Thread 32 | TTC#1 | Making the move from conception to infertility. We've taken some blows but we are not beaten

[Jamon]

Hi all. We're a group of first timers who've been plugging away on the conception boards for some time. The support here is amazing so if you're in a similar boat please jump onboard.

Time to hand hold through treatments and support each other through to becoming the mums we deserve to be 💪🏼🌸🙏🏼

Thanks for thinking of me mouse xxx

AF arrived Wednesday, not unexpected but reach day 31 when my last cycle was 25 did give me a bit of hope. However like you mouse the victory was in the luteal phase being 13/14 days -unheard of for me!

Spent the whole of cd1 with a baby and on our way to London at the moment to meet my friends 5 week old. Gahh! Have been so busy this week though it's gone quickly and that means only a few more days until our nurse appointment. I'm just so desperate to find out the timeline. Not knowing if we can start straightaway/3 months/6months is agony.

Very exciting for all those on 'The drugs' I've got everything crossed for you xx

Yay to puppies

Anyone going to the fertility show in London next weekend ?

Oh god, I’ve dropped off the thread again and now I’ve missed out on too much to catch up properly!

Have everything crossed for kwick, struggle and otters and everyone else of course!

It’s been an eventful time over here - husband and I went to see the urologist (you were right chlo he is amazing!!) who confirmed that due to DH’s sperm fragmentation results, we’ve gone from ‘unexplained’ to ‘explained’. It’s great news because it’s very likely treatable, but I am absolutely LIVID that this wasn’t tested for at the start. He confirmed that our two IVFs basically had a zero chance of working. He said he tears out what little hair he has left that men aren’t looked at more closely at the start and said that relying on just semen analysis is not good enough. I will be making my views known to the regulator! Especially as this test isn’t even available on NHS which means they’re wasting funding on pointless IVF cycles as up 80% of unexplained is due to this issue! Madness.

Anyway - he examined DH and confirmed there was no varicocele, booked him in for tests on Monday (test for infection etc), booked in follow up consultation for 14th Nov and pointed us to a nutritionist so we can start working on getting the fragmentation down through diet.

We went to see the nutritionist yesterday (decided to make it a team project for both of us so he actually does it) and she was fantastic!! We both felt so positive afterwards and should get our meal plans today. We’ve got a new supplement regime (have attached pic, DH on left and I’m on right). Interesting that she’s taken DH off Proxeed plus and put him on Fertilix Max instead and she’s taken me off Pregnacare as due to my MTHFR gene mutation I don’t metabolise folic acid into folate properly so I’m now on a supplement with straight folate.

DH bought paraben/SLS free toiletries (I already have them) as well. I’m feeling quite excited about doing this project together!

Me and DH going to the Fertility Show winging - we’ve got a packed day planned! There were so many seminars I wanted to see that had to make a plan! Are you going?

I’m only really going to the Fertility Show for the seminars lemon, going to try and avoid the sales stuff!

Varicocele definitely linked to male fertility - our urologist said it’s one of the leading causes of sperm dna damage as it heats up the testicles. It was the first thing he checked on my DH!

Yay to luteal phase victories!!!

pjs wow amazeballs progress!!! You go girl!!!

Please tell more about folic acid/folate thing... I take 5mg of folic acid each day due to elevated BMI (not sure what the cut off point is) and then I take Inofolic for my PCOS which has 800mcg folic acid in it and since last week I am taking Pukka Motherkind Pregnancy supplement which contains 120% NRV of Folate.... do you think I have it covered?

Off to see puppy in a minute!!!

Yes - I would absolutely 100% push for a sperm dna fragmentation test, esp in light of the varicocele to see if there’s been damage and then you can see what progress there is once it’s removed (takes about 3 months to see a difference in spark quality). It’s not available on NHS unfortunately and cost £500 at our clinic, but that’s nothing compared to the minimum £14k we’ve wasted on two doomed from the start cycles. If you’re with a private clinic they will probably say they typically wait until at least one failed cycle to do the test. But if I could change anything about the past at this stage, it would be getting that test done before doing anything. Sperm analysis is superficial, it tells you nothing about what’s going on inside the sperm. Sorry, I don’t mean to go on, but I have got a MASSIVE bee in my bonnet about this!

Hey kwick! I think you’ve got it covered. The only reason you’d need to change it is if you tested positive for the MTHFR mutated gene (one of my two genes is mutated). The body breaks folic acid down into folate and then absorbs it for most people. But for the 40% of the population who have the mutation (including me) - we can’t break folic acid down so it just sits there unabsorbed. By taking folate, I can now absorb it and get all the benefit of folic acid that the rest of the population taking it gets!

Amazing the things we learn along the way...

For anyone interested - this podcast talks about sperm dna fragmentation: itunes.apple.com/gb/podcast/the-fertility-podcast/id918950602?mt=2&i=1000380346118itunes.apple.com/gb/podcast/the-fertility-podcast/id918950602?mt=2&i=1000380346118

And this link has a great explanation: deearmstrong.co.uk/blog/2016/6/13/what-is-sperm-dna-fragmentation-and-how-does-it-affect-your-fertility

Right, I’ll shut up now! Just really don’t want the same thing to happen to any of you!

Lemon my DH was exactly the same with the cat. I went and got it. He fell in love instantly and lavishes it with affection and attention

Kwick how did the puppy reveal go??

Sounds like a lovely wedding mouse and hope AF stays away x

Pyjamas I find that absolutely mind boggling about sperm testing. Why on Earth is the nhs putting couples through the physical and emotional toil of IVF when it was never going to work?? How can they not test for this? It’s insane. It also makes me scared this could be affecting us. I don’t think DH would be at all receptive to this - he’s never even heard of sperm DNA fragmentation.

So we kind of decided we might try again this week... I put a post on Instagram about not trying and a few people replied saying people do get BFPs during down regulation and the baby was fine. Hmmm. I am still in two minds but it’s one of those unknown areas as they obv can’t clinically test.

ALSO I’m confused about the drugs they’re putting me on. I start off with Progynova - they told me this is to down regulate but looking online Progynova is not a down regulation drug ?!

You’re right jam - total and utter insanity re: the NHS - it would actually save them money. I know full well why private clinics don’t push it 😒 Tbh, my DH only did it because consultant mentioned it (after 2 fucking fails, sorry, I will let it go one day!). Not sure how he would’ve taken it if I had raised it. Although I strongly suspect he would’ve if I said I wouldn’t do IVF without it! The US and many places abroad won’t even start fertility treatment without that test - the UK is very behind.

I’ve never down regulated before, so I can’t help there am afraid but I hope the confusion is cleared up soon!

Thanks for the advice PJs! I had read about it and I’d definitely like my oh to have that test before we start ivf. They offer it at my local clinic luckily

Amazing Kerry - if I can help just one person not fall into the trap we did, I’m happy! Hope the test comes back all clear 😊😊

So glad you had a good appointment pyjamas. It's absolutely mental when you start looking into it isn't it. I just wish we'd gone and seen dr Ramsay two years ago! Wasted so much money and heartache when all along we had no hope of sustaining a pg with the varicocele. He told us it's basically corruption why they don't test on NHS- they're all on boards of ivf clinics so they're just lining their pockets while us poor mugs despair! Nutritionist is so good isn't she? I was really sceptical beforehand but was blown away by her. I think in years to come the situation will be totally different and everyone will know about this stuff but we are so behind here at the moment it's a disgrace. Fingers crossed we get there soon after all of this! X

Ah yes, I remember you saying that about the NHS/boards issue chlo - it’s unbelievable but all make so much sense when you think about it.

Melanie the nutritionist was amazing! We learned SO much and am looking forward to getting our plans!

I completely get the 🐝 in your bonnet pjs!! You should protest!
Do you think I should get tested for the folic acid thing?

I am going to try and upload cute puppy photos - we have paid the deposit and will pick up in about a month!!!

Kwick’s pup

Oh my goodness the pup!!! 😍😍😍

I’m kind of undecided about MTFHR - 40% of population have it yet most don’t know about it and manage to have children. Not absorbing folic acid worries me though especially as I get older trying to conceive. It’s not a cheap test (think it was about £300-£400) so definitely don’t want to over-recommend it! Sperm DNA 100% yes, MTFHR, need to read up on it more!

Sorry meant MTHFR - damn acronyms...

Thank you jamon!!! It seems I am only having difficulty on this thread - have been able to post to another
Nephew very excited but has insisted I point out it will be his pup not mine...

pjs maybe I should just move on to folate but as can only get in 400mcgs that is a heck of a lot of pills to get to 5mg!!!

Yeah that’s the thing kwick - I wouldn’t know what the equivalent amount of folate would be of 5mg of folic acid! Much less I imagine - like you need to take double the amount of Coq10 to get the right amount of ubiquinol.

Just had DH’s sister, husband and their eight year old and 4 year old over for Sunday lunch. I absolutely adore the 4 year old little girl - I know you’re not supposed to have favourites, but she totally is!