Pregnant Woman Told To Leave Pub

[stinkymonkey]

the nanny state continues

I can understand where the landlord is coming from, though I don't agree with what she did.

Airlines do have guidelines, yes.

However, these were put in place purely to protect the mother any baby, not by pregnant women, but for pregnant women (and their babies).

So, it is accepted that women cannot fly after a certain number of weeks, as it may be harmful.

It is also accepted that drinking alcohol may be harmful, yet because there are no set guidelines on it (which would be practically impossible to impose), you think it is discrimination?

what about horseriding then? There are no set guidelines on that, would you suggest a stable owner was discriminating if they didn't allow a pregnant woman to go horeseriding?

If there are no safe limits then the best thing to do would be not to serve women under the age of, say, 50 any alcohol. Most women don't look properly pregnant until 20+ weeks so it is best if the bar staff don't take any chances.

I know little about horseriding so would prefer not to answer. On the face of it though, it would appear to me that it would be discrimination, yes.

I do know about the licensed trade though and I know that there are no guidelines about serving alcohol to pregnant women. Therefore, twas discrimination.

Unless, of course, the pregnant woman was actually asked to leave because she was being violent, offensive or happened to be only 16

I would suggest they were discriminating as the baby is perfectly protected during 'extreme' sports like skiing/cycling/horseriding.

I've never heard anyone say horsewomen should stop riding while pregnant.

Crackfox - obviously, that is ridiculous.

Lets just ban alcohol, its bad for everyone, really.

Its the responsibility of the mother to take care of her child. When she is seen to be failing to do that, it is the responsibility of society to intervene.

This applies both during pregnancy and after birth.

"Provided the pregnant woman is aware of the risks involved, the decision to continue riding or handling horses remains hers alone. However, from the equestrian establishment?s point of view, pregnant women should be discouraged from show jumping or cross country eventing"

the above from some obgyn American site.

If it actually applied during pregnancy we would stop women smoking.

Thankfully we are more enlightened as a society and realise that smoking is tremendously addictive.

It is not harmful to fly in pregnancy. The rules are there because it is inconvenient to the airline, and very expensive for them, to have to make an unscheduled landing if a woman goes into labour.

It is not prohibited to ride a horse or ski or anything like that in pregnancy, but consultants usually advise people to stop after the first trimester, because of balance issues. However experienced riders and skiers often carry on.

As someone else posted, one thing we definitely know leads to adverse outcomes for mother and baby is the lack of a skilled attendant in labour. However we seem to be doing pitiful amounts about improving the availability and quality of midwives in this country. Hospital acquired infection is also a major issue, yet we are happy to allow the cs rate to rise from 1:10 in the 1980s to 1:4 and even 1:3 in some places, putting mothers and children at significant risk of post-operative infection.

Yet we're happy to bully pg women over a second pint.

Apologies if my advice is different from others . I remember being told not to horseride by my MW when pregnant is all.

Squonk - the lady and her party were actually not asked to leave. She was refused service, and they were asked to leave because she drank someone else's drink.

It is illegal to consume alcohol, attempt to purchase, or attempt to purchase on the behalf of someone to whom service has been refused.

When I was 19 worked in a pub for 6 months full time. In 1991 it was perfectly legal for pubs to refuse to serve someone without giving reasons. They can even bar someone for life without giving any reason.

For example pubs sometimes refuse to serve someone because they are a football supporter or have certain clothing. The landlord can refuse to serve someone on the basis of gut feeling. Ie. they don't believe someone when they say that they have had no drinks before hand.

The law is very much on the side of the licencee. (Certainly it was in 1991.) The pregnant lady doesn't have a leg to stand on.

Reallytired - it is the same now. The licensing act that is in place now is the 1976 act, and the 2005 act comes into play in September this year.

There are lots of new rules coming into effect that judging by this thread, aren't going to go down too well!

ReallyTired - whilst you're right, licensees can refuse to serve anyone they like without having to give a reason, they cannot discriminate.

So if you were refused a drink because the landlord didn't like your baseball cap, that's ok. If you were refused a drink because the landlord didn't like the colour of your skin, that's NOT ok.

So, if she was refused service because the landlady didn't like her shoes, that would have been fine. The fact that she was refused service because and only because she was pregnant (if the article is to be believed) is discrimination and is not ok.

DSM - sorry, I misread that bit, but she should not have been refused service.

I think no woman of childbearing age should be served alcohol, just in case she might get pregnant, or is already pregnant but doesn't know yet.

Or perhaps there should be pregnancy tests on the bar.

The problem to me is very little to do with the licensee (who has every right to bar whomever) but is instead to do with a continued erosion of womens rights when pregnant.

I think this just reflects societies wider view of foetal 'rights'.

I'm tempted to post another thread and ask for a poll for peeps to vote on whether pregnant women should be banned from buying cigarettes.

Boffinmum - there is no relationship betweeen a lack of maternity services in general and a refusal to serve alcohol on this occasion. The former is a state issue (and a national disgrace), the latter is a decision made by a licensee who had every legal and, imo, moral right to make it.

When I was pg with both dd2 and ds, I was running a pub and regularly bought alcohol and cigarettes. Had there been a ban on pregnant women buying these things I wouldn't have had any stock to sell.

Incidentally, the taste of alcohol made me sick when pregnant so I didn't touch a drop from the very first cell division to giving birth so I have no ulterior motive for my views on this thread (before anyone accuses me of trying to justify my own alcoholic pregnancies!)

lol at thought of squonk putting down G&T at first cell division and picking it up again 9 months later, straight after last push

I find it amazing that at 23 weeks women can terminate the pregnancy if they choose but can't drink!

And I still don't know which side of the fence i'm on, but better pick one, as I'm gettimg a splinter in my bum

Stealth - it was a pint of Timothy Taylor's Landlord.

I thought "ugh, that tastes like vinegar", went and checked the barrel, twas ok. Got dp to try it, he said twas ok. Got customers to try it, they all said twas ok. I had a lightbulb moment and did a pgy test

Dp had one pulled for me the minute I walked into the bar with newborn baby

And you're on my side, because I'm right

< fetches bucket of poo to throw at DSM as demonstration starts to get out of hand >

What a lovely story Squonk

It does save money on pgy tests, kathy. If I think I may be pg, I just have a pint of beer. If it tastes okay, I don't bother with the test. If it's a bit off, I'll buy a test