Grenfell Tower tragedy continued

[RhythmAndStealth]

Twelve people confirmed dead with that number expected to rise significantly.

Many others injured and distressed. People have lost relatives, friends and their homes.

250 firefighters in attendance, risking their lives in an unprecented fire and it's aftermath. Other emergency services and NHS staff working hard to help survivors.

Many questions to be answered.

to all those affected and everyone helping.

My grandfather had one of those weird storage heater systems in his tower block

Helena but it is the police/fire brigade who announce the number of deaths, not the council or HA. By saying they hope deaths don't go into 3 figures hints that they think they possibly could. They simply cannot get in to search at the moment. It's a huge mess, roof is down, debris everywhere, not safe to go near the edges of the floors due to risk of collapse etc.

Grenfell Tower fire- thread three

New thread as this one is close to filling up.

to all affected and all those helping the victims.

I think it should be taken down and replaced with a fitting memorial for all those people who very sadly did not make it x

TinselTwins I tried to post about this yesterday, they do not want donations of 'stuff', it's causing problems as it needs sorting out and much of it is not useful to them at the moment.

Tinsel, more information here
I think at this point it's either money so it can be used correctly, or hold on to the items you would donate because they may well be needed later
thekandcfoundation.com/

Slimthistime

I know that, it's common sense really but lots of local people still collecting for runs up tomorrow and saturday

"stuff" was needed on the night… but now needs will have changed. It's almost as if people want to get in there retrospectively and be one of the street helpers

barry i know but many social housing tenants have lost trust in the authorities.

We couldnt get the police to attend an attempted burglary or an escaped snake at our estate.

But the posher estate had both these incidents and they had no trouble attending . Some of the "othering" attitudes towards social housing tenants have come from certain authorities. You cant treat one whole section of society with less respect than others and then expect them to trust you. It doesnt work like that. It breaks down community relations in the same way as it did with the police and people of colour back in the "80s.

Helena I agree with you - sorry didn't state in my earlier post that I am disgusted at how the tenants in Grenfell and indeed other places have been treated, and completely understand how many don't trust 'authority'.

Nevertheless, I don't see any evidence of minimising going on - quite the opposite, the fire brigade, who are being hailed as heroes by the local community, have made several statements which show they believe that there will be many, many more bodies found, when they eventually can search safely, some of which may be unidentifiable- hardly minimising. They've said it could take weeks.

Please urge people NOT to converge on the area with vans of stuff - apart from anything else, with traffic cordons in place, they need congestion kept to the minimum: the emergency services are still at work

Article in the Guardian by a firefighter on the threat posed by cuts

If you're local and have time I expect they would appreciate pairs of hands to sort all of the stuff, though the point about traffic stands.

barry i dont think its minimising but i can see why many would think it is because the trust has been lost and its going to be a mammoth task to build it back up again.

Link to site providing information on where help is needed

i think our fire service is amazing. What they did and the hours they put in. They must be exhausted both mentally and physically.

User, so far every surviving resident who has spoken to the media has said that the redevelopment money was used only to make the outside of the flats look more pleasant for rich neighbours. They all say that there were glaring safety issues for years and they were either ignored or threatened with legal action when they tried to complain. In addition every single Tory voted against regulations to ensure that accommodations are suitable for human habitation AND when residents tried to take legal action (out of fear for their lives) they couldn't because (take a guess) yep, the Tories cut legal aid too and they couldn't afford it. Don't try to say this isn't political/about poverty. Try listening to the actual residents. They've been speaking out for years.

Cornwallwannabee it should be taken down and replaced with safe and decent accommodations for those who survived, in memory of those who didnt. A memorial won't help the families who would be displaced if nothing replaces the loss of these flats.

Yes lets hope it's knocked down and some more human low rise accommodation replaces it all.

I mean would anyone what to live in those flats after what happened there?

buggered if i would !

helena We have told other HAs how we do things and they respond by telling us they can't afford it.

We have 300+ buildings which are up to 16 unit buildings. We have a team of tradespeople who manage the maintenance. It's also about using common sense. I'd never spend money on cladding when basics are not taken care of. Also, overcrowding is a huge problem now. Those in the 18-25 range are basically homeless so sleep on their parents sofa.

We also look to make sure that the community is taken care of. The playground isn't ours but is used by our tenants. We therefore donated the materials to the council to upgrade it. The lazy fuckers at the council came back and said they needed £150k for labour costs as not in their budget. We ended up taking back the project and completed it over the mid week for £60k including materials.

I was shocked that any party can vote against a proposal that rented homes must be fit for human habitation.

But it's true.

www.theguardian.com/society/2016/jan/12/tories-reject-move-to-ensure-rented-homes-fit-for-human-habitation

But piglet that's the whole Tory ideology, the invisible hand. The market inevitably brings social change without government intervention.

It clearly doesn't work but that is what they think.

yes, Piglet, when I questioned my MP about his vote I was told existing laws were sufficient.

I'm sorry to say I grew up with my dad telling us that privatisation was important because the public sector were all useless. It wasn't till I reached working age that I managed to get some reality into his head. I don't why anyone thinks markets magically correct things.