Charlie Gard 17 re started

[muckypup73]

Ok guys, we have been very lucky to discuss this, please lets not give anyone anything to complain about, Mhq have been more than accomodating.

I was the one who originally said that I felt fairly certain that the pistonheads bloke was
a) clearly not a clinician
b) mansplaining
I stand by that

Didn't see this until just now, apologies if it's already been shared:
vincent mcaviney, LBC reporter tweets -
Connie Yates has just shouted to GOSH barrister Katie Gollop "let us get what we want for once" on way out.

I wonder if at some point in the future (I hesitate to say when all this is over, as I don't believe it will be all over any time soon) someone somewhere will sit down and try and work out why and how the relationship between the parents and the hospital disintegrated to such an extent that staff at GOSH, a world renowned children's hospital are believed to be liars and conspirators, and are viewed with such mistrust and hostility that the parents would rather entrust their child's final hours to complete strangers.

Where did it all start? What went so badly wrong? Surely there has to be more to it than one tactless email between consultants? Could anything have been done to halt the discord in its tracks? And can anything be done to try and ensure this never happens again?

Apart from the enormous financial cost in litigation that the NHS can ill afford, it troubles me deeply that despite legislation which deems the well being of the child is paramount, at the heart of this case the well being of a desperately sick little boy has been severely compromised for more than six months.

constance whatdoes money havtodo with it you know hes been treated by the nhs?

Constance, do you seriously believe that, from the moment Charlie was taken to hospital, no-one offered a "problem solving approach" or tried to look for new solutions? The evidence is that the hospital contacted experts all over the world to seek second opinions and find out what was out there that might help. Indeed, they started the process of applying for permission to use the treatment the parents want, but he then had a long series of seizures and became so brain-damaged that the treatment could not help him.

Im happy to post the court tweets later on, unless someone else is free to do them?

Bore, you never said they were wrong did you? Just that they sounded like someone who wasn't a specialist clinician in the area, as you say here.

Could probably go back and find the quote but can't be arsed!!

Just wandered along Fleet St to get my lunch and happily aside from a couple of rather soggy looking journos there is a not a single balloon nor activist. Too busy trying to co-opt A level biology students in to help no doubt.

Ah go on then...

Bore 18/07
"I looked at Pistonheads bloke comments a few days ago. He's certainly no clinician. Enjoys mansplaining though"

GOSH tried to find Charlie another hospital many months ago. Even then it was impossible. No hospital could or would have him. There is one hospice available now. It is not possible to have unlimited choice. The parents clearly have not been willing to engage with mediation. It takes two sides to mediate and they are therefore going down the adversarial route as there isn't another one when parents and hospital disagree.

Who is the police escort for

Just reflecting on a different aspect of this case....some posters in the earlier threads hadn't some discussions around this as well.

We have always been clear in our family about letting go if ever in such a situation and 'no heroic measures'. We don't believe in life at any cost as quality of life is a lot more important.

But today I suddenly imagined me or my dh in Charlie's situation and the whole world discussing and arguing about whether I should live or not; which of my organs were failing or not; whether I was in pain or not! It filled me with such dread! Where is the dignity to my life in such a scenario? I was glad to know dh felt the same and we would never do this to each other or our children.

But here Charlie didn't really have a choice did he? Whatever the reason for parents to go public right till the end, did Charlie ever have a choice to a private life and a dignified end? GOSH and courts by law are provided to think of this and I'm very grateful for these laws and establishments that adhere to this law in our country.

Intresting and succinct article on Sky today

It was sashkin who was a tad more critical on 11/07...

"The pistonheads posts are just word salad. They make grammatical sense but are medically completely meaningless. He is quite wrong about oedema being "a sign of protein being released in liver failure" (the hypoalbuminuria in liver failure is due to impaired synthetic function rather than increased protein loss, however most oedema in liver failure is due to salt retention) and also wrong about diuretics and renal failure (you might need to use higher doses, but diuretics still work right up until the kidneys pack up completely). The ATP section I just have no idea what's he is trying to say at all."

"Honestly the guy sounds like he's just read a few Wikipedia articles. I don't think he has any specific medical background - he's getting quite basic undergrad stuff wrong. This case has had quite enough randoms claiming to be metabolic medicine experts already, let's not encourage any more."

😬

to transfr charlie chester

I dont know if this is unsupportive to parents - in which case MNHQ please delete - but I do hope that this afternoon Francis J puts an end to it all. That he refuses the hospice move and sets a very short deadline for Charlie's vent to be removed. This poor baby - who GOSH believes can feel pain - needs to stop being a pawn in the game. C&C need to accept. GOSH staff need to stop being pulled around like this. It is enough (well, it's too much actually).

All these doctors they're tweeting, do CA think they won't have heard of him?

The thing with it is that doctors and nurses they contact cannot really engage with them on social media and explain to them why they can't/won't/wouldn't. They'll just need to simply not reply

That's been the thing all along, it's all been played out on social media, and GOSH and it's staff quite rightly haven't engaged much on SM, and people don't seem to have the sense to realise that they're only hearing one un-challened point of view shouting loudly while the other side cannot (and should not) reply!

@SadGuru
"Whatever the reason for parents to go public right till the end, did Charlie ever have a choice to a private life and a dignified end? GOSH and courts by law are provided to think of this and I'm very grateful for these laws and establishments that adhere to this law in our country."

Yes exactly.

Maryz !

fgs mary thats ridiculous medical students?

@sadguru good post

Oh heavens Maryz - they just don't get it at all do they?