Quick Poll: EU stay or leave?

[BlueSmarties76]

Would you vote to stay or leave the EU?

Quick poll.

''Yanis Varoufakis was on Andrew Marr on Sunday and he said that if the UK left, the EU is likely to implode and the result would create a deflationary vortex '

That is what happened to Greece and Varoufakis was unable to stop it because the bankers told him where to go. Now, instead of him challenging the bankers and escaping from their clutches by dismantling the EU, he wants to stay in and dream that he can beat the bankers when he lost to them in Greece.

Uk aren't in Euro. Good thing there wasn't austerity in UK, then?

The problem with the Euro was that there wasn't an institution like a proper central bank operating across all the states regulating everything. You can't have a proper currency union without that.

I don't think simply not being in the EU will prevent a deflationary vortex affecting UK. Well, Yanis sounded quite convinced, and he of all people does seem to understand a thing or two about this stuff. He didn't get the memo that Nirvana in Europe was going to happen instead. It is definite then? I suppose we can repent at leisure if it doesn't happen. Hard lesson, though if it doesn't.

As for regulatory mechanisms being dismantled. Why on earth would one presume that is necessarily to everyone's advantage?

Regulations protecting workers rights. Can't wait to see the back of them. Also can't wait to breather in lovely toxic fumes, etc. Too right it is Nirvana. A charter for people who want to heap disbenefits and get away with exploiting people and the environment.

Maybe it would be ok if I could live on my superyacht and leave the hot polloi to endure it.

'Uk aren't in Euro. Good thing there wasn't austerity in UK, then? '

Yes, but the austerity in the EU affects our businesses and our bankers followed a similar policy anyway.

'The problem with the Euro was that there wasn't an institution like a proper central bank operating across all the states regulating everything. You can't have a proper currency union without that. '

Yes, but that will only make things worse, it will enforce austerity from the centre without escape. No country like Greece could challenge the economic policy decided by the bankers at the centre.

'Yanis sounded quite convinced, and he of all people does seem to understand a thing or two about this stuff. '

Yes, he was convinced but he is a socialist, committed to socialism and against sovereign independence and self-determination. He believes in collaborating on a club, but the club is cpitalist and not socialist and never will be socialist because the power resides with money.

'He didn't get the memo that Nirvana in Europe was going to happen instead'

No because he is a big government socialist who believes in elites telling the people what to do. Small government conservatism and sovereignty is not what he wants.

'As for regulatory mechanisms being dismantled. Why on earth would one presume that is necessarily to everyone's advantage? '

Because it is about freedom from big government regulation which allows the entrepreneurial sector and small business sector to breathe and grow and compete against the big government and big business corporations which set regulations which perpetuate monopoly of bug business interests.

Some regulations are necessary, but lots of the bureaucracy implemented by the Brussels bureuacrats and political class who have no business experience can be removed to create growth and employment, exactly as billionaire businessman, Trump, is advocating for the United States.

Ill have to disagree with you, sorry about that. And a thousand words do not alter a persons mind - either side can find plenty of words to support their argument. I still think the main public rebellion which pushed Cameron into a referendum is the fact this country is being over-run with foreigners that will not integrate and have taken over areas where UK citizens cannot now go and have tried to bend our legal system to their own customs. And I must say that everyone I know is not really bothered about the economy - after all, the economy will adjust and economists are hardly going to let the country go down the pan. Most people IMO are worried that Britain is morphing into Pakistan.

Hi.
The way I see it seems to be....
Vote 'stay' if the economy is more important to you.
Vote 'Leave' if immigration is of more importance.

Tw1 kle..

For me it is:-
Vote leave to have democracy and be able to vote the government out of power. (imperfect as it is we can still give Dave the boot)
Vote stay if you want to be governed by a bureaucracy with no democratic accountability.

For people whose concern seems to be about immigration from Pakistan, people from there don't have freedom of movement as it is not in the EU.

Indeed, Brexiteers seem to be campaigning for more immigration from Pakistan (and Bangladesh for curry cooks 'to save the British curry') which is in the Commonwealth, in lieu of EU immigration.

If youre undecided, watch Brexit The Movie - its on Youtube. And immigration isn`t even mentioned. I was shocked at how the EU functions.

Me too Idacyder. I'll definitely be voting out since seeing this.

Not sure if this link to Brexit The Movie will work ...

"The way I see it seems to be....
Vote 'stay' if the economy is more important to you.
Vote 'Leave' if immigration is of more importance."

Both very narrow reasons, and poor advice in total if you don't mind me saying.

Immigration effects the economy and the economy affects immigration.

If there were a single reason for deciding which way to vote then ever closer union is the most pressing.

There is no status quo it should be pointed out, though I find it rather depressing to see the remain camp try to claim the status quo. This is downright dishonest and has no basis in fact.

By treaty obligation we are committed to Ever Closer Union and this will continue apace in the event of a remain vote and likely accelerate.

We therefore stand at a T junction with no road straight ahead. We either turn towards the EU with it's ambitions for a superstate and EU army, or away to shape our own destiny with the rest of the world.

Immigration will likely continue with a leave vote, though we could be far more selective in who we seek. Personally I think this is a poor 'single issue'.

The economy too would likely continue. :)

Frankly the doom and gloom perpetrated by remain has little basis. The figures being bandied about such as £9 billion per year compare to our public spending budget of close to £700 billion. The inconvenience of even the worst case scenario to the 6% of businesses which actually export to the EU are mere tarifs, though as they export more to us this would be a net gain to the exchequer.

I think the leave camp should be a little more honest in the effects upon business, there would be some inconvenience to industries, particularly those who have grown large by dint of the EU handing them advantages against their smaller rivals. Nothing profound though, small gradual change as the forces affecting the workforce, fiscal regime and potentially tarifs subtly change the landscape. Business doesn't like uncertainly or rapid change so other than political statements I really can't see anything drastic happening even in the worst case.

In the long term however the results would more be towards re balancing the UK's economy towards it's traditional model. The great trading cities such as Glasgow, Bristol and Liverpool would be renewed as the influence and power of London and the South East waned. Frankly many of the more strident claims made by remain only ring even arguably true if you put, "If you are living in London and well off" in front of them - as all our politicians are.

We either fill in the gaps in the EU's single market with all the horsetrading and shenanigans that entails or set our sails to eventually tap the far larger and hungrier markets worldwide. The two are incompatible as the EU's customs union operates much akin to a car boot sale where you trade freely with your neighbours but disadvantage yourself through tarifs with the rest of the world.

We have little influence or power within the EU as evidenced by our inability to shape a common security and defence policy. This is our strongest suit as a nation within Europe yet we have clearly been unable to influence them or show leadership, the president of the EU would not be calling for the creation of an EU army otherwise.

Ever closer union has real dangers, brexit real opportunities which I think would be particularly favourable for our youngsters.