killers of james bulger should not have been prosecuted??

[pregnochicklol]

Oh okay, because they're kids they should just be left to be a danger to everyone else?

Is this woman out of her mind?
Prison isn't just about punishment, it's about protecting others!

And I don't believe for one second that they didn't know it was wrong.
When I was a kid a bully (ring leader) tried to strangle my little sister, she was evil. But even her friends (aged around 7-9) realised her behaviour wasn't right made her release her. NORMAL Kids DO know what's right.

Clarissimo I apologise for not being able to engage fully with everyone in this thread.
I bit off more than I could chew with no many people demanding answers from me on things, there weren't enough people fighting my veiw so I have avoided some things yes.
In my defense I do have a 3 yr old with me 24/7 whom I'm entertaining, I havent stayed deadly serious throughout this thread.

I didn't look so deeply into the disney song. lol, I was just quoting that humans are animals.
I don't think humans are as superior as most think! :-)

Also; damn right sleepinglion I apploud your honest and natural response without overthinking and philosophising the matter.

how did you think such a contentious thread would fo?

100 % agreemnt in your call for exectuion/exile and stoning?

I wonder how many people on this thread who think Venables and Thompson were treated leniently were among those who were most hand-wringing about Baby P's death? Because if that boy had grown up, chances are that he would have ended up committing an heinous crime. Are children of abusive homes only victims until they start replaying some of that violence themselves?

lulumaan I don't remember saying I think they should be stoned, can you quote me on that?

and LadyBiscuit are you saying that being a childhood victim AND an evil perpetrator are incompatable things to be and they cannot be both?

Jon Venables was NOT an abused child. He was violent and sadistic, and the sexual element to the crime against James was hushed up so as not to cause further trauma to his parents, who had suffered enough. It doesn't surprise me in the slightest that Venables is now facing a child pornography charge, as he clearly always had those urges. And it obviously is a child pornography charge because the government tried unsuccesfully to get an injunction out against the Sun to stop them publishing the information.

Children aren't evil.

sorry pregnochick, you said beating not stoning

like it matters so much the point is your viewpoint was that death or further violence was warranted.

Ladybisucit, i've brough that up twice re BabyP, yet to get an answer

am not holding my breath

Pregnochick - half of my family have similar views to you and they can't understand that anyone would think anything different.

You are right enough that it is a common view, but it is still an extreme view. Especially when you are shocked [rightly] about violence perpetrated against a child and then in the same breath advocating extreme violence against children. Can you not see the contradictions there?

Maybe not evil, but some are sociopathic.

And on another point, I'm quite sure that this Maggie Atkinson gave herself a huge pat on the back when she made her statement about lowering the age of criminal responsibility, telling herself how compassionate she was, how intellectual, how enlightened.

Well it's a shame she didn't stop for one second to think how her compassionate, enlightened view of James Bulger's slaugher as 'unpleasant' might sound to his poor mother, who is serving her own life sentence.

She should be sacked immediately.

And I don't understand the comparison with this little baby Peter, who was beaten to death.

As I have said over and over again, there is no evidence that Jon Venables was ever abused.

Lulumaam
I've looked back and you seem to have been the first one to mention anyone thinking stoning is right, I've never thought stoning should be done, so that's a strawman I'm afraid.

Besom, glad to hear I'm not going mad and the world DOES contain other people with my veiws :-) I wish they were here to argue them.
Saying a child deserves a good beating for doing such an awful thing, I hope you understand is an instinctual response. I didn't fully think of the type of beating.
I often say beating to mean a tanning to the back of the legs if you know what I mean, how they would have done back in the day.
Maybe I was not thinking of a real beating were bones are broken and such I could never condone that even for those murderous 10yr olds.

lulumaan I love how your apology of misquoting me was quickly followed by 'like it matter ~sarcastic face~'
lol thanks

lulumaam I just addressed the baby p situation for the second time on this page.
So why the post dedicated only to one sarcastic comment about me avoiding that?
I feel your largely on here just to slander me now.

I really dislike debating with anyone in an unfriendly way like I've said.
I like discussion to be aimed at us all coming towards an argreement( while perhaps not agreeing), not hostile arguing :-s

yes let's discount the views of social workers, psychologists, police officers, teachers, lawyers,

what do they know?

I'm sure a good beating would sort out a 'sociopathic' child, no problem.

Oh what's the use. I've a psychology essay to do. ho hum

bobbymum
even if jon venebles was treated like baby p himself I don't feel it makes a difference to whether or not he should be allowed back in the community.

Sorry but there is plenty of evidence that Jon Venables was an abused child. The police say he was terrified of his mother. I may have no direct evidence but nobody here has any direct evidence he was NOT. Personally I think his actions were not those of a child from a loving home. Be sensible here - children who are products of abusive families are more likely to become abusers themselves. He was 10 years old, a child - and all the published media suggests he was an abused child.

My sympathies STILL lie with James Bulger and his family though. This does not mean however that I cannot use my brain and work out that children from loving and non abusive homes do not act in this way.

Venables was neglected and had clear behavioural difficulties which it doesn't seem were ever addressed. There is not a gulf between these two boys and most children I'm afraid. I think it's easier to discount them as evil because then they are so 'other' that we don't need to consider the whys and wherefores.

For those of you who are interested, there is a very good article in the Economist this week.

JollyPirate - exacty. I have worked with vulnerable adults for many years. I have rarely, if ever, met anyone who is not disturbed for a fairly obvious reason.

(Aside from people with organic mental health problems like schizophrenia or whatever).

If children don't know that torture and murder is wrong and they don't understand the circumstances of their actions then why aren't more children murdering more children?

Of course they knew exactly what they were doing and blaming their upbringing does not let these monsters off the hook. There are countless numbers of children growing up under terrible circumstances; some grow up to be perfectly normal people, some grow up to be dysfunctional. How many as children become twisted, torturing murderers.

Personally I don't give a crap what happens to them so long as they are not in a position to hurt anyone ever again.

"I feel desperately sorry for Venables and Thompson whose lives have been destroyed by parental ineptitude. That doesn't mean that what they did to James wasn't wrong, it just acknowledges that they too were children and needed care and support that they didn't get through their formative years.

Nobody is born evil, including those boys, and I care deeply about two emotionally damaged children who are now emotionally damaged adults" - streakybacon, are you for real?

the hmm face was at the differntiation between beatng and stoning, pregnochick. like one is so very different than the other

i am not slandering you

it is a busy thread and if i have missed something you said, then i apologise.. the commetn was not just for you, but for other people too of the 'hang 'em /beat 'em' argument, i had not addressed it to you by name

you are taking this personally

you started a strong thread on a contentious topic, and can;t take the strong and contentious opinions that come with it

That is not to say that I would excuse this disguting behaviour.

As someone said earlier it is entirely possible to feel revulsion for this terrible murder - I have a toddler myself and have been very tearful this week at the thought of what happend to James. I know that shopping centre quite well and I can picture it. It makes me want to vomit.

But I still do not agree that the other children are evil/should be vilified.

It was right that they were punished but not right that it was in an adult court. It was a political act.

I agree with everything that lulumanan has said tbh.

Are you really surprised there is some unfriendliness and hostility when you are of the opinon that young criminals could benefit from a good beating, exile or being locked up unitl they do, or from execution....??

you are not posting in a vacuum, your words elicit a response , same as some of the thngs youve posted have elicited a response from others

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