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is it really possible that Donald trump could be president????? [Part 2]

999 replies

claig · 02/03/2016 09:27

From now on the race becomes winner take all. If Trump wins Florida on March 15, it is probably all over.

'The Republican Party now has 14 days to stop Trump'

www.vox.com/2016/3/2/11144812/super-tuesday-results-donald-trump-wins

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BigChocFrenzy · 12/03/2016 13:12

The new jobs created over the last few years in the UK and US are mostly low wage & low security.
Pay for many existing jobs has stagnated, conditions of work often worsened.
Trump won't change that.

Of the 3 main causes for the hollowing out of wc and mc jobs:
1 Automation
2 Globalisation
3 Immigration
Trump blazes away about #3 (the least important), has crazy suggestions about #2 and totally ignores the consequences of killer #1

Clinton's record doesn't suggest any improvement over the status quo either:
help the oligarchs loot the US and the world, help the top 10% in the US quite a bit, screw the bottom 90%, wage bloody wars abroad, wage bloody war & incarcerate African Americans at home.

claig · 12/03/2016 13:15

'It's big and resource rich, which largely explains its leadership position. Nothing much relating to their intrinsic values as a country.'

I disagree. Russia is bigger and more resource rich but it never had the freedom that America had and that is why it was never as successful. It is the underlying freedom that ensured the rule of law that gave birth to the level of enterprise and social mobility and dynamism and capitalist free market philosophy that made America great and Trump says he will "make America great again" and yesterday he said he has now added "better than ever before". They want to shut down Trump rallies to stop Trump getting the word out to the American people.

"not gonna happen".
Trump 2016!

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BigChocFrenzy · 12/03/2016 13:18

Also in the US:
Inequality and lack of social / financial mobility that is as bad as the 1920s
We are far on that road too.
1950 to mid-1970s was a rare blip of opportunity for the plebs that seems gone for ever.

claig · 12/03/2016 13:20

'Of the 3 main causes for the hollowing out of wc and mc jobs:
1 Automation
2 Globalisation
3 Immigration
Trump blazes away about #3 (the least important), has crazy suggestions about #2 and totally ignores the consequences of killer #1'

On #2, Trump says he will scrap all the trade deals and rewrite them on a one-to-one basis in America's favour. On #3, you are right that Trump has not said anything about it as far as I know, but nor has anyone else, and since Trump is all about giving people jobs, then if it becomes a big issue during his Presidency, then he will probably address it then by taxing companies that favour machines over humans.

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CoteDAzur · 12/03/2016 13:20

Do watch that link.

CoteDAzur · 12/03/2016 13:23

"Trump says he will scrap all the trade deals and rewrite them on a one-to-one basis in America's favour. "

He can't scrap all trade deals and no country is going to lie back, open their legs, and moan "Oh! Donald! Yes! Take it all!".

Lweji · 12/03/2016 13:23

But smaller countries have created better societies and economies.
Freedom is not US exclusive.

Freedom should go with freedom of choosing your university education, not what you can afford. Choosing to have children, not being trapped with unpaid leave. Not thinking that if you're black you could be shot by the police for being black.

claig · 12/03/2016 13:31

'But smaller countries have created better societies and economies. '

It's not that easy because as Ben Carson says "freedom has to be fought for and defended". The smaller countries depend on American protection to ensure their freedom in a world where differing political movements and regimes threaten to dominate and remove the freedoms of smaller countries.

That is why Obama said in the interview in the Atlantic "free loaders aggravate me". He is echoing what Trump says, which is that countries are going to have to start paying America if they want their protection.

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BigChocFrenzy · 12/03/2016 13:31

The Republican motto now seems to be "Guns, God - and Gibberish"

CoteDAzur · 12/03/2016 13:32

A photo from today's anti-Trump rally in Chicago, taken by a friend who lives there. In case you would like to see what anti-establishment revolution actually looks like.

is it really possible that Donald trump could be president????? [Part 2]
Lweji · 12/03/2016 13:36

So, the country of freedom wants to hold smaller countries to ransom?

And again that has nothing on how other countries have better societies despite the US claiming to be the land of freedom.

Still loving your random quotes, taken out of context. Did you see my earlier post?

claig · 12/03/2016 13:42

'So, the country of freedom wants to hold smaller countries to ransom?'

No, as Obama said in that interview "free loaders aggravate me". What he means is that there will be no more "free lunch" where America has to pay for the freedom of others. Everyone is going to have to contribute their fair share because America is broke.

'And again that has nothing on how other countries have better societies despite the US claiming to be the land of freedom. '

It is debatable whether they have better societies. Some things are better and some are worse, but ultimately the freedom of Latvia, for example, is ensured by NATO which is dependent on the power of America.

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Lweji · 12/03/2016 13:48

Not surprised you support Trump. Like him you can't keep a line of thought or argument straight.

I can't even be arsed to try and go back to the original points. It's like talking to a badly programmed bot.

wiltingfast · 12/03/2016 14:01

It's more spam than dialogue lweji, not sure how you've kept it up!

claig · 12/03/2016 14:03

It's not spam, I attempt to answer the points but I get insulted in return whereas I don't insult you, wiltingfast.

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Lweji · 12/03/2016 14:24

It's mostly when I'm bored.

claig · 12/03/2016 14:31

"MoveOn Takes Partial Credit for Trump Rally Cancelation"

www.mediaite.com/online/moveon-takes-partial-credit-for-trump-rally-cancelation/

"Tonight’s violence at the site of a canceled rally in Chicago will help Donald Trump in the next round of voting, Donald Trump predicted on cable news.

“Two people that are experts told me this increases the vote for Trump,” the GOP front-runner told MSNBC’s Chris Matthews on the phone, about an hour after pulling the plug on the packed rally, triggering chaos in the hall."

deadline.com/2016/03/donald-trump-rally-canceled-chicago-1201719107/

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claig · 12/03/2016 15:20

Interesting article on the Illinois and Missouri primaries which take place this Tuesday. They have been overlooked by most pundits who have focused on the last stands of Rubio in Florida and Kasich in Ohio, but Illinois and Missouri may be almost as important for Trump. I think Trump's cancellation of the Chicago rally and the media coverage of it will ensure Trump a voctory in Illinois. Trump and his team are amazing strategists.

"Don’t Sleep On Illinois And Missouri — They Could Help Make Trump Unstoppable
...
March 15 has long looked like the most pivotal date on the GOP primary calendar. And although Florida and Ohio are hogging the spotlight because they are the sites of Marco Rubio and John Kasich’s “last stands,” don’t forget that two other states could help Donald Trump become essentially unstoppable in his quest for the nomination: Illinois and Missouri."

fivethirtyeight.com/features/dont-sleep-on-illinois-and-missouri-they-could-help-make-trump-unstoppable/

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CoteDAzur · 12/03/2016 15:27

Exactly, Lweji.

Almost passes the Turing test, though. Almost.

Mistigri · 12/03/2016 16:14

You've certainly got more patience than I have Lweji.

I've defended Claig in the past for at least engaging politely, but I won't debate with someone who thinks incitement to violence is OK. I'm horrified by what happened last night, and by what it might presage if Trump wins the nomination. I don't think it's alarmist to suggest that if the rhetoric doesn't get dialled back, there are going to be deaths at republican rallies. You can't whip up a bunch of gun-toting rednecks and KKK supporters and not consider whether someone (probably a black someone) might lose their life as a result.

claig · 12/03/2016 16:18

'I won't debate with someone who thinks incitement to violence is OK'

I don't think incitement to violence is OK so do me a favour and stop saying it.

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claig · 12/03/2016 16:20

Mistigri, do you realise that Bill Ayers was at that protest last night in Chicago? Do you not realise that it is organised by far left groups?

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Lweji · 12/03/2016 16:48

An analysis by the Guardian, but then I know you'll dismiss it, claig.

claig · 12/03/2016 17:06

I disagree with that analysis.

The reality is that there are no Trump supporters or Republicans disrupting Bernie Sanders rallies. Trump said that Bernie should denounce MoveOn and the other left wing groups that are disrupting Trump rallies in an organised fashion.

Cleveland police have ordered more riot gear because they are expecting thousands and more left wing protestors to protest at the Republican Convention. No Trump supporters will be protesting at the Democrat Convention.

There is an organised campaign to disrupt Trump's rallies by far left organisations who are funded.

Jack Welch, former CEO of GE, and a Cruz supporter on the left wing movements like MoveOn trying to disrupt Trump rallies. He mentions Bill Ayers etc

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Lweji · 12/03/2016 17:12

How do you account for the violence towards people at rallies and even a journalist?

People being encouraged to turn on other people at rallies? Kicking out people who are doing nothing?
His own staff turning on journalists?

By your own account his discourse incites unrest. Are you surprised that his rallies are the only where unrest occurs?