UK woman convicted of abortion

[Veterinari]

Full story here www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/crime/woman-given-suspended-sentence-for-having-abortion-in-the-uk-a6968676.html

Very sad. Is there a will in NI to update legislation on this issue? As it stands everyone loses

for veryproud and others.

No woman or girl, I mean NO woman or girl, should have to go through an unwanted or non-viable pregnancy, if she doesn't want to.

For too long the women and girls of my country have been treated like second class citizens, poor simpletons who don't know what's best for them and should just let the religious political force in this country speak for them.

I've said my peace in this matter on another thread (about Christian privilege) a few weeks ago so I won't get myself angry again, but I will say that I feel sympathy and solidarity for the women and girls who have to go through this situation, and disgust at those who condemn them.

veryproud Un-Mumsnetty hugs to you, my friend.

My word Augusta, you are aptly named.

Should that right have been taken from her if a medic said that the baby would live but would die within an hour of birth?

No, she's shouldn't have had that option removed in those circumstances.

Leaving aside the condition affecting Very's child, as I think you're using it because the arguments work so much better for it than for Down's...

Really, your conversation is so affected and convoluted that I'm out. Earlier in the thread, 'I think Very suggested something should be shoved up my arse, but she seems to have got the wrong arse if your most recent post is anything to go by Augusta. I had points to make but I don't feel you're interested in really engaging, you sound very stuck-up, and the sun's shining. I know that when anyone quits the discussion, the response is not to assume they have a life off a screen but have suddenly been overcome by the force of arguments on the other side...so do make sure you enjoy that questionable victory.

For someone who has been banging on about how rude other posters are, your posts are quite breathtakingly unpleasant, gone.

I think Augusta, Very, FedUp, Suburban, tbh the vast majority of posters here sound great - well reasoned, articulate and compassionate. The kind of people I'd be happy to get a coffee with.

statement of gone's is particularly bizarre

Your last sentence of the post referred to above gone made no sense, thats why a number of posters queried it

Make mine a skinny latte, jacob

Sorry about your comprehension problems, gone. Or maybe we can all see that the truth is that your comprehension is fine, but you are aware that you can't make your arguments stand up, hence the somewhat childish resort to ad hominem attack.

Leaving aside the condition affecting Very's child, as I think you're using it because the arguments work so much better for it than for Down's...

The arguments are the same, the criteria are the same. So glad, gone, that you acknowledge their justification.

Augusta
You seem to be confusing weeks pregnant with gestational age.

In terms of whether the foetus' sex could be determined by a layman looking at products of conception, vintage, that doesn't make a practical difference.

You are wrong on that point.
In summary, there have been people on this thread who have genuinely entered into civilized debate and comment on the topic and there have been many others who have just heaped foul-mouthed obscenities on the two female flat mates.
Some people have particular hobbie-horses and will use any methods to try and further them. I have just looked at Briiiik's contribution to her mentioned thread on Christian Privilege and, unsurprisingly, it just consisted of a lot of "fuck this and fuck that's".
People who want to bring unfettered abortion into N. Ireland feel they are somehow "sticking it to the man" and bringing this great freedom to women - I disagree. Going into details such as rape, physical deformity, acceptable foetal ages for abortion etc. are really a red herring - because , let's face it, this particular group will never stop until abortion is considered as nonchalantly as having a dental check-up and everyone's grandchildren will engage in it unthinkingly. It seems like the time will come when anyone who chooses to have a child with a physical, intellectual or genetic impairment will be looked upon as "odd".
I really fear for the future and the new societal norms and pressures which will pertain.

How terrifying that women one day could have full control over there own bodies.

Oswin
Neither men, women nor children will ever have full control over their bodies or minds. That is an illusion.

People who want to bring unfettered abortion into N. Ireland feel they are somehow "sticking it to the man" and bringing this great freedom to women
Or maybe they'd like to be able to access a medical service, that they as NHS taxpayers contribute to? Or maybe they want to be able to be in control of their own reproduction and not have to take a ridiculously expensive trip in order to the mainland? Or take illegal drugs and face criminal charges? Or have to endure a pregnancy where the foetus has a condition that is not compatible with life, and have to travel and bring the remains home in their hand luggage to give the child a burial? Or be separated from the support network of their family and loved ones as travelling alone is the only option? Maybe they don't want to bring an unwanted child into the world? Maybe they simply made a mistake and don't deserve to be punished for it?

But yeah, it's all about "sticking it to the man".

Are you living in 1984 vintage?

vintagemum, you are ascribing views which no-one on this thread has expressed. I don't think anyone here has suggested that they want a situation where abortion will be regarded as routine or that it should be used to eliminate all impairment out of the population. That is the real red herring.

I wasn't going to bring my own experience into this thread, but the jawdropping crass statements from Vintage, and general bile from Done (and 2 glasses of wine with lunch) have pushed me over the line

This is my story, under a NC:
http://www.mumsnet.com/Talk/amibeing_unreasonable/2387676-Pro-lifers-what-would-you-do-trigger-warning]]

DH is from NI, we've spent time living there, and but for chance, we could have been living there when received the most awful news we've ever had.
The following few weeks would have panned out very differently for us, but tragically, there are women on a daily basis who don't have the choices and options we had. Women who have paid taxes to HMRC to fund the NHS. But who can't have a full NHS service.

So go fuck yourself to suggest that the only thing pro-choices aspire to is full term abortion on demand when the mood takes someone.

I don't want any woman to have no choice but to continue carrying a baby in chronic and unending pain because religious bigots delight in telling other people how to live their lives. If you don't want the same, you are a total monster.

let's face it, this particular group will never stop until abortion is considered as nonchalantly as having a dental check-up

You have catastrophically misunderstood what the pro-choice movement is about, haven't you, vintage?

Spare I remember that thread. I didn't post at the time because it felt too close to what I had been through. and all my love for all you went through and I am thankful that you didn't have a load of bureaucracy to contend with. And I hope your family were understanding in the end.

vintage HAHAHA!!! Brilliant.

I needed a laugh today.

Or should I say a fucking laugh...