Labour and anti-semitism

[LeLaluifleur]

Apologies for DF links but ignoring the lowbrow style 'journalism' for a minute, I am perturbed about these reports.

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3531852/Labour-councillor-20-suspended-claims-called-Hitler-greatest-man-history-latest-anti-Semitic-scandal-hit-Corbyn-s-party.html#comments

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3532042/Ignorant-Godless-Hateful-Corbyn-s-contempt-Jews-disgrace-withering-attack-Labour-leader-donor-backed-party-400-000-2015-Election.html

I like Corbyn a little bit but judge his cavalier attitude to anti-semitism harshly.

Has anti-semitism become cool among labour supporters or something? What is being done about the anti-semitism coming from some labour politicians and how to deal with the Islamist flavour of anti-semitism as displayed by Labour councillor Aysegul Gurbuz (and others) for examples who posted statements such as this on twitter :

"Ed Miliband is Jewish. He will never become prime minister of Britain."
"Adolf Hitler was praised as the ‘greatest man in history".

My son is off to America. Rather than be upset at being so far away from him I am glad he is getting out of Europe. Myself and my husband and daughter are looking to make Aliya possibly in the next few years. I do not see a long term future got Jews her. I won't wait around until it is too late to leave.

Lookingagain my dh said similar about NUS, but these are the students and ideas that go to form the next generation of leaders.

I agree they are not speaking for the majority of mainstream students hence I think I will call them "so called NUS."

"I think I will call them "so called NUS."

How about NUSIS? Or Nuesh?

MyBeloved that's so sad. I wonder about DS too. At the moment he's obviously incredibly innocent to this stuff right now but for how long?

If you're interested I'd suggest a wiki search for Ilan Halimi, a French Jew who was murdered in 2006. I hope this is not where we're heading.

If the NUS feel strongly about remaining in the EU they have just killed their campaign by electing Malia.

Marmite, I'm unfortunately all too aware of the everyday antisemitism that seems to get brushed under the carpet both here in the uk and in the rest of Europe. It is almost standard for people to roll their eyes and look the other way. AntI israel sentiment has enabled anti semitism to come roaring boldly to the foreground - and it has been met with very little opposition.

My goodness, even some Jewish musicians are made to renounce israel publicly before being allowed to play European festivals (see last year's Spanish Sunsplash Festival featuring the American Jewish reggae artist Matisyahu who was hounded by the BDS movement).

If Jews are to feel safe then this must STOP. Politicians must actually ACT. Not just say things. Goodness. ...have we learned nothing from history???

"My goodness, even some Jewish musicians are made to renounce israel publicly before being allowed to play European festivals (see last year's Spanish Sunsplash Festival featuring the American Jewish reggae artist Matisyahu who was hounded by the BDS movement)."

Really? imagine the outrage if Muslim artists or professionals were required to declare they don't support ISIS before a gig / job

Saying that, it is not entirely appropriate to compare ISIS and the state of Israel in such a way, i just meant to highlight the double standards applied to Jewish and Muslim populations.

Indeed andeladems. And even when at the very last minute and under great pressure from Jewish groups worldwide, sunsplash allowed matisyahu to play his set, the BDS spent the whole time waving their flags and chanting at him. Remember, this guy is a musician. An American musician. Who happens to be Jewish.

MyBeloved thanks, I read about that incident, very disturbing. In France things are very bad as summed up in this article:
www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/france/11335980/Antisemitism-in-France-the-exodus-has-begun.html

here is another very good article about the troubling situation for Jewish people in France.

OMFG. I thought I knew a lot about the Jews' plight in France but this is a whole new level. Blood chilling. Thanks so much.

Yes, things have been escalating in France for some time. French people make up the highest proportion of those making Aliya (Jewish people emigrating to israel).

WeMust thanks for posting that. I hadn't seen it and it's an interesting and powerful piece.

I lived in France in the 80s/early 90s, so particularly interesting to hear the former teacher's views.

It's shocking isn't it? Yet not many people seem to care from what I can see.

Armed soldiers standing guard outside pre schools ffs. In Europe in 2016. It's scary and very sad for those children having to grow up with that level of threat.

It's shocking isn't it? Yet not many people seem to care from what I can see.

Isn't it? Whenever I raise these issues with friends generally two things happen: a) a bit of embarrassed shuffling and mumbling about 'perspective' b) subject turns to Israel.

Does anybody remember the controversy about the BBC reporter after the Paris kosher supermarket massacre who said something like 'but Palestinians suffer terribly at the hands of Jews'?

Yes marmite, I remember that interview on the BBC. Sadly, nothing surprises me anymore. Isn't that awful?

Can totally relate to the subject changing from anti semitism to israel. One of my friends from times past, who was very left leaning, exploded with rage at how one cannot have a decent discussion with a Jew about israel without 'them' crying anti semitism! We were discussing anti semitism by the way - nothing to do with israel. A swastika had been carved into the wall of our local synagogue. The irony was, as I pointed out to him, that in times past he had marched with the Anti Nazi League. Now what? Our left are the new right. Or are they the same?

Does anybody remember the controversy about the BBC reporter after the Paris kosher supermarket massacre who said something like 'but Palestinians suffer terribly at the hands of Jews'?

I hadn't heard about that. Just looked it up. How insensitive of him and really shows the bias of the BBC. Why "Jews" and not "Israel"? He apologised though so that makes it all ok

I remember that - it wasn't just insensitive - it was outright racism AND a justification of terrorism.

Don't be in any doubt, the subtext was clear: You Jews deserve to die.

Now, if any reporter went to the site of the migrant ship disaster today and said, "but Syrians suffer at the hands of other Syrians so..."
Or at Lee Rigby's death: 'but Iraqis suffer terribly at the hands of the British' or at the Russian airliner shot down, 'but Ukrainians suffer terribly at the hands of Russians', they would have been denounced as racist, victim blaming and maybe have lost their job. But see, the Jews are different. Or rather: We are all the same.

You can see it on Facebook - my friends were all about Charlie Hebdo (as we all should be of course - not knocking that - but the murders in the Jewish supermarket? - hmm, that's awkward - because being in a Jewish supermarket - well, that really was asking for trouble.)

hmm, that's awkward - because being in a Jewish supermarket - well, that really was asking for trouble.)

Yep I noticed that too. Another example was the murder of 4 people at a Jewish school in Toulouse in 2012. The initial media reaction (okay the reaction in the Guardian) was this must be the work of the far right. There was an infamous article which I'll try to dig up. Turned out to be an Islamist. Then, when the assassin was killed a prominent Guardian journalist tweeted 'Police 1. Justice 0'. Because like, ya know, his rights were important than the eight year old girl he shot in the head.

I'd really urge a reading of the story of Ilan Halimi. He was a young Jewish man captured by a Muslim gang and tortured for several days. His murder prompted much soul searching about antisemitism in France.

I do hope this stuff is not coming our way but I fear it is given the levels of complacency at all social levels.

hurryupharry.org/2009/07/13/seeking-justice-for-ilan-halimi/

hurryupharry.org/2012/03/29/airbrushing-anti-semitism-out-of-the-toulouse-attack/

Why it is more acceptable to be anti Semitic publicly whereas if the same was said about someone from Pakistan for example then all hell would break loose.

I have definitely noticed this in workplaces e.g. When Jewish people were off for their new year in September I heard some criticism but then there was a day where another religion needed to be off and I don't remember the same reaction.

Maybe Jewish people need to kick up more of a fuss Woodhill.

Maybe people could stop being racist - there's a thought!

I don't know how great a threat we are facing in the uk. I like to think the vast majority of people aren't racist- but then I come onto mumsnet...

I get letters from lib dem party (I once expressed an interest!) they wanted to know my thoughts on a very important policy/platform blah blah- it was about - not migrant crisis/not brexit/ not interest rates/not housing/not Nhs/not educatin but about legalising cannabis- it was then that I knew the libs were misguided irrelevant fuckers.
And that's what I think ordinary people think when they see the er passionate 'anti-zionists.' They think- umm- there's now 3 million dead in Syria, there's thousands dead in Ukraine, women's rights are non existant in some parts of the world, the yazhidis have been massacred, the Kurds have been massacred, the Christians have been massacred- and you, all you want to do is protest against Israelis right to exist?

And I think most people can see that perculiar obsession among certain groups exactly for what it is.

I do agree with what you are saying Helmet.

And I think most people can see that perculiar obsession among certain groups exactly for what it is.

I am not sure everyone does. I wonder if it needs to be "called out," more forcefully, the way other forms of prejudice routinely are.

100 per cent Helmet. The other double standard is that Jews appear to be the only group who don't get to define the prejudice they're facing. Is there another group, certainly according to current standards, who are told 'no, you're definitely not experiencing antisemitism, you're just being over sensitive'? I've had the yazidis argument over and over again and the appalling western silence over their plight. At DS's school in 2014 they (quite rightly) were collecting for Gaza. But where was the sympathy for the yazidis? It's hard not to conclude it's because they didn't fit into one of the designated 'oppressed minority' slots.