Grenfell Tower tragedy continued

[RhythmAndStealth]

Twelve people confirmed dead with that number expected to rise significantly.

Many others injured and distressed. People have lost relatives, friends and their homes.

250 firefighters in attendance, risking their lives in an unprecented fire and it's aftermath. Other emergency services and NHS staff working hard to help survivors.

Many questions to be answered.

to all those affected and everyone helping.

Morris my tenants dismantled the door closers and put socks over the smoke detectors so that they could smoke indoors .

List of some of the housing chiefs salaries here. Sorry for DM link.

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3039053/Housing-fat-cats-hypocrisy-Furious-backlash-PM-s-right-buy-revolution-housing-chiefs-lavish-homes-six-figure-salaries.html

Helena I agree, and the 'othering' and dismissal of people with terms like "vexatious" is part of the problem.

Agree with Helena

My landlord is Waltham Forest council.
I called in relation to repairs but out of concern mentioned fire safety and the fact that I only have one fire alarm in the flat, no fire blanket, no fire extinguisher and don't have a clue whether there is a centralised alarm system in the block.
It appears they must be getting a heck of a lot of calls as she said they were transferring all such calls for us to be called back by the council.

Helicopter rescue is extremely dangerous even in optimal conditions. Given the fact it was at night in a built up area and the building was on fire would make it impossible. The slightest gust of wind and it could have been an even bigger disaster.

but who manufactured and passed the materials through all the regulation we have in place?

Independent organisations test to the standards required by law. Often this in terms of British Standards where the testing procedures are very clearly laid out. British Standards are written and agreed by experts, then recommended to the government so they can be included in regulatory guidance. If the testers failed to carry out the testing properly they are (IMO) criminally negligent. If the standards are wrong this will need to be addressed but could take years.

There are absolutely loads of standards, btw. From big things like cladding and fire walls to small things like interior paint. You can view a video of a cladding fire test here:

Finally, a 1hr compartment won't keep you safe for exactly an hour. It will provide safety for at least one hour under standard test conditions. In a smaller fire it will hold up much longer, and in a bigger fire it won't last the full hour.

Thanks for clarifying the helicopter thing. I guessed there would be reasons but wasn't exactly sure what there were.

Sadly, and such is life, this awful tragedy will move from the top of discussion fora, the media, TV and so on within a day or so.

I know that is reality, people have to move on, but out of this tragedy I hopefully think things will change WRT social accommodations and their safety for all those living in them.

What a terrible thing this was.

There is actually a phrase that HAs use when they feel a tenant is complaining too much. They call them "vexatious" complaints or refer to them as "vexatious" tenants. Id bet a penny to a pinch of shit that the residents of Grenfell Tower were referred to as this

YY.

"We have to act as if it was our friends, our family in that block. We have to have that emotional connection to what is going on because there is no room for cool, detached, plodding bureaucracy." Nick Hurd

Zac Goldsmith- immediate advice for tenants, in days not weeks
Harriet Harmon- proper representation including Legal Aid for residents during Public Inquiry
David Lammy- use corporate manslaughter legislation
Jeremy Corbyn- more questions on this once Parliament sits properly so all MPs can be involved

I like Corbyn and im a Labour voter but where they went wrong with trying to help pass a law/promise to make landlords more responsible for providing homes fit for habitation is they were only focusing on PRIVATE landlords not social landlords. This is the problem I have asked on webchats and on Twitter why social housing isnt included when all parties wax lyrical about landlords.
I was ignored.
There is definately a pattern here.

Met Police saying some bodies might never be Identified and it could take weeks or even months to get a final death toll.

I can't even turn on the tv today, it's literally making me feel sick. Things like this don't usually affect me but I keep thinking about all those poor babies and sobbing, how could this happen?

Only 6 of the 17 bodies found so far have been identified.
And perhaps more worrying a criminal investigation has been launched but that could hopefully only be a standard procedure rather than evidence of Arson or even terrorism.

I can't even turn on the tv today, it's literally making me feel sick. Things like this don't usually affect me but I keep thinking about all those poor babies and sobbing, how could this happen

I am also really troubled by this today. I was talking to a colleague about it at work. I feel more upset about this than the recent terror attacks because the terror attacks occurred quite 'quickly' if that makes sense?
The thought of those poor families at the windows, the children crying and the parents knowing that there was nothing that they could do to save them is just horrendous.

im not trying to take away the trauma of the terror attacks btw

Fuck, police saying they may not be able to identify everybody. God help the relatives.

Fuck, police saying they may not be able to identify everybody. God help the relatives

Very sadly, that was always going to be the case.

Rhythm I completely agree. People have died in the most horrible way imaginable and those at fault need to be held to account. The Hillsborough families were repeatedly told to move on. Thank God they didn't.

The council is a direct landlord where I live. They are NOT required to follow the same stringent safety measures a private ll must put in place. For example, they told me they were not required to put my smoke alarm up. ( the fire serice did it on my request).
It's insane.

user the fire dept are doing a "fingertip" search - think about what that means.

MrsPeely - when I saw the blaze and the ferocity of it I knew but didn't want to say it. Hearing police say it is somehow worse.

docs.google.com/document/d/1-0WjtDybp_bNLUzLHW6oBt2RGlZ2Yc-IJ_8EFAW13FQ/edit

In case it's not been posted here yet, above is a link on a LIVE Google doc detailing "how to help"

It's almost the perfect fucking crime. There will be fuck all evidence left of this shambles.