Long term Secondary Infertility - anyone want to chat?

[closephine85]

Recently I've been feeling like I don't quite fit on any of the threads currently running. I know there is a support thread for ladies with secondary infertility already which I dip in and out of. However, now having watched many women come and go on that thread and seeing new ones come who haven't been trying for so long and are a lot more hopeful of a happy ending than I am, I just want a place to vent/moan/hate on this crap situation but to also be able to refer to the fact that I am a mother (obviously insensitive to do so on some of the other support threads, but where I actually feel more at home).

About me: I have a 5 year old son and have been ttc a second child for 3.5 years. 3 failed rounds of iui and a recent failed round of ivf/IMSI. We have 2 blasts in the freezer but I'm fairly convinced they aren't going to work either due to DH's high DNA fragmentation, I think they are probably chromasomally defunct. So if/when that doesn't work, we either admit defeat or move on to donor sperm. Both shitty options.

I feel defeated. Like I have failed as a mother. I can't give my son a sibling and even if I do, there will be at least 6.5 years between them. In the meantime he has to put up with me being always just a little bit miserable...

Anyone care to join me for a bitch and a moan?

DH's friend just had their 20-week scan. They're having a girl. We wanted a girl next. Due same time as our ivf due date. So so hard.

Hi guys. I got locked out of here for a few days as switched to a new phone (having broken screen of my old one like an idiot) and had to upload all passwords etc.

Anyway, sending you anti-baby-bombs (baby-bomb defusing machines? Baby bomb controlled explosions?). A nice friend of mine just had her third (greedy! Shrieks my irrational mind) child, of course it's a daughter after two boys, just as she wanted. Her husband was talking about how tired he was the other day and I was pretty unsympathetic. Think I'll have eight nice hours in a row tonight just because I can!

Anyway, I've finished my job and am starting to eat better and do some gentle exercise. Need to get back in contact with our ivf place and dr but just easing myself into it. Hoping you all have good weekends and sending you baby bomb proof body armour (I wish).

I can really relate ..I am through he other end ..I'm a menopausal 55 yr with a 14 yrs old son and 25 yr old daughter . Son came along as a complete shock after yrs of treatment and giving up.
Those years of feeling guilt at my daughter being an only ..dd now says she always loved being an only child..she was 11 when we told her I was pregnant and she was shocked and disgusted .

Things that used to get to me were the comments about only children being difficult, spoilt and other negative traits ..none true of dd. People eventually stopped asking if we were going to have another child ..it was like the elephant in the room.
Eventually we grew to accept that it wasn't gonna happen.

No advice to offer but empathy ..its a hard road

Thanks ggirl for your story, gives us hope.

FEMP - I'm so sorry to hear about your baby

ggirl I appreciate that story and your fellow-feeling. I have a few friends who are now adult only children who are v happy with it so I always remind myself of them if I start to feel guilty. You can't predict how a sibling would be though I get on really well with my sister and feel sad my son may well have no one else to complain about his parents to!

femp your message is now withdrawn but based on bibs's comment also sending

Hi, how is everyone? This board has gone quiet again. I hope everyone is okay. I'm looking forward to having ds off school for the summer but again tinged with sadness as we will need to keep him entertained, I worry so much about him getting bored. I was talking about siblings to him yesterday and he - very innocently - said that it was too late for him to have a brother or sister now. It's like he's kind of accepted he's an only child now. So sad. Had to spend some time with a pregnant friend yesterday, it was painful - no I really, really don't want to hear about any of it. And I am (probably childishly) blatantly ignoring the fact that a colleague is pregnant and am not engaging in any conversation about it at all. Self preservation I think

I'm dreading the school holidays too. We do have a lot planned so I'm hoping it goes smoother than I'm anticipating it to go!!!

GP totally messed up my day 3 bloods. She actually requested progesterone bloods on days 3 and 21 I didn't know whether to laugh or cry but hopefully I can have this done next cycle. I really honestly can't be bothered with it all right now.

Hi all

Sorry I tend to go quiet mid cycle and then crazy posting when AF is about to arrive and I'm thinking screw the world!

Latest IUI was last Friday and going to have bloods done this Friday to check progesterone (at my request). Don't expect them to flash anything up but I feel better trying to look for answers at least. Will do one more IUI in August and then go back to Athens for our FET. If that doesn't work then we've agreed we'll give donor sperm a go. At least if donor sperm didn't work it would tell us that there IS something wrong with me too... but what...?!

Sorry to hear GP has messed up your bloods Dizzy. I'm so over incompetent health care professionals. Have met a few great ones and a few clueless idiots!

Close - we are planning to go to Athens for next cycle. Is it Penny at Serum you're dealing with?

I am 5.5years into my secondary infertility and it almost destroyed our marriage. We've been seeing a wonderful counsellor lately who has taught me to "just be" but it still breaks my heart when I think about dd1 wanting a little brother or sister

Unfortunately close I've only ever come across incompetent dr's when it concerns fertility! I don't even have the energy to bother trying or hoping anymore

GP has filled in the correct blood form now so I'll have my day 3 test next cycle. I also realised I'm out of ovulation strips which initially stressed me out but the line was slight dark yesterday so I reckon I will/have ovulated today, not that I'm expecting it to work!!!

Sorry you find yourself here drsholmes. I wouldn't wish this situation on anyone. My Dd is so desperate for a sibling too and it destroys me that it's just not happening

Bibs - yes we are at serum and although our first cycle failed I can't fault them so far! Have you been out yet?

I had my day 21 progesterone blood test today. Busted a gut to get there for 8am, was reassured I would be called with the results today. Haven't had a call. Meh. I don't know why I expect anything else but I still do frustrated by it

Not been there yet, need to fill out the stuff on their website.

We are treating naturally till end of year then try with Serum.

Is it much cheaper then England? We are £12k in debt cause of our failed London cycles.

Hey everyone I was part of an older forum but left as I just felt everyone was getting pregnant but me! I go through cycles where I also try not to focus on the shit that is secondary infertility but as you all know it follows you everywhere!!

My story- now 34- been trying for three years- I have a nearly 4 year old and it breaks my heart he doesn't have a playmate and all his friends do. Suspected male factor - 2 rounds of IVF. First cancelled due to hospilized OHSS and second sadly our two frozen embryos failed to survive thaw! So not really got round to a proper transfer. Perhaps stupidly preparing for another round of IVF and so scared of hyper stimulating again.

Closephine- I remember you well from the other thread- and kittenpie- hello! Closephine- how do you know that your husband has bad fragmentation ? We had 25 eggs- 16 mature- 11 fertilised and only 2 blasts (which later failed to thaw. Have been told it's just bad luck but wondering if I have crappy eggs or bad sperm which looks low at 10 mill but seemingly healthy)

Sorry for essay. I share your pain and your stories struck a nerve with me. It's so hard and I feel like I'm stuck in this bubble of sadness that will never ever leave.

X

Hi Katy! Sorry you are still trying to walk up the downward escalator as well but it's nice to hear from you. That's rubbish about your failed cycles that didn't really get going. Blasts not surviving the thaw is my current fear as if they don't, we will have nothing. My DH had a few DNA fragmentation tests done whilst we were at Serum. The cost for one test in London was £1000 compared to €100 in Greece!! He actually ended up having a few as it varies per sample and they used the best one. Your DH's count sounds similar to my DH's - low but not completely obsolete. Have you had any BFP's in the time you have been trying? Sorry I can't remember. We haven't had any! And I'm just not sure whether to accept it as male factor or try and hunt for something wrong with me!

Bibs - including all flights for 3 of us and accommodation for 10 days in Athens we spent just under €7000. That included freezing our 2 blasts and so the cost of the next transfer is already paid for. Unfortunately since brexit it doesn't work out as cheap as it did previously! But SERUM don't charge any extras for ICSI or IMSI which was good for us and as mentioned previously the DNA fragmentation test that we needed was much cheaper.

Nope not a sniff of a BFP since trying. I know what you mean about whether it's us too. I haven't had the tubes test so wondering whether to try that as it drives me mad that even though his sperm is low it shouldn't just be impossible. That's so expensive for the test! Not sure we could warrant it. Is your DH husband badly affected or just slightly ?

How does it affect your marriages? I feel like it's so sad. We've been together 14 years and it feels like the sadness is tearing us apart. We get on so well apart from this and i feel angry it's put us in this position.

I read earlier in thread about friends not really caring that more. I have one friend who's been so good but I feel to the rest it's just boring and it's not really a problem. And I don't sleep anymore! I thought after 3 years I'd accept but I think it gets worse as new babies etc become these markers of time!

Xx

Close - that's a lot more than I thought it would be 😲

Katy - I guess if neither of us have had a sniff of a BFP then perhaps it is plausible the it is just a sperm problem. I can't remember the exact numbers. I think it was about 25% but I can't remember what the number for 'normal' is now, I just remember that it was a bit high, but not crazy high. Would you try donor sperm? We have agreed that we will as our next step if our FET doesn't work. We just can't keep going round in the same circles. At least if it didn't work it would answer the 'is there something wrong with me too?' Question. And if it did work, we could be very confident we had exhausted all avenues using DH's first. Our marriage is good but I'd be lying if I didn't say this was a strain. I think I get pissed at things more easily than I would if I was generally feeling happier inside if that makes sense?!

Bibs - if I remember correctly it is €4000 for one round or €5000 for two if you do them within a year of each other. It's €1000 per straw to freeze any remaining blasts and you pay for your meds on top of that. Our costs added up more due to DNA fragmentation tests, being there 10+ days and all three of us going.

Close- that's good you have managed to keep your marriage intact. It's such a strain but now it's moved on as my husband just feels so guilty and that breaks my heart seeing him blame himself. Nothing o can do to change his mindset! He's very against donor sperm and I guess I have to respect that.

How is everyone dealing with summer hols? I have lined up lots of playdates but feel so envious of those with two or more. I feel permanent guilt if I don't have time to play with my DS! He threw in a lovely "I wish I had a brother to play with" comment yesterday. I told my friend who is a single mum to two and she said hers always throw in the "I wish I had a step dad" comment so I guess kids are always going to pull on our heart strings!!

Hey all. Hope you don't mind me saying hello. I dip in and out of forums, so have seen a few of you on threads before but I have name changed a few times!

My story is; ttc since April 2015. I have a dd from a previous relationship who is 8 now (scary to think she was 5 when we started trying!). I have since been diagnosed with pcos and haven't ovulated naturally since I stopped the pill in 2015. I find it very frustrating! I do respond well to low doses of clomid though and last month I was stressed and kept forgetting them so I only took 2 x 50mg tablets and they worked, im not sure if this has any bearing whatsoever on chances for ivf but I like to think its a good sign (im clueless though, not going to lie lol). Also working against us is the fact my OH has a very low sperm count, under a million total count. So we are going to do ivf with icsi, but want to save up for it rather than get in debt. This does mean we are going to be waiting for ages and ages to do it, hence why I tend to dip in and out of threads and forums!!!

I will probs lurk more than post but look forward to seeing how you lovely ladies are getting on

Also, if you don't mind me asking - those who have done ivf abroad, how many days do you have to spend out there? I wouldn't want to take DD, but equally wouldnt want to spend 10-14 days away from her!

Katy - I get the holiday guilt too we are lucky that there are lots of neighbours children around for ds to play with but it's not the same is it. I know another child now probably wouldn't be a playmate but it would add a bit more noise and happiness to our home. I'm so tired of the guilt and sadness that goes with all this. I look back at photos of when DS was small, before we started trying again and I just remember how HAPPY I was, in this bubble of perfectness. He still makes me feel like that of course so it's impossible to explain that the best days of my life (having ds in my world), that feeling that you love them so much your heart could explode, that you are just SO LUCKY to have them... is also coupled with some of the saddest times and a constant weight in your heart that won't go away.

Wholoves - we went abroad and we took DS out of school to come with us. We were there for about 12 days I think, you go shortly before your trigger shot, egg collection is a day or two later, you then wait for 3-5 days before embryo transfer and we flew back the following day. We didn't spend that much time at the clinic really, more time exploring Athens (unfortunately not much there for kids!) but if I did it again I would go to an island for the days to make more of a holiday of it. We told him what was happening (I think it would have been scarier me having medical procedures in another country if he didn't know what they were for) and he took it all in his stride and enjoyed the trip.

I got my pre AF spotting last night, right on cue, so I'm feeling particularly morose and took it out in DH. I've pretty much stopped talking to friends and family about our infertility now. They are bored of it, I am bored of it. Nothing ever changes so what's the point in going on about it all the time. I do find I hold back in social situations a lot more now though, I've lost my confidence, I feel inferior somehow, less interesting.... it's pretty much the only thing going through my mind at all times but now I don't want to talk about it... it's all so screwed up!!

hello, newbie and time lurker here. My story - ttc no 2 for 18 months, 2 ivfs failed since, just started next round. This will be my 5th ivf cycle in all as I have a 3 year old from a previous cycle. Doing natural ivf as the idea of more drugs just freaks me out, although i'm not full of faith as i'm 40 now. its hard to keep positive when you are feeling desperate and panicky! The world has stopped (as it always seems to during ivf) and i have had to stay away from people. Feel so guilty but I just can't bear to sit there with my friends and their second babies, blah blahing about whether they'll have another one and oops we might just fall pregnant at the drop of a hat like last time again! It either gives me the rage or makes me want to cry. I just sit there silently as I literally have nothing to say. I'm finding it much easier to be with aquaintances and people I don't really know but it's a lonely time. I really want to talk about it, but I don't have anyone close that understands. My husband is great but it's just as stressful for him and sometimes I just want to be lighthearted with him instead of moaning on. We just end up arguing most of the time anyway. Thank god for these threads and you guys, reading your news has kept me sane.

Thank you Close for all that info C