Tory MP Mark Reckless defects to UKIP

[claig]

Panic in elite circles

Another mangled message!

seriously, a few debates on TV and the voters will turn away from Ed in droves.

I would put money on the Tories forming the next Govt, in part or fully. Don't forget everyone expected kin nock to be elected. He just blew it in one night in Sheffield. ed us blowing it every day until may

WetAugust .... I reiterate my earlier point, if the pure hatred of Conservatives apparently screwing with 'social justice' and the NHS (despite the facts), allows Labour voters (and most of Scotland) to forgive whatever the Labour Parliamentary Party does to them - whaddya think the prospects of anti EU, anti public sector, anti the north, nationalist, UKIP do to get them to the ballot box to support the red teams???

The Conservatives were unable to form a majority in 2010 with UkIP taking what back then, 3% of the General Election vote, what is UKIPs now expected to be in 2015, 11-15% or more?

The unfair electoral boundary advantages for Labour are huge, as mentioned before, the Conservatives currently have 36% of the vote and are 20 (or more now, lol) seats SHORT of a parliamentary majority, whilst Labour in 2005 I believe had a 66 seat MAJORITY with 35% of the vote - hence the Labour 31% largest party stat.

Funny old world, the prospects of UKIP forming any part of a UK government WILL now help Labour, red flagged on by the red press, to win the General Election, especially as UKIP takes more Conservative votes.

UKIP voter apparently don't care about the Conservative managed economic recovery, or that their party no longer prioritizes leaving the EU and happier to bitch about immigration for their votes rather than accept a Referendum - and suckers for 'change' and don't understand from 2015 what we have, could get significantly worse, thanks to them.

Then watch a 2015 Labour government load the boundaries further their way and start indoctrinating 16-year old they've given the vote to, via the left wing education establishment - resulting in the UK staying in the EU for the next 10-years at least. Happy daze, U-kippers.

Isitmebut

You covered a lot of points in your last post however many are incorrect

Cameron recently said he would let 16 year olds vote

You totally misunderstand the Labour support. Unions may have elected Ed but they have very little sway with the ordinary working man. many of your other arguments for people voting Lab as opposed to UKIP are misinformed. The working man is seeing his wages kept artificially low by an increase in availability of low laid workers from the EE. And the Labour voter can see that it's Zlab that started that avalanche and that until we leave the EU that avalanche cannot be stopped.

No matter his much the LibLabCon tell us his bad Ukip us and now matter his much their chums in the media try to assist them in reinforcing that misconception people living they'd say to day lives see exactly what us happening and will not be fooled

Another Tory sex scandal, or rather the same Tory in more sex scandal.

Doesn't even gave the decency to quit nice and intends to stay until the GE

Shabby

Now. Nit no

Arghhh. NOW. Not nice

The unfair electoral boundary advantages for Labour are huge

This is the real scandal. Instead of blaming people for voting for whom they please, as is their right, it might be better to blame the people who have allowed this state of affairs where basically the election is rigged.

WetAugust …. Re your answer to my last post, I can’t work out what you are trying to say re the trade unions, appering to say all Labour voters are directly connected to them, which of course is rubbish – and as I say, just the thought of a Ukip and Conservatives in government in 2015 will galvanize their vote – and Ukip will split the right of centre vote and ensure Labour forms the next government in 2015.

Regarding the Labour policy for ideologically naïve 16-year old votes you say Cameron agrees with it, please provide a link to indicate that I see otherwise.
news.sky.com/story/1344870/cameron-rules-out-reducing-the-voting-age

As to the EU and their workers keeping UK wages down (and the worst recession in 100-years), COMING OUT OF EUROPE WAS UKIP’’s OLD OBJECTIVE, so how is a New UKIP ‘s revised one for Westminster power, allowing back in Labour for at least a decade going to stop immigration here – as if IMMIGRATION is their main concern, why vote for OTT thick Conservative policies on steroids (UKIP), vote for the Conservatives who with a referendum in 2017, give them an EU vote.

Do you know the ONLY way voting UKIP will stop EU immigration here?

Let me tell you; aided by UKIP the EU economic immigration will stop coming to the UK due to a Labour government coming back in to government in 2015, following their 2010 policies that were very similar to France, will ensure that the UK economy will tank, very similar to France – and unable to get past ‘the people’ of France the type of business/employment reforms the Conservatives brought in before 1997, and after 2010, they are destined for very hard times for years ahead.

“French say au revoir to France: Over two million French people now live abroad, and most are crossing the channel and heading to London”
www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/french-say-au-revoir-to-france-over-two-million-french-people-now-live-abroad-and-most-are-crossing-the-channel-and-heading-to-london-9788348.html

“France’s unemployment rate is hovering around 10 per cent. As for high-earners, almost 600 people subject to a wealth tax on assets of more than €800,000 (£630,000) left France in 2012, 20 per cent more than the previous year. Manuel Valls, the Prime Minister, announced in London this week that the top income tax rate of 75 per cent would be abolished next January after a number of business tycoons and celebrities moved out.”

“France’s Debt Outlook (currently AA rated) Cut to Negative (for potential downgrade) by S&P on Growth”
www.bloomberg.com/news/2014-10-10/france-rating-outlook-dropped-to-negative-by-standard-poor-s.html

So what good has the UKIP French equivalent, the anti EU, anti immigration, anti establishment ‘peoples party’ , the National Front done to help ‘the working man’ there???

Well this is what the Conservative led coalition’s numerous reforms HAS DONE for the ‘working class’ here resulting in less new Labour taxes from 2010 to all, economic growth and 1.8 million new jobs – and Farage’s UKIPs quest for power in Westminster, will look to destroy.

“UK economy will overtake France to become second biggest economy in Europe next year, IMF predicts”
• UK output predicted to be £1.9trillion next year against France's £1.8trillion
• IMF said France held back by 'bloated' public sector and high state spending
• Britain set to be fastest growing economy in the developed world this year

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2788664/uk-economy-overtake-france-second-biggest-economy-europe-year-imf-predicts.html

Pixel ... who is 'the people' that allowed those rigged boundaries, the Conservatives who last had a majority to change it in 1997, was it really that bad back then.

As 'different' Farage should know betraying every one of their voters wanting to come out of the EU asap, and as 'different' Blair said before him and 'different' Clegg said after - once politicians get a whiff of 'Westminster elite' POWER, nothing stands in their way - including what is right for the country over their egos.

*Farage says ‘UKIP could hold the balance of POWER’ at the next election’
. www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-29572185

“ "We've got a chance here in a general election next year that is likely to be very tight, in an election in which no one party is likely to have a majority. If UKIP can keep this momentum going, we could find ourselves next May in a position where we hold the balance of POWER."

Deluding (or still telling porkies for votes) Farage, thinks UKIP has more in common with Labour in a coalition than the Lib Dem's. Guffaw.

Isitmebut

you know, I just couldn't be bothered to read your full rant.

UKIPs PRIMRY objective is to leave the EU. everything else is secondary.

Pixel
Boundary changes were one of the supposed agreements that the Conservatives had with the Liberals but the Liberals decided go change their minds and not support boundary changes after all. Just another example of the very weak management style that Cameron has displayed throughout this coalition.

Well precisely. It's a bit rich them bleating on about how a vote for UKIP is a vote for Labour as if it's the voters' fault.

I'm sure I read that they were going to change the boundaries but Clegg blocked it, have I got that right?

I don't hate the Tories btw, I'm basically a natural Tory voter and still agree with many of their policies. I just don't believe for one second that Cameron intends to have a fair referendum over Europe or do anything to curb immigration. He is taking us all for fools.

Oh sorry crossed post, but you did answer my question anyway .

Pixel ... "I just don't believe for one second that Cameron intends to have a fair referendum over Europe or do anything to curb immigration. He is taking us all for fools."

UKIP misrepresenting to the UKIP voter that THEY could bring us out of the EU for 20-years and getting 24 MEP who should be representing our interests (instead of doing squat all) DIDN'T take 'the people' for fools - the extent of that affront to democracy should be classed as an act of treason.

UKIP drunk with by-election power saying 'we don't believe Cameron will deliver an EU Referendum' that could render the United Kingdom Independence Party irrelevant before they have their 'long game' targeted number of Westminster seats - so no self interest there then, by 'the peoples party', in wanting another 2015 minority Tory, or Labour government, in power.

The EU Referendum in 2017 is wanted by the people, to settle a division within the Conservative party that won't heal until we have one AND to ensure a big, fat, bureaucratic EU experiment and open immigration laws enshrined in British law DON'T DRAG THE UK DOWN WITH IT - as after 2015 with NO referendum, all we 'the people' can HOPE for, is serious immigration reforms by the EU we are stuck in under Labour.

P.S. Yes, the Lib Dems who Ukip voters put into coalition, have more in common with Labour and most tree hugging members hate the Conservatives, DID block the boundary fairness change, thus ensuring with a split right wing vote with Ukip, pre EU socialists from 2015 will run the UK for at least a decade.

In 2010 the Conservatives would have had a slim parliamentary majority if not for UKIP, to put an EU Referendum into law during this parliament for asap - the boundaries are secondary, as if a 2010 UKIP with 3% of the vote stopped a Conservative majority, what would 15% of the vote do when this government has had to make tough unpopular decisions?

WetAugust … you read Claig’s made up stories e.g. 'I was in Clacton' rollocks, but don’t read the facts on issues, you really are true U-kipper; selectively ignorant.

As for Cameron’s inability to get the Lib Dem Party that hates Conservatives, to be able to fight General Election on level grounds down to “weak management style” – are you on the whacky baccy – Cameron’s leadership formed that first coalition in decades with a left wing party and made very tough decisions that prats like you with party’s with little to offer like to misrepresent e.g. a bedroom tax (to help free up 800,000 unused bedrooms for the 1.7 million families/5 million people waiting for social housing in 2010 with a bust government finances.

Whereas Farage’s “weak management style” with nothing to tangibly offer, lied to the country for 20-years, and was scared to let Mr Lord know in Clacton he wasn’t to be after 17-years of UKIP election service, their 2015 candidate - because ex Tory backer Wheeler had bought a new popular sitting Clacton MP with a promise of a big title and POWER.

"but don’t read the facts on issues"

What facts? Like the following one you mean?

"So what good has the UKIP French equivalent, the anti EU, anti immigration, anti establishment ‘peoples party’ , the National Front done to help ‘the working man’ there???"

The Front National aren't in power in France, it is the Socialists in power. I knew you got most "facts" wrong, but that one is worthy of the Pimlico Plonker.

If you have got any facts you wish to discuss, such as Farage is the British politician with the highest approval rating, then of course people will discuss that with you. But

"UKIP drunk with by-election power saying 'we don't believe Cameron will deliver an EU Referendum' that could render the United Kingdom Independence Party irrelevant before they have their 'long game' targeted number of Westminster seats - so no self interest there then, by 'the peoples party', in wanting another 2015 minority Tory, or Labour government, in power."

is not a fact, it is gobbledegook. And that's a fact.

Isitmebut

This thread is one of the most circular arguments that I have seen.

You say only Dave. An offer a referendum

We say. we don't believe Dave

And so the thread continues, on and on, round and round, sprinkled with links, rhetoric, accusations and unpleasantness.

Dave has had his 5 years in the spotlight

Many, probably most, of his former supporters who have defected to UKIP are not coming back into the Tory gold.

They understand that UKIP cannot take the UK of the DU and they understand that only the Tories are currently offering a referendum.

repeat from the top of this post.

I really don't want to have to keep tapping out the same message time and time again.

Claig .. I have gathered you have selected reading habits, amongst U-kippers you are not alone, but 'here was one I prepared for you earlier', or a few days ago I believe on the Clacton thread.

"FYI France’s 3rd largest party the National Front under the ‘softer’ approach to nationalism Ms Marine Le Pen, has 23 MEPs (to Ukip’s 24) and in September this year, won their first two seats in the French Senate which she laughingly called “a breath of fresh air” – so with Rochester to come and in the bag, Farage’s ‘new’ Ukip similarity to Frances Front National will nearly be complete – once they are CONFIRMED in 2015 as the UK’s 3rd largest party, and thanks to no referendum have no option to leave the EU, that is."

P.S. after reading your rollocks on the Clacton thread e.g. 'UKIP will take over from the Conservatives as the opposition to Labour' when Farage couldn't run bath water never mind a country, you are the LAST one to challenge my "UKIP drunk with by-election power".

P.P.S. Mr Blair once had the highest approval rating, even took a 177 seat majority off the Conservatives handing over the fastest growing economy in Europe in 1997, but as in 1979, the UK needs the Conservatives to make the tough unpopular decisions to get the country back on track - when the other party soundbites that never get one of those 'round to-its' sends the country into a debt/economic tail spin.

The Front National is nothing like UKIP which is why Farage said he would not do a deal with them in the EU group formation etc

"P.S. after reading your rollocks on the Clacton thread e.g. 'UKIP will take over from the Conservatives as the opposition to Labour' when Farage couldn't run bath water never mind a country, you are the LAST one to challenge my "UKIP drunk with by-election power"."

That is a fair point, both are opinions, not facts. We will have to wait and see who is right. I am certain I will be right, but we will have to wait and see.

'P.P.S. Mr Blair once had the highest approval rating, even took a 177 seat majority off the Conservatives'

Yes, things change. Blair took us into illegal wars and the people finally had enough of his spinning and politically correct preaching. But Farage voted against the air strike on Syria, he said "the EU has blood on its hands over Ukraine", he was against air strikes on Isis in Iraq, he is not a spinner and he is not politically correct. That is why he will eventually win hands down.

Sorry, Farage didn't "vote", he is not in Parliament yet. That is coming soon. He will make mincemeat of the politically correct minnows in Parliament and the people will vote him our most popular politician ever. But that lies ahead in the future.

Following

OMG

Will the panic never cease for the gilded Westminster elite? I'm just one of the people, so long ignored, patronised and insulted, by the elite, but even i'm beginning tfeel sorry for them.

It's over!

"Record poll surge gives Ukip 25%: Survey would hand Farage astonishing 128 MPs... and puts Ed Miliband on new low
David Cameron remains the most trusted political leader in the poll
But Nigel Farage is on track to win 128 seats at the General Election
The Tories could lose more than 100 seats allowing in Ed Miliband
Polls suggest the public want Cameron and Farage to run the country"

Nationwide support for Nigel Farage’s Ukip has soared to an all-time high 25 per cent – enough for the party to take Parliament by storm with well over 100 MPs and a possible Labour Election victory.

That is the shock result of a Survation poll for The Mail on Sunday, carried out after Ukip rocked the Tories and Labour in two by-elections last week.

If the poll result was repeated in next year’s General Election, it would see the Tories lose 100 seats, the certain resignation of David Cameron – and the possibility of Ed Miliband in No10."

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2789512/record-poll-surge-gives-ukip-25-survey-hand-farage-astonishing-128-mps-puts-ed-miliband-new-low.html

They all now know what we, the people, are thinking and saying

Trevor Philips said on the Andrew Marr Show something llke the people feel that decisions are made by a liberal elite who do not speak to the people, but speak to themselves. And Boris Johnson said that he can't see a pact between UKIP and the Tories working because there is a feeling out there (i.e. among the people) that Westminster is a stitch-up were they stitch things up among themselves.

So it is starting to look like we may see the end of stitch-ups.

I remember the words of UKIP candidate Winston McKenzie, which were dismissed and mocked at the time, but which are beginning to sound more prophetic by the day when he said

"the word is with the people and the word is UKIP, UKIP, UKIP"

Farage puts his finger on the problem of the liberal elite's political correctnes that has turned the public off the wjhole lot of them - Conservative modernisers, Labour and LibDem.

Farage is right and that is why he will win, nothing they do can stop him, they haven't got enough spin.

"THE Cameron Conservatives are not the new politics; they are getting in the way of the new politics. The British public are crying out for change and increasingly they see Ukip as offering the best prospect of that change.

In recent years the three older parties have together turned politics into a ghetto for the liberal metropolitan elite – a space from which most of the British public is ruthlessly excluded.

All back Britain’s prohibitively expensive and anti-democratic subservience to the European Union, all are signed up to an energy policy that drives bills ever higher and all back continued enormous increases in spending on foreign aid. In short, all have fallen prey to the conceit of being generous with other people’s money. All too are happy to render Britain effectively borderless in respect of more than two dozen neighbouring countries.

None has an answer to the social mobility crisis that has grown since the option of academically selective education within the state sector was throttled in the 1970s. All are happy to see Britain entangled in dodgy and often counterproductive foreign wars. All would keep us locked inside the European human rights regime. And perhaps worst of all, they are all run by cliques of college kids who know little of the real world.

No wonder those who have to earn a proper living and strive to pay their own bills and are not prisoners to political correctness find that Ukip is a party they can connect with and be proud to support.

www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-2789592/nigel-farage-did-win-don-t-play-fools.html

What Farage has achieved is little short of miraculous. I never thought we would ever see politics for the people and not for the elite, a country where ordinary people's opinions counted and were heard and not just this clique of public school pupils and progressives. A country where Farage could stand up for the people and challenge every sacred cow of the elite from immigration and globalisation to global warming.

They will try to stop him and stop the people's party. I think I know what they will do. They will have a "moderniser" within UKIP. He will begin to say that Farage is not being "politically correct", that he is "nasty Nigel", that he is not a "moderniser" and not a "progressive" and they will give this person lots of media publicity as they build him up to try and challenge Farage and the people in order to stop UKIP and the People's Army in its tracks.

The people of Clacton and everywhere else will have their fingers crossed that Farage will come out on top and will deliver direct democracy to the people. But the spinners have lots of tricks up their sleeves and we ain't seen nothing yet.