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Man shoots himself, wife and daughter.

175 replies

Ewe · 29/12/2009 14:04

How very sad

It's really near to where one of my good friends lives, he was just telling me about it. Utterly devastating for all there family and friends.

OP posts:
FabIsGoingToBeFabIn2010 · 30/12/2009 10:41

EleanorRigby - the mother isn't dead.

ElenorRigby · 30/12/2009 10:47

I kept off this thread until more news had come out about this tragic case.
After a months separation it is highly unlikely that the courts were involved. The mother was faciltating the contact, so surely the poor poor woman believed her daughter would be ok. The fact she left her car running suggests she wanted a quick drop off and get away
Sadly it looks to me like her sick fuck ex had planned this to shoot his daughter in front of his ex as a punishment? How truely evil. The last thing she would have seen was her daughter being shot. That just makes me cry.
People capable of such evil sadly do exist, both men and women, remember Rekha Kumari Baker? who stabbed to death her two teenage daughters as punishment for her ex husband.

I just hope that man is burning in hell. The evil of his actions is unbelievable.

ElenorRigby · 30/12/2009 10:49

Fab another poster said she was dead. I dunno I do not think I would want to live if my DD was brutally murdered.
Poor poor woman.

FabIsGoingToBeFabIn2010 · 30/12/2009 10:52

I have just checked the BBC website and the mum is critical.

TheShriekingHarpy · 30/12/2009 11:02

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atlantis · 30/12/2009 11:05

It's quite possible that she had gone to see a solicitor about custody who will have told her right off the bat that the courts position starts from one of presumed contact unless it's in the child's best interests not to have contact (which as we know is hard to prove, it took me four years.)

Agree with the posters on here who say the family courts are allowing violent men contact (usually unsupervised) with their children.

Disagree with anyone who says that a man (or womans) reason for killing their child was because they were 'pushed' over the edge, that's a bullshit defence of a narcissistic and evil person.

I fought for four years through the courts with cafcass backing my ex who had a history of violence against our daughter, smashing up our home on contact visit at christmas, threatening to kill himself, our daughter and me because contact with the father was the 'starting' point and he's 'obviously' changed because he became a father again (a logical explaination) the cafcass woman was an evil little cow who sent the ss after us because I would not cow-tow to her whim and fancy and put our daughter in harms way.

Most mothers from violent relationships are not supported by the courts, the children are frog marched to see the abusive parent and traumatised by the numerous 'professionals' that slither through the system making money from others misery.

For this mother and child it was just a matter of timing as to when the father would strike out, court or no court the ending would probably have been the same.

Poor child. Poor mother. Another child dead because men have more rights than children.

edam · 30/12/2009 11:08

Elenor, I know, but the courts set the expectation even before people get that far - any mother who consulted a solicitor is likely to be told 'well, the courts expect X and if you don't allow contact now that will count against you'.

I hope a lawyer will come on to this thread and tell me I'm wrong, but countless MN threads and news stories suggest I'm not. Sadly there are plenty of cases where courts have insisted men with a history of violence have access, and dozens where the man has gone on to kill his kids. And as someone posted, one case where a woman has killed her children in order to spite her ex. (There may be a few others that haven't been in the news, of course.)

ilovesprouts · 30/12/2009 11:10

what a very sad story just seen this on sky

StewieGriffinsMom · 30/12/2009 11:13

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foxinsocks · 30/12/2009 11:13

why are people (men or women) with a history of violence (if indeeed he does have one) allowed to own a gun? doesn't make sense

edam · 30/12/2009 11:15

Maybe he wasn't but got hold if it illicitly - apparently it's not hard if you know where to ask. (So my BIL, ex-army who goes out rabbiting says - he doesn't keep guns himself but borrows a mate's.)

edam · 30/12/2009 11:16

of - am fighting cat for keyboard rights!

norfolkBRONZEturkey · 30/12/2009 11:24

my thoughts are also with the first police on the scene. The ones who tried to revive the little girl to have her die in their arms. I hope they get any help they may need

edam · 30/12/2009 11:25

God, yes, Bronze.

StewieGriffinsMom · 30/12/2009 11:40

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tiredemma · 30/12/2009 11:42

The news last night said that the Police Officers received support and counselling straight away.

mayorquimby · 30/12/2009 11:45

"Elenor, I know, but the courts set the expectation even before people get that far - any mother who consulted a solicitor is likely to be told 'well, the courts expect X and if you don't allow contact now that will count against you'.

I hope a lawyer will come on to this thread and tell me I'm wrong, but countless MN threads and news stories suggest I'm not. Sadly there are plenty of cases where courts have insisted men with a history of violence have access, and dozens where the man has gone on to kill his kids. And as someone posted, one case where a woman has killed her children in order to spite her ex. (There may be a few others that haven't been in the news, of course.)"

I'm not exceptionally well versed in family law but it is possible (in Ireland anyway) to get an ex-parte barring order against a violent spouse at a district court level which will apply until a full hearing is possible.

StewieGriffinsMom · 30/12/2009 11:50

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edam · 30/12/2009 12:49

mayor, sadly as many MNers can testify, it doesn't work like that over here. (Does the order apply to the children as well as the ex, btw?) The kids still have to see the violent parent and be put at risk until a court decides otherwise. Irish system seems far more sensible.

SolidGoldpiginablanket · 30/12/2009 12:55

A big part of the problem is that domestic violence is still seen as sort of excusable and not that bad. You know, if the woman's a bitch. Or doesn'd do enough housework, or let the man have enough sex with her. Or answers back.
Or if she dares to leave an abusive man and most of all if she even contemplates having a relatinship with someone else, well, it's understandable, isn't it, that he might feel entitled to kill her and the children. Because she didn't know her place any more.

Unless we GET OVER the ideas that men matter more than women, that it's a woman's role and duty to placate violent men and manage their moods by being submissive and obedient, that women and children belong to men and that sexual jealousy is an acceptable justification for violence, this shit will keep happening.

atlantis · 30/12/2009 12:58

Nice one solidgold, couldn't agree more.

Hulababy · 30/12/2009 13:00

How tragic Poor baby.

Can't comment on reasons why this happened as have only read BBC article and no information is giuven there. I don't wish to speculate and certainly don't want to consider the Daily Mail as a reputable source of information!

StewieGriffinsMom · 30/12/2009 13:14

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Marne · 30/12/2009 13:19

Mum has now passed away, so .

standingonmyhands · 30/12/2009 13:19

BBC breaking news is reporting that the mum has died heartbreaking for all concerned

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