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Original poster

Ecstacy not wose than riding a horse!

193 replies

tumtumtetum · 07/02/2009 13:54

here

Love that comparison!

Our risk assessments of so many things are just way off - and society suffers as a result.

This puts the ecstatcy use into context anyway.

Now if we could have some similar ones about crime that would be fab!

OP posts:
UnquietDad · 07/02/2009 14:49

tumtum - it's not regulated, so one E could kill you.

rolandbrowning · 07/02/2009 14:50

Unquiet dad I don't understand why you think it is idiotic to use drugs safely?

rolandbrowning · 07/02/2009 14:51

One horse ride could kill you. Lots of things could kill you.

UnquietDad · 07/02/2009 14:52

rolandbrowning - I don't. There is a way to do so. It's called Not Taking Them. But that isn't what these people were promoting.

Original poster
tumtumtetum · 07/02/2009 14:56

What roland said.

You are far more likely to get killed in a car accident than to die taking ecstacy. 10 people killed or seriously injured on the streets every day in London alone. Now that is a risk which we should take seriously - but people choose not to. What they choose to do is go around spouting nonsense like "but one pill could kill you". Half a million people alive after taking ecstacy each weekend kind of make that comment a bit silly.

OP posts:
Ronaldinhio · 07/02/2009 14:57

Everything is safe if you don't do it...should there be a report published on that?

christiana · 07/02/2009 14:57

Message withdrawn

christiana · 07/02/2009 14:58

Message withdrawn

Original poster
tumtumtetum · 07/02/2009 15:01

I think that there would be a serious debate to be had if it was cocaine or heroin that people were trying to say did little harm.

But ecstacy really does do little harm.

Apart from anything else, you don't lose your inhibitions in the same was as alcohol. If all teens who drink too much took E instead there would be a huge drop in crime, violence, sex attacks, STDs, unwanted prgnancies etc etc.

Why people insist on demonising it is baffling to me. I started this thread assuming that there were more people with a logical mindset on MN than the purely emotional knee-jerk response that so many have.

OP posts:
UnquietDad · 07/02/2009 15:03

But there is the whole ridiculous "cool" thing around the taking of drugs which is the underlying agenda. It's nothing to do with relative safety really - that's just a "clever" argument which people are delighted to have found they can get away with.

I'm not a big fan of cars, either, but there is an argument for their serving multiple purposes if used safely. I don't think we can compare drugs with road safety. Road safety is a far more complex issue.

rolandbrowning · 07/02/2009 15:06

Correct me if I'm wrong, but several people who have died when using ecstasy have actually died from water poisoning, drinking too much water. Perhaps if they had been aware of how to use the drug safely they wouldn't have died? But you are right, the only way to eliminate risk is not to do anything.

christiana · 07/02/2009 15:09

Message withdrawn

HeadFairy · 07/02/2009 15:09

There is a documented risk for depression associated with taking ecstasy. The problem is it causes a massive surge in seratonin levels (the happy hormone if you like) however this skews the body's receptors to seratonin so when you aren't taking ecstasy, your body fails to recognise normal levels of seratonin. This can lead to terrible depression. more details here

Original poster
tumtumtetum · 07/02/2009 15:11

UQD people don't take drugs because it's "cool", they take drugs because they enjoy the effect. People seem to forget that - people take drugs for the same reason that they drink or smoke or take any other mood altering substance - it's enjoyable. Of course some drugs are very addictive eg alcohol, toobacco and that's where it can start to go wrong. Ecstacy isn't physically addictive.

Let's not get onto cars because that's a whole massive rant I could have...

I think the water poisoning thing does happen roland. It was worsened when people started using alcohol with ecstacy... Maybe there is a case for telling people how to use drugs more safely.

OP posts:
HeadFairy · 07/02/2009 15:11

For the reasons I've stated below I consider Ecstasy to be a dangerous drug... people aren't aware of the consequences and the effect long term depression can have on their lives.

HeadFairy · 07/02/2009 15:12

You only have to take Ecstasy once to fuck up your seratonin receptors, there is no safe dose.

christiana · 07/02/2009 15:15

Message withdrawn

Original poster
tumtumtetum · 07/02/2009 15:17

headfairy I thought there was no proven link that ecstacy use leads to depression apart from the very short term "come down" experienced by some people which might be compared to a hangover.

The link you attached to says in it's conclusion "Although we know that ecstasy use depletes the brain's serotonin levels in the short term, as yet there is no conclusive evidence proving that ecstasy causes depression in the long term"

it also says that people with a family history of depression may be more likely to use ecstacy (as they are more likely to use otehr mood altering drugs) and it's hard to say whether it's actually the drugs that cause the depression or whether the individual would have ended up depressed whatever.

OP posts:
HeadFairy · 07/02/2009 15:18

The difference is Christiana that one drink won't leave you with crippling depression whereas for some people one E can cause all sorts of problems that they can't fix. You can't go and "reset" your seratonin receptors, they're fucked for life.

Original poster
tumtumtetum · 07/02/2009 15:19

Plus there is the risk element again - Ecstacy may cause depression (possibly) it may cause death, but we know that there things are pretty unlikely, and for definite less likely than if you are hitting the booze for eg.

OP posts:
HeadFairy · 07/02/2009 15:19

ok so the research shows that those affected by E's had a risk factor, but it's a risk factor that they might have managed if they hadn't taken E

HeadFairy · 07/02/2009 15:22

The thing that worries me is that you don't know if you carry the gene that makes you more succeptible to the depressive effects of E.

christiana · 07/02/2009 15:23

Message withdrawn

Ronaldinhio · 07/02/2009 15:23

No one is saying that the use of e is without consequence at all headfairy. But it is more useful to be aware of the actual level of harm and danger associated with the drug and educate accordingly, non?

Original poster
tumtumtetum · 07/02/2009 15:24

What are the statistics for people getting their seratonin receptors "fucked"? And how do we know that their seratonin receptors were "normal" in the first place? It could be that due to chemical imbalances that one drink would have led them to a lifetime of alcohol addiction and the depression, loss of relationships and general ruination that that can entail.

headfairy you obviously feel strongly about this, and I am sorry if you know someone that has had a bad time.

But you have to understand that half a million people take this drug every weekend - which is a massive number - and the vast majority of them suffer no ill effects which is not what you can say for alcohol.

OP posts: