BESH - relocated to less offensive surroundings

[cooperG]

Hi hags, here's our new thread. Did we decide to post the BESH-tionnaire or not? I'll have to go and dig it out if so..

Newbies - we think we're much like the ladies in the 'mind-numbing boredom of infertility' thread ladies, but we can't admit defeat, oh no. After the new recruits kind of dried up over in conception, we've moved over here where there are no insta-differs to send us into fits of rage/tears.

(BESH stands for Bitter Evil Selfish Hags - named so by the Daily Mail I think...) come and be bitter about the shit-ness that is infertility with us...

K8liz Hi!
It's been very straight forward to be honest! I was introduced to a group of Reprofit cycling ladies on an FF forum and they talked me through the steps. Once DH and I were ready, we contacted the clinic and they gave us a list of test results they needed from us before we could start our first round.
My GP has been excellent and agreed to do all of the tests that the clinic needed on the NHS (up to date SA, 21 day bloods, chalmydia testing etc) except for AMH which I paid for privately.
Reprofit then supply a treatment protocol and prescriptions, and you can either choose to source your own drugs in the UK or use their own pharmacy and have the meds shipped over.
We had our follicle and lining scans in the UK (paid privately) but if you fly to Czech earlier, they include them as part of the price. It just depends how much time you want/are able to take off work.
All communication is via email although you can request a face to face or Skype consultation if you prefer.
Price inc flights, accommodation and drugs worked out under half that of the UK. For example our FET in May (3 nights in Czech) cost £800 inc everything, even our spending money! And there are no waiting lists!

If you want to ask anything specific I'm happy to answer, so ask away x

Hi all, welcome Rose, sorry you find yourself here but these ladies are lovely so welcome. Also very interesting to hear about the overseas IVF, we looked at it but then I got a bit nervous about the unfamiliarity of it.

I'm glad there seems to be progress happening for so many at the moment. I know not all of it is positive but it's progress none the lest. Take care of yourselves through the tricky times.

Jen, awesome news on the fertilisation. Hope the phone call is good news tomorrow.

I am going slightly crazy, wondering if either of the two little embies have taken hold or maybe even both! This is going to be a ridiculously long two weeks!! Plus I think the hormones are contributing to my mental state. I think they may be turning me bipolar. My poor other half doesn't know if I'm coming or going. Pretty much anything he does is wrong, poor fucker.

Hope you all have a good start to the week x

Hi everyone - welcome Rose! Lovely to see you on there ... I mean not lovely, I wish none of us was here. But really glad you've found us. And yes we'll be FETing at the same time - end sept/beginning oct. Aaaagh! Thanks for your kind words re my mum. It's very sad and stressful - especially since my poor dad is, let's say, not a natural carer. But at least I'm able to help a bit while I'm here.

Jen, 6 eggs sounds very respectable. We were thrilled as got loads (13 I think) but then they only had 2 blastocytes to freeze and my husband was really gutted though I thought that seemed fine.

Place, your poor friend. It's a good reminder that some people are not even in a position to try. Must be so so hard.

k8liz, I am 40 next year too Honestly, I want to stop all this shit by my 40th birthday - we'll see. I certainly won't be the 53 year old in the Mail.

Erica, glad your walking was therapeutic, sounds like such a great thing to do. I hope your procedure goes ok ... Sending you mental gin and tonics (if you know what I mean)

Oh, and someone needs to make a T-shirt that says, 'No, why don't YOU just f*@£$@£ well adopt?'

PS SoSam - good luck!!! Hope you manage to impersonate a normal calm human for some moments during the next two weeks. Will be watching for tips.

Thanks Rebecca, so far completely failing at the sane part of life (plus my boobs have swollen up and really bloody hurt!! Sorry potentially tmi)

Thinking of you Sosam in the 2ww.

Hi Rose, I also did IVF at Reprofit (am currently 24+5 so just lurk here now as i can't manage to tear myself away from the BESH!). I agree with Rose, it was all very efficient and I was scared of doing it abroad. Reprofit are brilliant, I would highly recommend for anyone considering it.

Thinking of you Sosam in the 2ww.

Hi Rose, I also did IVF at Reprofit (am currently 24+5 so just lurk here now as i can't manage to tear myself away from the BESH!). I agree with Rose, it was all very efficient and I was scared of doing it abroad. Reprofit are brilliant, I would highly recommend for anyone considering it.

Thanks Blue and Rose for the info on Reprofit. I guess because it's abroad I have concerns like language barriers etc but recommendation by people who have actually been through it, is the best and puts my mind at ease. We're seeing our fertility consultant next week. I'll see what she says the plan is. I'm highly tempted to just think fuck it and put the IVF on a credit card but not sure my hubby will go for that. He thinks we should just keep plugging away and wait until we can have IVF on NHS next match but I'll be 40 next May . My hubby is 6 yrs younger than me so he doesn't see the urgency.

Oh and Rebecca I'll happily purchase one of those t-shirts xx

SoSam The 2ww is horrible! I really feel for you (and OH ) When is OTD for you? Did you have 3 or 5 day embies put back?

Rebecca Do you know if you plan to put one or both of your blasts back for your FET? It's quite a tough decision I think- We went for 1 last time but have decided to try 2 next time.
I'll also have one of those T-shirts please and if you plan to go into the t-shirt making business; I'll request another saying "Warning: Angry barren woman approaching"

Blue I'm a bit late to the party, but congratulations! From the short time I lurked there, the world of the ante-natal boards seems to be a scary place full of smug super fertile women- I imagine it's not the easiest place to be after IVF.

K8liz We didn't find any language barrier problems. Everyone at the clinic speaks English, as do most hotel and restaurant staff. The only thing we have noticed is that email communication can sometimes come across as quite abrupt but I think that's just a cultural thing.
I know a couple of ladies who are cycling with Reprofit (on the quiet) whilst awaiting their NHS go- so you certainly wouldn't be the only one! Something worth looking into maybe.

Hi there, yes abroad sounds like a possible plan...definitely would consider. Blue congrats on your pregnancy, nice to hear of successes when going through all this...

Had the call today. Two embies out of the running, four still in the race...one 7 cell, one 8 cell and two 9 cells. Going to blast transfer on Weds.

Any top tips ladies on managing the stress? Slept SO badly waiting for the call today, properly lying in bed having palpitations (don't think steroids help with that!) Just not sure how I will make it through the 2WW...don't think the stress helps implantation. I hate all this!!

Thanks everyone. And when you all join me in the land of diffed Hags there is an ante-natal board for the BESH that's a much safer place to be than the general boards.

I also agree, language barrier was no problem. I'm pretty pessimistic about everything but honestly Reprofit couldn't have been better (much much better than our NHS care). Also, the ladies on the fertility friends board are amazing, they will literally help you through every tiny step of the way.

Morning hags,

Loving all this exchange of info and tips!

Rose Sorry you found yourself here but it is a great place for support, given the circumstances. I am going to state the obvious and say that mc-s are horrible and takes such a long time to recover, both physically and mentally. Hoping you can get on with FET in October. I am just hoping that after the ERPC, my hcg levels will not take ages to go down (seems to be common with molars - but at least it was a partial molar and not a complete molar, so less chance of cancer. Whoopee)... this is such a headfuck. I just want to BLEED and for my next period to arrive asap, exactly the opposite of what I've wanted for the longest time!

I am very down today, hags. ERPC penciled in for Tuesday next week (I go home on Saturday) but trying to push and change my travel plans so I can have it done on Friday instead... I just don't see how this is every going to work for me, all the fucking weirdest, unlikeliest things seem to happen, and it takes so long to get over them and I wait and wait and wait and then everyone around me seems to easily have 3 million children in the meantime (slight exaggeration). Feeling very bleak. Also, I feel I should tell my dad that I am having surgery (in case something goes wrong) and just thinking of his reaction ("I think it is time you gave up") makes me want to cry.

Talking about crying, I had the most hysterical fit of tears on the phone to Mr Erica last night (we meet again tomorrow).I think he is a "bit" worried about my mental state.

Sorry for the me me me. It is one of those days.

Jen That's great news about your embies still going strong! And all 4 sound like they are developing as they should be. My best piece of advice with regards to sleeping (I have struggled with sleeping on and off since we started our first cycle of IVF in Jan) is to try the headspace app. It sounds very woo, but it basically gets you to empty your mind and control your breathing before you go to sleep and trains you over a 10 day period to switch off completely. It made me really sleepy and I slept much better each day I did it. May not be for everyone but worth a try.

Erica I can feel your despair and I really really feel for you. It is completely shit and you are allowed to be really angry with the world and incredibly upset.
I had what can only be described as a bit of a breakdown after my first MC in Feb. I acted (to everyone but DH) like nothing had happened; went to work as normal, text friends as normal etc etc. But at home I was inconsolable and despairing. Then the anger came- I was angry at everyone for not acknowledging my loss and its impact (even though they couldn't because they didn't know about it) I distanced myself from everyone and everything, including DH. I cut many people off completely. Then in March we went on (a pre planned) holiday with his 2DCs and that's when I broke down. I felt lonely, I felt like a failure, I felt like they (DH and his DCs) would be better off without me. It was awful. Then one day after another huge explosion of emotion, DH cried like I've never seen him cry before and told me that he can't do it anymore and that I need help.
You would think that him saying that would have made me angry/upset. But it actually came as a relief- because deep down I knew that I needed help too. Help to come to terms with everything- my infertility, IVF, my pregnancy, my MC.
We phoned the doctor together and I was immediately referred to a service that specialises in reproduction and loss counselling. I've been going ever since and I have no doubt that my counsellor stopped me going down the same route after my second MC in July.

I've never told that story before to anyone but my counsellor (and now I've told the whole of the Internet ) but I suppose what I'm trying to say is that sometimes it's not possible to deal with all of these emotions on our own, or even with DH. Sometimes you need to get it ALL out and maybe the way to do that is to talk openly about it with someone who won't say any shitty comments like "relax it will happen" or "you can always adopt".

My counsellor has taught me a lot about myself and has changed my way of dealing with loss.
I still cry, I still get incredibly frustrated and have moments of feeling this will never happen, but i don't feel the same level of utter despair that I did.

Even if you don't think counselling is for you, hopefully what I've said shows you that you are not alone xxx

PS Apologies for the essay.

If you get to end.... well done!

Rose thanks so much for sharing your experience. I am sorry to hear that you have gone through such hard times and I really hope you get a happy ending soon.

I have been seeing a counsellor on and off for a few years (I lost my mum 3 years ago, to add to the shitshow) and after my mc back in January, I had to go 2-3 times a week for a while because I was so unspeakably down. Counselling does really work for me and I am thinking of going back... It's just that right now, I am so fed up of everything being so hard, of having to work so hard to feel remotely normal over a situation that is easy and full of joy and hope for so most people.

I know that self pity takes me nowhere and ultimately I am going to have to wear my big girls pants, use the available resources to feel better (talking to people, you guys, exercise and meditation and ahem, wine) and get on with it.

I think most people do not realise the guts and resilience and fucking patience it takes to be where we are. Fuck knows what people did before the internet :) soppy alert don't know what I would do without you, guys.

Erica I can completely understand that, and I'm so sorry to hear about your Mum. I can't even begin to imagine
This 'journey' is just full of shit, and even when things feel like they might be starting to go somewhere we still hold back because we no longer have any naivety about what it takes to firstly conceive, and secondly grow, a baby. The excited BFP moment and the excited 1st scan moment and the excited announcing to family moments are no longer possible.
It's just so so sad. And it makes me feel very very bitter and angry at the world.
The waiting is the worst- waiting to find out if your betas demonstrate a viable pregnancy, waiting for the first scan, waiting for confirmation of an MC, waiting for an ERPC, waiting for your first AF post-ERPC.
It's not self pity- it's just the shittest of the shit and you are absolutely allowed to feel angry and despairing.
Just keep talking as much as you can, to whoever- DH, friends, a counsellor, us.
X

Oh Rose. You are really brave to say all that even if it's anonymous on the Internet. I remember you going on those hols. That was around what was maybe my lowest point (so far) - I just felt so lost, in limbo, cut off from all my friends - and you really helped me and cheered me up. If anyone deserves to be a parent it's you and everyone on this thread.

And Erica- I'm so sorry about your mum, it's so sad that you have to face all this without her. If counselling helps then definitely go back. And don't feel bad about self pity - you're coping brilliantly from what I can tell but you're not made of stone. You've been through hell and you deserve every support going.

AFM .. Just got back from visiting my mum who has dementia. My dad who we thought was sort of coping/caring is really not. We (my siblings and I) think he might have cognitive problems too. ... Either that or he's just not being very nice to her and I don't know which is worse. I just feel guilty that I have missed so many red flags as I've been wrapped up in my own problems. Now I feel torn in two. I want to go again soon but I'll be having scans from around 8 Sept for our FET. It's a plane ride away. I'll go next week probably but to be honest I could do with a longer break from it all. For now I just keep crying. Can we cancel this year and skip straight to next year??

PS (yes, me again ..) Rose it's so true that you miss out on the joy that's associated with all those things for others -taking a test, BFPs, scans. It's like you've been robbed of something. And it can't be easy coping with all that and having your little steps to look after too. I bet you're a brilliant stepmother but it's not the same.

Rebecca I'm sorry to hear about your mum. You're right in that things tend to pass you by because we're consumed with ttc. I always said I wouldn't let it take over my life - how naive was I. It's all I think about. Everything revolves around fucking dates in my cycle and what drugs I need to take and when. I totally agree with Erica that no one gets how hard it is to keep preserving.
I think that it's good you've shared your story Rosebud. It definitely helps me to know that I'm not alone in struggling to deal with all this crap. I'm just about to start CBT to help me deal with my v low mood. Thanks to you lovely ladies, I feel that I now have an outlet for me grief, anger, frustration etc and it's helped me to feel more positive xx

Oh and Erica hope this makes you smile. I was telling my Dad about this group and how it's helped me and I mentioned that you spent time in Africa. His response "can't she just adopt one from there" I kid you not! . See we really are sisters xx

Jen Hope ET went well yesterday? And you are now happily PUPO! How did it all go? Did you manage to get a decent nights sleep?

SoSam How are you doing? How many day past transfer are you? When are you thinking about testing?

Rebecca I think we probably helped each other more than we realise, back then- those were dark days for us both.
I'm so so sorry to hear about everything that is going on with your parents. It must be so tough juggling everything. Do your siblings know about IVF? Could they take the lead in terms of helping your parents whilst you are preparing to cycle?
Ultimately you have to do what you feel in your heart is right for you- if you feel like you cant cope with everything all at once at the moment, then maybe delay IVF until you feel more in control? I really feel for you
And I'd be more than happy to join you in fast forwarding to 2017! 2016 can f@@k off!

k8liz Thanks lovely. Good luck with the CBT- I had it years ago to help with anxiety and panic attacks (completely un-TTC related) and it did me a lot of good. It teaches you to change the way you think about things- its very clever stuff. I really hope it helps you.
And PMSL at your Dad!!! Really?????? How did you respond?

Thanks again Rose. I'm feeling better today - have spoken to the others and we're going to tag team. I can put in a few days next week, and then I'll just check out for the month aside from phone calls. I'm happy to do it - we're finally finding some practical systems we can set up for them which is better than worrying. But yeah, it's big stuff.. Oh well!! I hear stress is amazingly good for conceiving babies ... Or was that avocados? It was one or the other. Hahahahaaha! [falls over keyboard in mild hysterics]

However Mr Noodles and I are planning a long weekend of total relaxation and fun times. Out with fun childless friends on Sat and going a fancy restaurant for lunch tomorrow. Bring it.

Jen hope ET went really well. And SoSam best of luck with the waiting game. Will be right behind you.

K8liz, no your dad is right though. You can totally pick up a baby in East Africa - any good supermarket will have one. Near the household products.

waves to everyone else

Hi ladies, thanks for all the cheerleading! Has been really nice and encouraging...

EricaJ sorry to hear you have been so down, must be hard being away from DP too...You have every right to feel wretched. Necessarily to feel it and wallow in it for as long as you need to cos what you have been through is massive. Hang in there...Counselling sounds like the ticket. Did go to two sessions post NHS IVF. She wasn't that brilliant TBH, important to find the right one for yourself but once you do can be marvellous...

Rosebud thanks for the encouragement. You're right, it sure does take guts and courage. High five us! It also takes a complete loss of modesty. During EC and ET the consultant raised the bed up and he was literally parallel with bum and fanny. For ages, like face to vag. Me and DH did have a bit of a chuckle about the awkwardness of that!

Rebeccanoodles really feeling for you supporting your with dementia. My father in law has it age 60, it sounds like quite a similar situation in that my mother in law is NOT the best person to manage this...She also has what one might describe as carer's fatigue which makes her short tempered with FIL when clearly it is not his fault he can't remember how to do his shoes up, pick up a fork etc... Is such a cruel illness. Be kind to yourself!!

Kliz loling about the African baby chat. This is something my mum says quite a lot-they spent quite a bit of time in Uganda a few years back and she was always on about if she couldn't have a baby she would just adopt one from there. Like yes, it's really that simple...

So to the 2WW for me. We had good news yesterday. Two top quality blasts frozen and one back in me. We paid extra for the incubator that takes images every ten mins and they give you a copy of that, so you see a speeded up image of it developing. Pretty mad! I should add that this was a much better response than last time when we didn't have any to freeze and the blastocyst wasn't top quality. Not sure what to put this down to-C0q10? Steroids? Luck? Stims drugs? Anyway, who cares...

Feeling quite nervous and apprehensive. Thanks for the tips on meditation, have got the headspace app and practiced most days for the last 2/3. I am quite lazy at it though so have to force myself.

Very bloated from steroids and progesterone and lots of cramps today, poss just settling down after the procedure.

SoSam how are you doing? Hanging in there? Sending positive vibes your way. Hope you are staying sane!
Whew! That was a long post!

Gosh ladies, I go away for a few days and I miss so much. I'm not sure I can really catch up on everything.

Rebecca, I'm pleased to hear you've got siblings who can pitch in. I'm sorry you have concerns about your dad. I don't know him or what his behaviour has really been like, so take this as a grain of salt, but from someone who nursed my mum when she was dying of cancer (only child, single mum, so it was a full time job for me), as a carer you get very fatigued both physically and emotionally and sometimes your behaviour can seem a bit short, but it's because you're at the end of your rope! Your dad may be overwhelmed and in need of a break. Just an idea. Also avocados can go fuck themselves.

So great to hear about all of you being so brave and getting help with it. I really should myself. Help process some of my own grief. I dont know why I don't it seems too scary to let it out. Like if I start, I might fall down and never get back up again, iykwim?

Rose everything you said is so true. There is no longer any naive excitement or that glint in your eye I see in others thinking of starting a family, or even in those going for their first IVF. I'm sorry I can't read back, but where at you at with your plans? Will you be starting a round soonish!

Erica, best of luck (for lack of a better word!) with the erpc. You're one tough cookie!

K8 all the best for starting your cbt. That's awesome. I agree. Without you hags, I would feel very very alone in this show of shit. So thanks. BESH (sob)

Jen I hope your transfer went well. Did you have any make it to the freezer?

SoSam, any mental symptom spotting to be had?

Afm, droid finally arrived! Hurray! And in lieu of any further bullshit dr on holiday delays, I have my scratch on 12 sept and a likely egg collection date of 12 October, which is my late father's birthday, so I hope he can make something good happen for us. I finally feel like we are starting for real after waiting 2 years since our last fet, which was my early miscarriage. I know I've only been through one and all the what ifs that go through your mind. You ladies that have been through recurrent mc are made of steel!

Hello to anyone I missed and hello to lurkers!