018 23:26

Just saw your post bananafish re the quote from a pp. I think this is the thread where we all get where that poor woman was coming from. Sad

fourpawswhite · 06/06/2018 08:03

Yes bluemoon that's the one. God I am so annoyed.

apologies I missed purple and mrsfw from my post above. I was so angry I could barely type.

Yes blue that makes perfect sense, I was exactly the same and had to come here instead.

You are all just brilliant.

RedPandaFluff · 06/06/2018 08:47

Oh my god I've just seen that thread and I am so, so angry. "Having children is a lifestyle choice" - right, so smoking, eating to the point of obesity, going on sunbeds, all the high-risk things that so many people do that are likely to result in the requirement for medical treatment AREN'T lifestyle choices?

I have the bad burny rage.

PurpleDaisies · 17/06/2018 17:57

Anyone else spotted the gem in AIBU at the moment? We should all just relax and or start the adoption process and that will get us all pregnant. I wonder which of us will be the first to get up-duffed based on this amazing advice?

EarlGreyT · 17/06/2018 18:49

Oh yes. It’s infertility bingo tastic. For fucks sake.

I’m pleased that you (purple) and bananafish have been voices of reason amongst the insanity of the thread as many of the responses are bonkers.

RedPandaFluff · 17/06/2018 18:56

Yes . . . I particularly liked the "get a cat" suggestion.

I have two Hmm

RedPandaFluff · 17/06/2018 19:06

And while I'm here I may as well have a moan.

My two best friends are pregnant. Now don't get me wrong, I love these girls. But they are both pregnant and I'm starting to feel extremely claustrophobic, having just had a failed cycle of donor IVF. They are both suffering at the moment - tiredness, nausea etc. and as much as I hate myself for it, I'm being massively two-faced by being sympathetic in person whilst screaming inside my head "YOU'RE SO F*CKING LUCKY! Shut UP!"

Thing is, they both know they're lucky, they ARE considerate of my feelings, I'm just being a (silent) arsehole.

It's making me feel even worse about myself. Why can't I just be nice? Sad

Mrsfw · 17/06/2018 19:21

Well done all of you for your contributions to that heinous thread. The stupidity & ignorance on it is astounding. I can’t bring myself to comment on it.

Some people are being inherently selfish, as usual.

The lack of empathy is as standard & the lack of realisation that these nonsensical anecdotes are completely unhelpful and make us feel completely shit is really sad.

Yet they still continue. The most evident recurring theme I think on those threads is the amount of actual infertile women who come on to give sound advice and every single time are completely ignored. It amazes me.

The other classic this week was why aren’t more infertile people considering adoption (when she was fertile & wasnt either!!!!) incredible.

EarlGreyT · 17/06/2018 21:20

@RedPandaFluff
Doesn’t everyone know the presence or absence of a cat is determinative of whether you have fertility problems?!? I was tempted to ask the poster of that little gem where I’d gone wrong as I had one cat before we knew of our fertility problems and got another after knowing about them so why hadn’t our problems been resolved?!? I didn’t as I didn’t want to indulge their stupidity and thought they’d probably take me seriously.

The poster of those words of wisdom also said her friend was given those words of advice 47 years ago, you know before actual (effective) fertility treatments like IVF existed and befor evidence based medicine was much of a thing.

You are nice RedPandaFluff, but this is bloody hard and feeling angry and resentful is completely normal (or otherwise I’m an arsehole too).

Yes Mrsfw the advice to adopt just never stops does it. No matter how many times we bang on about it not being helpful, people still trot out the same old cliches,

bananafish81 · 17/06/2018 22:53

God people just trot out the same bullshit, over and over again

Thanks for lovely comments about my angry rants on AIBU, both this thread and the one about NHS IVF funding

Even if the idiots refuse to listen, if my posts give anyone else pause for thought about their perspective, that's a win. A few people said they'd changed their minds, or that the thread had been an eye opener - which is why I wade in to a debate that is not going to end well!

Why is why I've made the terrifying (and ridiculous!) decision to try to write a book ShockTo share the ugly, distressing truth about the reality of being an uber barren - so I would love your thoughts and input! I'm off to bed now, but will post more tomorrow....

OP posts:
bluemoonchances · 17/06/2018 23:56

That sounds a brilliant idea bananafish you'd be a brilliant author writing the reality of the journey us Uber barrens face. You always write eloquent rational responses on the crazy ABIU threads. And a book like that will be of great help and comfort to future Uber barrens. Do it!

TipsNotHacks · 18/06/2018 00:59

Doesn’t she just, bluemoon.

redpanda - you’re a better friend than I am. I have 3 close friends from Uni’ (we all lived together back in the day) all pregnant at the moment. I check in from time to time to ask how they are but I’ve explained that I just can’t be the friend they’d want me to be at the moment. They all know the sex of their babies (all due literally weeks apart, the first due any minute. That was a killer. You can imagine how excited they all were, you really couldn’t make it up). I’ve bought all their ‘new baby’ gifts and they’re packaged, label all written and ready to send when the time comes. All very clinical on my part but needs must.

I’ve said some truly unspeakable things about them to DH whilst flicking through insta of an evening. You are doing so well to still be actively involved in your friends’ lives. Flowers

TipsNotHacks · 18/06/2018 01:02

Talking of which, does anyone else feel like they are CONSTANTLY buying baby gifts?! DH says I need to pack it in now but I’m isolated enough as it is because I just can’t face seeing all the happy families and I suppose I’m always concerned that I don’t want to come across as a bitter barren.

ProfessionalBarren · 18/06/2018 18:06

Old time poster under a name change, banana please please write a book - we need people like you to explain why it isn't always happily ever after.

auditqueen · 18/06/2018 19:26

Banana go for it. It's time we had a voice

PurpleDaisies · 18/06/2018 22:01

I would definitely buy your book banana. Great idea.

QueenAravisOfArchenland · 19/06/2018 16:11

Please forgive the gatecrash, but banana I think a book about the experience of infertility, especially one that doesn't end with a "miracle baby", is a brilliant idea. Please promote it on MN when it's published and I will buy it.

EarlGreyT · 19/06/2018 18:06

bananafish
Also delurking to say I’d definitely buy your book and think it’s a brilliant idea.

I don’t know where you are with pursuing surrogacy options (and am not by any means asking you to tell me), but I totally agree with QueenAravis that a book which doesn’t end with a “miracle baby” is a brilliant idea. At one point between rounds of IVF, my husband was trying to read about how people who didn’t get a baby after fertility treatment coped with being childless. Every book he found, ended with the author having a baby in the end and it made him quite cross as he wanted to read something to help him cope if this wasn’t the outcome for us.

Relurks with QueenAravis

fourpawswhite · 19/06/2018 18:20

Wonderful idea banana. I will buy your book.

ProfessionalBarren · 19/06/2018 19:52

For anyone currently searching for a book that isn’t happily ever after I think 21 Miles by Jessica Hepburn is one. It looks like it’s about how she swims the channel after giving up on ivf or similar. I’m not her by the way - I’d never be able to swim the channel Grin I’m not ready to read it yet though, too many feelings!

bananafish81 · 19/06/2018 22:56

I can highly recommend 21 Miles - Jessica Hepburn is a friend (I volunteered at Fertility Fest 18 and will be involved in helping to run next year’s festival as well), and I am one of the backers of the book, so my name is printed at the back :) Can also highly recommend her first book ‘In pursuit of motherhood’ - which she describes as her ‘misery memoir’, recounting her journey across 11 (unsuccessful) IVF cycles

Thanks so much for your lovely messages - gave me a massive boost when having the daily ‘WTF am I thinking, there’s no way I can do this’ crisis!

The idea for the book is that it’s very much not a personal memoir, specifically about my story (although that will of course be very much a part), and nor is it specifically a self-help guide.

So much of the narrative around infertility is stories of hope, and staying positive, and 'it'll all be worth it when you have your baby in your arms'. But not everyone does get there. And what so so many women have said is that what they really needed wasn't false positivity, but to hear someone acknowledge that yes, it's really really shit. And really really unfair. And really really gruelling. And that it's very possible that you won't get there. But that eventually YOU WILL BE OK, even if things didn't turn out how you hoped they would.

So it's about giving a platform to that narrative. For women to share their stories, the black humour and the ridiculousness of the crazy shit you end up doing, and a celebration of the hidden community of women supporting each other through what is essentially a very expensive form of self harm.

When I was going through treatment there were lots of books with advice about starting IVF, and some books sharing personal experiences of infertility - but the vast majority had the obligatory happy ending. I didn't want endless inspirational positivity. I wanted to read a book with real women's stories, that acknowledged the ugly, distressing truth - and to feel like I wasn't alone.

So I decided to try and write one.

The working title is "Uber Barrens Club: Sisterhood, Solidarity & Support - Stories from the Club No One Wants to Join".

So I would love to get as many points of view as possible, to share the real stories from uber barrens club.

I’ve been overwhelmed by how many friends have agreed to share their stories, and I would LOVE for you amazing women to share yours.

I’m putting together an online questionnaire to enable people to submit their stories anonymously, and would be beyond grateful if you would contribute to the narrative

I have an agent, who thinks that it could have legs - but a massive part of pitching literary proposals is convincing the publishers that there’s a market for a book like this, and why anyone would want to read/buy it.

So all and any support to help get this book picked up would be HUGELY appreciated.

I’m just testing out the questionnaire and will post it up here once it’s in a good shape - would really welcome your feedback about the questions, before I start sharing it more widely. Is the tone right? Is there anything missing?

I’m also getting a blog up and running (as my agent says this is basically a must for any publisher) - the recent AIBU insensitively is all grist to the mill providing lots of material about what dicks people can be to barrens like us

OK, ramble over.

And as a coda, to answer your excellent question - there will be no happy ending per se, as it’s not my story. It’s the story of a community - so in the outline there’s chapters about parenting after infertility, adoption after infertility, and moving on altogether. We don’t yet know where our journey will go (I’m planning chapters about donor conception and surrogacy also), we have embryos on ice, so the journey isn't necessarily completely over - but certainly from my side there isn’t going to be the obligatory ‘miracle baby’ ending. It’s everyone’s stories, and that means lots of different endings, many of which don’t end with a baby. But that hopefully that whatever the outcome, we will all be OK in the end, eventually.

xx

OP posts:
bluemoonchances · 20/06/2018 07:36

what they really needed wasn't false positivity, but to hear someone acknowledge that yes, it's really really shit. And really really unfair. And really really gruelling. And that it's very possible that you won't get there. But that eventually YOU WILL BE OK, even if things didn't turn out how you hoped they would.
*
Bananafish* I just cried when I read this ... this is it in a nutshell

bluemoonchances · 20/06/2018 07:45

A weeks ago I joined a local fertility support group on social media. I lasted about 3 days. It was lots of women in the first couple of years of TTC having their first ivf... lots of positivity going on... I had to leave... it Made me properly realise that there is infertility and there is ultra barren infertility! People who struggled for a couple of years but then ivf worked... yes they've struggled with infertility but they will never understand what ultra barren infertility feel like. 8 years of this brick in my stomach of grief for the child I'll never have, it being permanently in the corner of my mind. Knowing that I won't see my kids grow up, have grandchildren, be alone when I'm old.

FFS. Better put my happy face on and get ready to go to work now Winkxxxx

Clickncollect · 21/06/2018 21:20

Just delurking briefly to show support for Banana’s book - I’ve seen your posts on here and back on FF in the past and have always thought how bloody fabulous and articulate you sound. I would buy your book and I know a few other ladies who would too [slinks off back to the shadows]

EarlGreyT · 21/06/2018 22:02

Delurking to report that after a very pleasant break, the spammers are back
www.mumsnet.com/Talk/infertility/3282270-Ivf