Any success stories and ideas for secondary infertility?

[Annabellaboo]

Hello ladies.
I am hoping to get some ideas and support on here.
I am 35 years old, very healthy with a 3 year DS. We have been trying to conceive our second child for 2 years now. I became pregnant very easily with my first and had an easy pregnancy.
This time nothing.
I have had all the tests the nhs provides. Progesterone normal, I ovulate, DH sperm count is normal, no blockages etc etc. I have tried charting, ov sticks, changed my already pretty healthy diet (cut out refined sugars and have lots more greens etc, and alkalised my body). I take advised supplements and have even tried acupuncture.
I do however have short cycles, sometimes as short as 21 days but averaging 24. This is a little shorter than I had before my DS.
We cannot afford IVF and I am not sure I can face that anyway.
My consultant last month has prescribed me a half dose (25mg) of clomid, which a scan showed on the first round it definitely boosted things even more with a good few mature follicles. I already ovulate but she thought as my cycles are quite short and a little irregular it may give me a boost.
I have been convinced several times I was pregnant (oh how cruel our bodies and brains can be!) but AF always turns up.
I guess what I am asking is does anyone have any other suggestions of things I could try or why I can't conceive time. I am open to theories and alternative methods.
Any experience in this subject and success stories please share.
I try not to stress about it all, but some months it just really gets you down as there is no real 'reason'. The hard thing is watching other mums around get pregnant multiple times so easily.
Thank you for listening!
Anna

Sorry to hear about your wobble, Annabella. Yep Facebook is definitely not your best friend if you're going through fertility issues. I actually got my DH to change my password and not tell me what he's changed it to, so I'm not tempted to go on there, ha! Some people put so so many photos up there, including good friends of mine, and sometimes I feel like saying, your 2 month old baby looks exactly the same as they did yesterday when you last put up a photo up of him, trust me!

I think, like you were saying, that despite how hard this has all been, it will definitely make us more sensitive and compassionate people and make us think before we go what could be considered 'boasting' about our children, or other aspects of our lives.

I know what you mean, though, how you can just be going about your day, thinking, Im handling all this remarkably well, and something like that can totally knock you back when you're least expecting it.

Closephine, I forgot to add, that's interesting about your DH getting told very different things, I think I remember you saying that before, which is probably why I've been a bit sceptical. I got my DH to do the semen analysis twice, the first time his morphology was 6%, and 2nd time it was 4%. His count was 52 million the first time and I think around 20 million the second time. So counts are normal, but not particularly high, and morphology was low in the second sample. I may get him to do another one in a few weeks like you suggest.

Closephine, did you find any books on male factor infertility? DH just had second analysis done, and results were again abnormal. Received the news just as AF arrived. The urologist in the practice is not available until June. Feeling very down and powerless.

I think the hardest thing about infertility is that we restart the cycle of grief every month..and the sense of loss gets greater each time. I'm feeling shattered. And the hardest thing about secondary infertility is the need to wear a smile and pretend like everything's ok -- because most people don't(/won't or can't) understand and you need to continue on for the sake of your existing child. Its exhausting.

Today is a day of grief...I'm having a hard time holding back the tears. I know it will get better, and the darkness of grief will be replaced with the light hope in a couple of weeks.

Anna & Jenny, sorry to hear you are both feeling down at the moment. The smallest thing can take you from feeling ok to crashing and burning can't it?

Jenny - you hit the nail on the head that most people can't/won't understand secondary infertility. I've lost count of the times people with a number of kids have told me 'well at least you have ds'. I'm afraid I haven't found any books on male factor infertility, I've had to do extensive googling to find out as much as I can about it. Without putting in the research ourselves, I'm not sure where we would be at now. Probably still being told DHs counts are ok?! Bizarre as 2 million is most definitely not ok!!

Anna - how are you doing now? Facebook can be irritating. Most of my friends are quite private and don't post baby bombs. There is the odd one that slips through but I generally don't feel too scared to check.

Rose - your DHs counts sounds relatively ok, would he take some supplements to potentially boost his morphology? Proxeed is supposed to be best.

I'm still doing ok at the mo. No more pains so pretty certain I am now 4dpo. I have a big event coming up for my business in a week or so. Hoping that is going to mean I don't have time to think about the 2ww!

Thanks ladies for all your words and support, and yes very well said Jenny.
I am doing ok. Really have fallen off the positive wagon a little the last couple days and I am desperately trying to crawl back up. My DS has also been particularly challenging so that makes it always tougher. I can tell this 2ww for me is going to be a bit of a difficult one. Trying to let go but not managing too well so far.
Rose you made me laugh about getting your husband to change your password on FB! maybe I should do the same.
With all the talk about sperm count I want DH to do another one as it's been over a year. The frustrating thing is they never gave us a copy of his results and I stupidly didn't write it down just taking their word for it that is was fine. I called yesterday asked but they told me I would have to write to the records department and pay a fee! How ridiculous! So I am sending DH back to the docs if he ever has time off work (unlikely) for him to ask to do another one. Wish I could remember them but I don't at all. Seems that their are different opinions on what is good and not!

Anna - that does sound ridiculous that you would have to pay to be told your DHs results!! And yes, there seem to be varying guidelines about what the normal ranges are.

Well I've just fallen into crazy mode. I apologise in advance if this is too much information but basically I went to the loo earlier and there was a little pink/brown spotting. I'm only 6dpo and I never get spotting at this stage in my cycle... decided to have a little feel of my cervix (as you do!) and it felt SO weird. Really squishy almost like it was full of water. So I've now decided I am either pregnant or have cervical cancer. I have had issues with my cervix in the past and have an erosion on it. I had a smear and a colposcopy last summer, both of which were fine but now I'm in a bit of a tiz. I guess a week won't make much difference to either find out if I'm pregnant or if it has changed the way it feels... no point running to the dr now is there?

Oh no closephine what a tricky and frustrating position to be in! When I was reading the beginning part I was thinking you must be pregnant but as you seem to have a history of cervix issues I have no idea. Would the laparoscopy have shown up anything if there had been a problem with it? I would say there is no point in going to the docs until you see if AF turns up. Oh what torture!
I am also getting slightly crazy as I have had a metallic taste in my mouth for a couple days. I think I'm about a week past ovulation and I have had this taste a couple times in the past so I am not reading too much into it. Still it's a tease though.
I have tried feeling my cervix before and honestly i have no idea what I am feeling for so gave up that one!
Really hoping this is it for you....everything crossed.

Thanks Anna - had another feel and it felt slightly more normal again (wtf?) but still no explanation for the spotting. I am very good at stressing myself out over this type of thing. It's very hard to imagine it to be anything positive when we've been trying so long. I'll just have to wait another week and then decide whether I think I need to go to the Drs. I don't know re the laparoscopy but they would have had a look at it when they put the dye through it so I hope would have seen anything visibly wrong?

I've had that metallic taste before too - I wonder if it's something I've always had ocassionally but because it's a symptom of pregnancy actually notice it now. Sorry the crazy has got you too... clearly no matter how hard we try it's going to get us eventually! Oh for a month without thinking about all this!

Oh by the way, glad you don't think I'm crazy for having a feel... made the mistake of telling DH and he thinks I'm nuts. Talked myself down a bit now... I've had a smear, colposcopy, laparoscopy and various ultrasounds and examinations all in the last 8 months so I think if have to be pretty unlucky if all those had missed something?! Also I think blood from the cervix is generally bright red, this is very pale pink.

I wouldn't be too concerned about there being a cervical problem, if you've had all those investigations so recently, especially the colposcopy, which is particularly good at picking up abnormal things. Certainly don't think you're crazy, and I'm not at all squeamish so really don't mind people talking about that stuff. I also struggle with understanding what my cervix feels like, so gave up quite early with that mode of fertility tracking! Let's hope this is good news!!!

My DH went out with our next door neighbour for a drink the other night, and it turns out they tried for 18 months to get pregnant with their little girl. They had been referred for IVF when it just happened naturally. I love hearing stories like that, especially about people you know where you just had no idea, and my DH would not have found out had he not mentioned that we were struggling ourselves. Maybe it is a lot more common than we think?

Anna, sorry to hear you've been feeling down again, I'm waiting for it to hit me too. Have been feeling quite numb recently, and not sure how much longer that's likely to last. I think we've had quite a few distractions what with moving house, so I'm sure that's part of it.

Thanks Rose, the sensible side of my brain knows you are right. Scared to go to the loo now tho. I don't want to see any more spotting!

It's supposedly 1 in 3 couples that struggle isn't it? That seems incredibly high tho. Especially at the rate everyone around me seems to fall pregnant!

Hmm ladies what would you do in this situation? I still seem to have spotting (it's the faintest pink, smallest amount, probably wouldn't even notice it if I wasn't ttc like a crazy woman!) and I have a wedding reception tonight and hen do tomorrow. Would you drink on the very unlikely off chance this could be implantation bleeding? Or would you abstain? Tonight is easier, I can get a glass of wine, have a few sips then lose it somewhere... tomorrow... not so easy to not drink at a hen do! And if I drive they will assume I'm pregnant, which I really don't want!?

Hmmm tricky predicament. Isn't it always annoying timing?! Maybe you could tell a white lie and say you are in antibiotics for something? Personally I would have a little wine (really it is fine the French drink all the time when preggas!!) and then make up the white lie for the hen do.
And I laughed when you said DH thinks your crazy with the cervix thing! There have been a few occasions when mine has definitely looked at my like I am a crazy lady!
I am feeling better again the last couple days thank goodness. I got a date for my laparoscopy so that has sort of perked me up too. Who would have thought the news of invasive surgery would be such a mood lifter??!!!
It's scheduled for mod June so quicker than they had initially predicted.
Rose- it is a bit comforting when you discover others have struggled isn't it. Especially with a success story. The only lady I know however has been trying for 3 years and now is turning to IVF as they feel they must. The mystery of it all is the most frustrating part of all I think. I don't like not knowing why!

I should also add closephine that if you do decide to drink don't stress about it. I didn't know I was pregnant first time and had loads of wine on our anniversary dinner! Many women don't know and get so drunk with no issues at all. I think it is prob more of an issue if you drink regularly and heavily throughout a pregnancy, not a one off night.

Yes I agree with Anna, I would not go overboard but definitely don't stress about having a glass or two. That's so weird that you're spotting at this point of your cycle, I suppose 6dpo is a little early for implantation, but maybe you could have ovulated a little earlier than you predicted? Keeping everything crossed for you.

My DH and I also have a big fancy work do on Sunday night, so really keen to drink as it will all be included, I think I will on this occasion even though we are in the 2ww.

Thanks ladies, I might need that glass of wine tonight to calm myself down! I'm a bit of a wreck.

Rose - you're probably right that it's too early for implantation. Google says 6-12 days after ovulation. I had small twinges in my left ovary last Friday so it would have made yesterday day 6. Who knows!?

Cervix still feels soft and squishy (must stop feeling! And also must stop reporting back to DH haha!) which it's never felt like before. So trying desperately not to get my hopes up but at the same time feeling stupidly hopeful!

Anna - that's great news that you have your date for invasive surgery :) haha! If you have any questions about it let me know. I worried myself silly about it but it was actually fine.

Oh my word... just stumbled across this post - is she serious?!? www.mumsnet.com/Talk/pregnancy/2621401-Sister-is-pregnant-And-Im-not-happy?pg=1&order=

Omg is she for real?! this made me fume. I know people find it hard to understand when they haven't been through it themselves, but this just takes the biscuit! And there we are struggling with our feelings of guilt over finding it hard when our friends get pregnant with their 3rd and 4ths!

Any more spotting closephine? I didn't realise implantation could take place from 6dpo.... Oh my goodness how amazing would it be.

I find it odd how my cycles vary so much. Last cycle I had lots of CM yet my boobs didn't get bigger until day before AF. This cycle I've had hardly any CM but boobs are bigger at time of ovulation. Now normally I wouldn't give a f# (just be grateful for bigger boobs!) but now I notice and read into everything and it is so bloody annoying!!!

When I first read it I thought she was the one struggling to conceive as that would have actually made some sense. Then I realised what she was actually saying and I couldn't believe it!!! Genuinely flabbergasted by it. I hope she reads all the responses and realises.

Still spotting which probably rules out implantation. I also took a test this morning and it was bfn :( I'm only 9dpo so I know that's very early still but lots of things I've read are saying that you can get a positive from 2 days after implantation occurs. So now I'm not feeling so hopeful and also still worrying about what the spotting actually is?! The only thing I'm wondering is whether using progesterone on and off over the last few months (not using it this month) has somehow imbalanced my hormones. But that really is just a guess. Probably more likely it would cause spotting on a month I was using it than one when I'm not.

My boobs do the same. Some months they hurt like hell almost as soon as I ovulate and others nothing until the day before AF. Currently nothing. When I was pregnant with ds they didn't hurt much at all. They felt bruised if I really poked them but never as full and painful as they can be in the run up to AF. Always found that weird as tender boobs seems to be a major symptom for most women.

Wow that lady is super precious and spoiled! but actually I kind of laughed because I just love the responses of all the women just handing her a load of abuse!!! Especially as she asked for some kind words-haha! I am being a little cruel I know but she asked for it!
My boobs are so pathetic since breastfeeding DS for 18 months. I am very small anyway but now they are sad little empty sacks!
I am convinced that if I am actually pregnant one month they will get a little fuller and sore so this is how I would know. They never get swollen before AF now but used to sometimes before DS.
Sorry your still in limbo closephine. I have also gone a touch crazy again. After adamantly saying I will never do IVF I started looking into IVF abroad!! There's a clinic in Athens that is supposed to be really great and about 1/3 cheaper than here. So tempting but I need to stop! Not going down that route....I hope!

She definitely asked for it and I really hope she reads all the responses and realises how childish she was being.

I'm with you on the small boob front Anna - I am 34A at a push (up! Haha). Mine have started to hurt today. I don't think that tells me much either way really, it's only when they start to hurt like hell I think I'm out because they didn't when I was pregnant.

Still had some spotting this morning, the same tiny amount and colour. Very peculiar. But negative test so feeling less hopeful, which is probably a good thing. I was starting to get my hopes up a bit too high.

Have you looked up the Czech Republic clinics? I think there are a couple of popular ones there that are cheap and have quite good results. I looked up Athens but was a bit put off by traveling there and I read a couple of reviews about it being quite a dingy place.

Hi closephine. I haven't looked at the Czech Republic but good to know. I had come across an article about women in the uk going abroad for IVF and the serum clinic in Athens was coming up as a firm favourite. I am not going to look into it any further for now but at least its a comfort to know there is potentially an affordable option for IVF if I ever did really consider it.
I'm thinking maybe your spotting this month could be related to not taking your progesterone? I know yo said it's unlikely but these things can make subtle changes when transitioning. I used to spot a lot more when I believe my progesterone was lower. I had really short cycles and spotting a few days before. I rarely get that now and my cycles are a little longer so it could be pregesterone related.
Our boobs are the same size! 34a at a push!! Wish I could remember how they were when I first got pregnant but I really don't at all. It's amazing how unaware of so many hormonal pregnancy related things I was back then. Ahhh to be lucky enough to be so blissfully unaware again!!

Just had to add that I am ALSO a 34A. We are bra size buddies ha!

Haha!! Brilliant!!