killers of james bulger should not have been prosecuted??

[pregnochicklol]

Oh okay, because they're kids they should just be left to be a danger to everyone else?

Is this woman out of her mind?
Prison isn't just about punishment, it's about protecting others!

And I don't believe for one second that they didn't know it was wrong.
When I was a kid a bully (ring leader) tried to strangle my little sister, she was evil. But even her friends (aged around 7-9) realised her behaviour wasn't right made her release her. NORMAL Kids DO know what's right.

I was simply asking as they were all brought up in the same way why is it supposedly excusable for 1 of the 3 to have done this while the other 2 have no??

I thought he was going to have a trial under his new name so as not to prejudice the jury re his earlier crime.

expat, I assumed the op was from the US not because of her views but because of comments made on a different thread (yes, I checked posting history as the views expressed by the op on this thread were so odd, making light of the situation etc). On a different thread she has made reference to the fact that her child is in kindergarten, a term that is not used in the UK but is in the US? So I questioned where she was from as I find it hard to understand why someone would get so het up about this if they're not even resident in the country in question. Am only too aware that there are many Brits that share the op's view (the fact these two have new identities is clear evidence of that).

"Would you be accepting of Ian Huntly being given a new identity if he was released from prison?" well, Ian Huntley was an adult who was capable of taking adult responsibility for his actions, so that is entirely different. However, if we look at the reasons why people are given new identities, surely if you don't believe in vijilanti justice then you need to accept that prisoners who are released may be given new identities for their own safety.

'On a different thread she has made reference to the fact that her child is in kindergarten, a term that is not used in the UK but is in the US? '

It's a term commonly used in many countries in Europe and in Canada, too.

yes, sky news reporting this morning that JV may not be tried but that parole board may decide whether he will be detained.

I imagine that even if he was tried under his new name someone would leak the details. After all the fact he has been recalled has been leaked, details of his aledged crimes have been leaked, so why would his trial be any different.

He's repeatedly admitted his own identity himself.

If he's given a new ID, he'll likely do the same thing, especially if he doesn't stop abusing drink and drugs.

Those who think they should not have been tried in an adult court read this below and see how you would feel if it was YOUR child that had either done this or been a victim of these EVIL excuses for human beings.

His upper body was hidden within the coat. His lower body was further down the tracks, completely undressed. He had suffered 42 injuries, most to his face and head and had not died during the attack, but some time before the train hit him. Jon and Robert had left him while he was still alive.

Crime Scene (POLICE)Investigators stopped all approaching trains. Led by Detective Albert Kirby, police roped off the tracks and shielded the scene from bystanders and reporters. James's body had been severed with some distance in between. It was as if there were two crime scenes, two bodies to examine. The upper part of his body, at first, appeared to be nothing more than a bundle of clothing. His lower half, however, was starkly naked. Police determined that James had been laid by the waist onto the rail, with his upper body on the inside of the tracks. It looked as if his head had been covered with bricks, but the force of the train disturbed the arrangement. The lower half of his body had been carried further down the track.

His clothing, which had been removed from the waist down, was laid near his head. His underwear was heavily soaked with blood. Nearby police found a heavy iron bar, two feet long, with bloodstains, and many bricks and stones with blood. They also found 3 AA batteries near the body. These batteries intrigued the investigators, who had suspicions about their placement before James was hit by the train. A tin of blue paint was also found nearby. James had been severely beaten around the head and neck. There had been fractures, cuts, bruises caused by blows from heavy blunt objects and there had been severe bleeding. On one cheek, a patterned bruise appeared, which indicated the imprint from a shoe. Although there was no conclusive evidence indicating a sexual assault, forensic specialists believed that some of the injuries below the waist were suspicious and sexual in nature

The full report i have read

"accept that prisoners who are released may be given new identities for their own safety"

Like who?

Most if not all perpetrators of similarly heinous crimes stay behind bars for life. Or such a long portion of their lives that upon their release, not many care to aggress the 90 year old frail men that they have become.

I struggle to think of any killer who has been given a new identity upon his release from prison, for his safety.

Mary Bell.

Mary Bell was given a new identity and is now a Grandmother....still not deserving of the new identity imo.

Why should the criminal be protected when the victims were not??

Sorry, I wasn't really saying it was the right thing to do, I was just naming someone who has been given a new name for their own safety.

I struggle with the whole thing but really don't believe there are any winners.

"Those who think they should not have been tried in an adult court read this below and see how you would feel if it was YOUR child that had either done this
or been a victim of these EVIL excuses for human beings."

But you can't make those comparisons because none of us have a child who has been through that. No-one would argue that the parent of a murdered child wouldn't feel strongly about the sentencing handed down to the killers of their child. But justice is not handed out by the victims - justice is handed out by the legal system. And as someone who has not been through the ordeal we have the ability to be objective.

Mary Bell was given life-long anonimity. And it could be argued that her crime was worse as she killed not one, but two children. yet she was only ever convicted of manslaughter. But she has not gone on to re-offend.

Maxine Carr was given a new identity, and although her crime was not as severe, some don't see it that way.

I think that unless you are a supporter of vijilantiism then there is no option but to agree that criminals who are released need to be given new identities in order to protect them from society.

Some would argue that such criminals should be released, but the reality is that they are. And it's not for us to hand out our own form of justice when that happens, hence the need for controvercial criminals that are released to be protected.

I will never agree that they should be given a new identity.

FGS if i stole a car i wouldn't get a new identity enabling me to live my life with no record of it as I am untraceable I would have to face the demons of my crime and deal with them.

So why does a murderer deserve to have a new identity

it's not about a murderer "deserving" to have a new identity. It's about the fact that we live in a society where some people feel that it is their moral right, or duty, or whatever you want to call it, to go and hand out justice where they feel none has been served, people who have had no actual involvement in the case but who feel they have a right to act as vijilanti's.

How many people would remember what Mary Bell did? Probably very few as it happened in the 60s. Yet she has only fairly recently been granted life-long anonimity as has her daughter due to threats against their safety.

Whatever you think of murderers and the like, anyone who has been deamed fit for release does have the right to live as safely as anyone else. Just ecause someone has committed a crime does not mean they automatically deserve to be made a victim.

And if you stole a car I doubt you'd have the mob round to smash your windows.

LadyEvenStar Why do you so object to released killers being given new identities? Why is it that you or someone else needs to know who they are?

As wannaBe says, it has nothing to do with what they 'deserve', it is common sense. If people knew who they were, they would be lynched by some angry, misguided member of the public who would then go on to be tried themselves for murder. And what good would that serve?

Olifin

why do i object? simple because the victims and families of the victims live with what happened every single day without a chance to forget. why the hell does the criminal have the right to live their life with little regard for what they did because the law says it is ok for them to continue living under a false name for their protection. What makes them more deserving of being protected than their next vicitm?

"unless you are a supporter of vijilantiism then there is no option but to agree that criminals who are released need to be given new identities in order to protect them from society"

But they aren't. All but four (I think) criminals in the entire UK criminal justice history have either stayed in prison forever or gone out to face the backlash.

Pedophiles, for example, risk serious risk from the public upon their release. How many have been offered life-long anonymity? Zero. They serve their sentence, then go out into the world and try to be really nice to their neighbours so that one may call the police if villagers show up at their door with pitchforks.

The reason why the two Bulger murderers and Mary Bell were exceptionally given new identities seems to be that they were children who could and presumably had been rehabilitated. They were given a second chance on the basis of this assumption.

If indeed Venables committed another crime against a child or children, the above assumption is shown to be null and void. Therefore, from this point forward, he does not deserve anonymity. Just like any other criminal. He serves his sentence, then goes out into the world. That is all I am saying.

CoteDAzur

Thanks you said what i was trying to but so much better lol

I totally agree with CoteDAzur's post above, and it seem there are some people here who are confused and think Venables is still 10 years old. He isn't, he's a grown man, practically middle-aged. He had his second chance at a new life and he blew it. His childhood is now a moot point - you may as well say poor Ian Brady, he was an abused child, he can't help what he did. Venables is accountable for his own actions, same as any other 27 year old sexual deviant.

'hence the need for controvercial criminals that are released to be protected. '

Yes, their needs definitely supercede society's need to be protected.

'He isn't, he's a grown man, practically middle-aged.'

LOL! 27 is 'practically middle-aged'? Good gawd, some of us have one foot in it then.

I find it an interesting dichotomy: that Veneables and criminals like him are seen as trusthworthy enough to be released back into society, new identity and all, but society can't be trusted at all around such criminals - society is the barbarian; not the likes of Veneables.

Yeah, good point. But we just have to take their word for it, of course, that Venables is trustworthy enough to be released into society and not ask too many questions. After all, we, the tax paying public, don't have any right to ask questions. We just have to do as we're told and not think too much.

"Why do you so object to released killers being given new identities? Why is it that you or someone else needs to know who they are?"

So that we are careful around them, obviously.

I would like to know if someone is a pedophile so I don't trust my children to his care.

I would like to know if someone is a thief so I keep a hand on my purse around him.

Similarly, I would like to know if someone is a sociopath who has tortured and murdered a small child so I can see them coming from a mile away.

All very normal. What is it that surprises you in the need for self-preservation?