Charlie Gard 13

[muckypup73]

This is a thread following the legal and ethical questions raised by the recent court case involving Charlie Gard.

Please could we refrain from insulting or otherwise "bashing" his parents. It isn't in the spirit of Mumsnet and will get the threads removed.

Please could we also remember that at the heart of this case is a terminally ill baby and his heartbroken parents. There are those participating in and watching this thread for whom these issues are painful. Please let's try and be mindful of them when we post. This isn't a place for name calling or trivialising the very real pain they feel. Many parents of severely disabled children are on here.

Lastly, here are some hopefully useful reference points of facts surrounding the case.

13 July GOSH position statement on latest hearing (includes update on Charlie's condition):
www.gosh.nhs.uk/file/23611/download?token=aTPZchww

7 July GOSH statement on Charlie:
www.gosh.nhs.uk/news/latest-press-releases/latest-statement-charlie-gard

June 2017 Supreme Court decision:
www.youtube.com/watch?v=P6rPmvGlNhA&app=desktop

May 2017 Court of Appeal Decision:
www.bailii.org/ew/cases/EWCA/Civ/2017/410.html

April 2017 High Court Decision:
www.bailii.org/ew/cases/EWHC/Fam/2017/972.html

GOSH FAQ page on Charlie:
www.gosh.nhs.uk/frequently-asked-questions-about-charlie-gard-court-case

night sos

fluffy thats trrible what an awful existence an thats just what it is existing

i assume theres no way to hlp this poor kid either way

Can parents sue GOSH now though as they have already gone through court & court backed GOSH ?

They can try. You can always attempt legal action. Doesn't mean it'll work.

a civil case is more likely

th tide is now turning mor commnts supporting gosh now

www.facebook.com/thesun/posts/2074847485875013

Not sure you'd get very far with litigation though. It's pretty hard to claim that the hospital should have been swifter to administer experimental therapy that hadn't had ethics approval, hadn't ever been attempted before on another patient with the same condition and that hadn't even yet gone through animal studies on mice with the same condition.

Fluffy your post has made me so terribly sad.

That's not any sort of life and I don't care what people think of me for that.

The wee lad was born with a condition that is incompatible with a functioning life, his parents cannot understand that the issue is with their mix of genes, any other child they have together will have same condition, nothing is going to change that. They will need to use the three parent treatment to conceive a healthy child. It is very sad and blaming GOSH for his condition is ridiculous, but we all know that on here, but CA will never see that.

GabsAlot that's interesting as the telegraph is still showing anti gosh comments as the majority on fb.

Does anyone know what the following conversation was referring to? On the Sun FB page:

They have thanked gosh for there hard work

No they didnt , it was a way of releasing names without breaking the court order . i seen that post and it clearly wasnt them thanking gosh at all funnily enough it was removed when legal action was threatened

Well said Ashleigh, they did a news statement live, soon after they took to twitter and slated GOSH again! Like Ashleigh has said it's all been deleted!

intrsting falln

prob about thir speech thanking dr hirano i dont recall the gosh part so dont know if this is true or not

Yes this is what I wondered Gabs, I thought maybe they posted something online after that statement thanking the GOSH staff by name but it got deleted because it was encouraging CA to harass those people?

You know what makes me sad the most?

The fact that there is a really high chance of the Judge ruling in favour of GOSH on Tuesday and by Weds his life support could be withdrawn.

And his parents will have spent the best part of his last month here either in Court, on TV or talking to newspapers/radio. And not being with their child. I truly think they will regret this, they will regret making this so public and not having that quiet time as a family together.

My friends son died last year, he was in a hospice, they had a family room and he died with his mum, dad and sibling with him. Just them. They spent his last days just lying with him, talking to him, singing to him and just breathing him in.

Charlie's parents will have spent his last days fighting in Court and will have ruled out any chance of a quiet farewell with the fucking circus that has descended on GOSH.

It's probably the saddest story I've ever read.

I take it the members of CA are still not taking on board that the treatment had to clear a number of steps before it could be used?

Also there seem to still be a lot of what I assume are US posters who do not understand that our laws are different and that children have rights, parents have responsibilities?

Some idiot on there is sharing something from the kippers website though, they seem so gullible that they don't seem to be able to understand why the kippers are all over this story.

Great post mycat think what they'"re doing now will haunt them in the future long after Charlie has passed away.

Maryz it does sound like it, but sounds like it got deleted just as quick so very few people would have seen it.

Mycats it's so tragic about your friend's son, but how beautiful that he was at peace at the end and surrounded by his family

Yes I agree, it's upsetting the way this whole sad story has played out. It's heartbreaking all round, C&C must be feeling so broken.

I agree mycatsapirate, but I also think it's sad that Charlie has not been moved to a hospice which is one of the options mooted by c & c. I totally get why home isn't an option and that moving him will be a massive undertaking. But if it is at all possible I think it would be the best thing - it's what hospices do on a daily basis, they get people with terminal illnesses moved into their care from all settings.

There is no trust between c & c and GOSH, he will not die peacefully there in his parents' eyes and they will always remember he died somewhere they hated. A hospice could be a middle ground between home and GOSH and give Charlie the best death possible. It sounds harsh but I do believe it could be possible.

I wonder what the judge will say about them using twitter to slate GOSH again, if indeed that is what has happened.

I know, it doesn't look good does it, they seem like they literally are about to explode with anger and can't hold it in, but the judge won't like this - then again he's been very lenient with them so far with the storming out and shouting in court so who knows.

They and CA don't think in any way that they're in the wrong here though, they 100% believe that GOSH are hiding a load of information and are out to get them :(

I've just been re-reading the GOSH position statement of 13th July. It's clear that there are a load of alternative facts being floated about since today's hearing, so I wanted to revisit it. This stands out -

Ellie56. The appeal was allowed because the parents wanted to take Charlie for treatment in the USA. This was a different issue to GOSH asking to move to palliative care. It is difficult to see now why an appeal would be allowed if they are not happy with the judgement next week. Not liking a decision is not grounds for appeal.

Maryz he did say he hadn't seen evidence of that, but then said something else which I can't find. He might have said dysfunction...