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Pregnant Woman Told To Leave Pub

470 replies

stinkymonkey · 31/03/2009 15:53

the nanny state continues

I can understand where the landlord is coming from, though I don't agree with what she did.

OP posts:
ScottishMummy · 02/04/2009 23:30

perhaps if you come up with an original persuasive idea rather than cut and paste someone ideas and add a

"can I point you towards this below"

MMMMM here a tip - come up with an original idea don't mutilate and cut N paste others

what do you think?

original ideas don't originate from cut n paste others discourse,they are in fact your original not sourced or cut n paste ideas

TheOldestCat · 03/04/2009 00:35

But even though you don't live in Canada, aren't you wary about similar attitudes prevailing here? Vamanos - I am very wary. I assume - and hope - this is a rare event. Who wants a world where we dictate how other people treat their bodies?

StewieGriffinsMom · 03/04/2009 08:18

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn

Vamonos · 03/04/2009 09:59

Tip for you too Scottishmummy:

Punctuation (including the use of quotation marks - which, for the avoidance of confusion, are these things here " ") helps you to make sense of who said what.

There are two quotes in my post of 22:50:43. They are surrounded by quotation marks.

The rest of the text is what you might term 'my original thoughts', such as they are.

Cailleachna · 03/04/2009 12:11

Emotive though this subject is, it's worth remembering that newspaper stories are often not as cut and dried as they appear, especially in local papers where there is less chance of being nationally called out for any errors or misinterpretations (not meaning to offend any journalists here!)

Yes, the negative effects of drinking large quantities of alcohol whilst pregnant are not in question. IF the woman in the article really had only had one drink I do think the landlady was a bit unreasonable to refuse to serve her, however it is her decision as licensee, if she feels someone is putting themselves or others at risk, to do so. Maybe the woman was known previously for going over the top. And yes, since what caused her to get thrown out was drinking someone else's drink after having been refused service, I think the licensee acted well within her rights. She might have lost a few customers, but that's her choice.

But the larger issue is whether we, as a society, should allow women's choices to be curtailed simply because of their child-bearing status? Should an educated, healthy woman be allowed to do something which contravenes the medical suggestion of the moment? I'm not saying heavily pregnant women should be able to make their own minds up about regular binge drinking - but in those circumstances social services would probably intervene anyway. "An odd drink now and then", if that's all it is, has not been proven to have an adverse effect on an unborn baby. But because there is a minority who do not understand the concept of moderation, the guidelines have to say "best not to drink at all".

The peanuts issue was a prime example. The guidelines NEVER said "no pregnant woman should eat peanuts", it was all centred around whether there was a history of allergy in the family, but when I was suffering morning sickness and the only thing I could keep down was chunky peanut butter on toast, quite frankly I figured it was better to eat what I could than not eat at all. And all right, there was no reason for the Snickers craving later on, but if a newsagent had refused to serve me one I'd have been a bit miffed, to say the least. I did, however, get quite a few lectures about eating peanuts whilst pregnant, which I blew off. Was I being unfair to my unborn?

If an obviously pregnant woman orders coffee or Coke, should she be refused service? Given that the most risky time for caffeine consumption is believed to be BEFORE she is obviously pregnant, should all women of childbearing age be refused anything that might, possibly, in some circumstances, pose a small chance of threat to a developing baby? If you can prove you're infertile, can you get exemption certificates?

I'm being deliberately facetious, but the bottom line is that women are, by and large, quite capable of making their own decisions based on their own knowledge and assessment of the risk. As long as she's aware of the facts, she's entitled to take chances if she wants to - it doesn't, on it's own, make her a bad person or an unfit mother.

KayHarkerIsPlayingWithMitchell · 03/04/2009 14:41

Cailleachna, mild hijack, only that name is incredibly familiar, and given that it's distinctive, I'm wondering if I know you...

Cailleachna · 03/04/2009 17:23

Kay - I use the name on several forums (and you know what? it's never been "already in use" yet!) so very possibly. I used to be a regular on the BBC Pagan message board, and I'm a member of OBOD...either of those mean anything to you?

KayHarkerIsPlayingWithMitchell · 03/04/2009 17:36

I think they do... did you go to Uni in West Yorkshire by any chance?

Cailleachna · 03/04/2009 18:44

I did, as it happens! So should I recognize your name too?

KayHarkerIsPlayingWithMitchell · 03/04/2009 18:54

Yup, you know me - but I'm very much incognito, and if you guess, then I really need you to keep it quiet, ok? This is my safe place.

Clue: You didn't come to my wedding (you bugger)

Cailleachna · 03/04/2009 22:07

Kay - gotcha. If you want to, and you can, send me a Facebook poke.

hands thread back to everyone else

KayHarkerIsPlayingWithMitchell · 03/04/2009 22:10

Will do

HarbourSeal · 03/04/2009 22:15

I am a first-time poster, so please be gentle

I read this story and was outraged and saddened by the landlords reaction. Zoe Williams wrote a really great (and really reassuring for me, considering I didn't know I was pregnant until 5 months gone and had acted like a typical student o.O) article in The Guardian which can be found here.

There was, of course, my own little discrimination story: a cashier at superdrug told me I shouldn't be eating peanuts in "my condition" as it could cause a nut allergy in my child. I kinda wish I had gone to the papers, but it was so ridiculous that I just told her that it was none of her business and she wasn't medically trained. She seemed pretty huffy about selling me them though lol

Facts as they are, I felt perfectly comfortable flouting the "recommendations" given to me. Because that is all they are, recommendations. I did what I felt was best for me and what the both of us needed. If I felt stressed, I had a glass of wine and lemonade, and would treat myself to the same with a meal. I loved prawn cocktail (I would order it as a starter and as a main course, one craving I certainly don't miss since I hate fish most of the time ) and didn't notice nor care if anyone was tutting. Too busy eating, methinks. lol

I must have done something right because the pup is 20 months now and can count to 10, speaks in sentences, sings, dances, plays independently and has so much energy and sleeps all through the night that (despite the absent father circumstances) I feel genuinely lucky and privileged to have her.

We should be cherishing and enjoying pregnancy, not legislating it, or pseudo-legislating through unclear and often contradicting "recommendations", and, through that, causing stress and worry to mothers-to-be and society in general as they are unsure how to react to a pregnant woman having a drink with friends. IMHO, a society that surrounds motherhood with stress and worry is far more harmful than three units of alcohol.

WilfSell · 03/04/2009 22:18

WEll done for a balanced and well-thought through first post

fryalot · 03/04/2009 22:23

what wilf said

and welcome to MN, harbourseal

edam · 03/04/2009 23:06

VERY good point that we should be looking after pregnant women rather than berating them, harbourseal.

(Although mixing wine and lemonade is a criminal waste of good booze, IMO. )

Cailleachna · 03/04/2009 23:09

"We should be cherishing and enjoying pregnancy, not legislating it, or pseudo-legislating through unclear and often contradicting "recommendations", and, through that, causing stress and worry to mothers-to-be and society in general..."

Amen to that.

lunamoon2 · 03/04/2009 23:20

I find the story quite bizzare. If the woman wants to enjoy a few drinks then it is her own body and not public property. However if she was totally pissed and falling on the floor, vomitting then I could understand the landlord refusing to derve her.

My point is this though: how come pubs allow already extremely drunk people into their premises every weekend and still continue to serve them?
Surely it would make more sense to refuse serving these people.

HarbourSeal · 04/04/2009 01:21

Aaaaw, shucks Thanks for the warm welcome guys.

And trust me when I say none of that alcohol was wasted kekeke...

Much love x

tigerdriver · 04/04/2009 01:28

Harbourseal, what a great (first) post. This thread has made me despair. No-one is anyone's property, not EVEN a pregnant woman. Well said, my dear seal.

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