Tory MP Mark Reckless defects to UKIP

[claig]

Panic in elite circles

UKIP will get us out of the EU but it can't be done overnight. It has taken them 20 years for the British public to swing towards them and change our political system into a multi-party system. But the momentum is with them now, because the people are with them now.

Farage has got women on his side, how do you think he won Clacton with a landslide and will probably win Rochester too. Don't believe the spin the modernisers tell you, it's the same old spin they tried to use on Alex Salmond.

'why did they have to buy some sitting Conservative MPs'

They didn't have to. They have MPs knocking on their door. They know the way the wind is blowing and what the people are thinking. But UKIP want to shake teh system by demonstrating that they can win Tory safe seats and challenge Labour safe seats, and every time they demonstrate that, they win many more voters over. The voters don't like the Tories and Labour, they just vote for either of them because they dislike the other. But now with UKIP, we are seeing a mass revolt as people switch to UKIP because they like them.

UKIP is a people's movement, a people's party, a People's Army. The other parties are for the metropolitan elite not for the people.

Claig ..... if you are not repeating the Farage/UKIP lie to voters, please fully explain HOW UKIP will get us out of the EU?

UKIP come second in 5 by-election the Lib Dems used to WIN, but you only get Westminster seats if poach sitting Conservatives, please get real.

Re your Farage/UKIP claim on women, what are the polls you like to quote, showing UKIP men versus women voter support?

UKIPs Wheeler said that HE invited loads of Conservative MPs to a Mayfair diner for talks, did they all have to knock before allowed in?

Re what voters like, as history shows, in bad economic times they make BAD political choices and vote for the geezer leading far right political parties with the biggest gob.

I predict after 2015, no matter how many Westminster seats UKIP gets, 'the people' suffering from another 5-years of Labour's 'tax high, spend badly' policies - in 2020 will blame UKIP for killing the Conservative recovery, and kick every grandstanding UKIP muppet out.

But what a shame the country needs to go to hell in a hand cart for EVERYONE, before the UKIP voters work it out for themselves.

Don't just believe polls of 1500 people, get out on the street and see for yourself. That is what the metropolitan elite have had to do and they have received a great shock. They thought their spin would save their skin, but their message has worn thin and they are afraid they won't win.

Ask people who they will vote for - Clacton was a UKIP landslide. It's the same where I live, everyone's gorn UKIP.

"UKIP Confounds Expectations To Win Teen Votes

UKIP is no party for old men: Nigel Farage is winning over an increasing number of teen supporters who say the party means change.
...
I was struck by the range of people who told me in May that they were proud to be voting UKIP in the European elections. Among them was a wealthy older couple in Cheshire who had always voted Conservative and a working class "socialist" in Rotherham who had always backed Labour.

It wasn't just men and it wasn't just white people either.

But perhaps most unusual was the 18-year-old I met in Kingston, Surrey, who was ready to put his cross by Nigel Farage's party.

That did throw me a bit.

Personally, I have long been convinced that UKIP's anti-EU, tough on immigration brand would persuade traditional voters of the Left.

It was less easy to predict that it could attract young voters too.

But then there it was again, in Clacton-on-Sea at the by-election last week. First a pair of 17-year-old girls, giggling excitedly, as they told me they would have voted for "Douglas" [Carswell] last week if they had been old enough.

news.sky.com/story/1353249/ukip-confounds-expectations-to-win-teen-votes

The polls are underestimating the true support for UKIP from all sections of society. The spinners are going to be in for one hell of a shock on polling day.

"UKIPs Wheeler said that HE invited loads of Conservative MPs to a Mayfair diner for talks, did they all have to knock before allowed in?"

I don't know about all of them, but the rumour I heard was that the knocking, banging and pleading to be let in grew so loud that they were served with a noise abatement order.

'I predict after 2015, no matter how many Westminster seats UKIP gets, 'the people' suffering from another 5-years of Labour's 'tax high, spend badly' policies - in 2020 will blame UKIP for killing the Conservative recovery, and kick every grandstanding UKIP muppet out.'

I think you are wrong. If Labour win then I think that will be the end of the Tory party. They will split and UKIP will become themain opposition to Labour and will thrash Labour and their politically correct spinners at the next election, and that is when we will get out of the EU.

"Ukip aren’t going away – and David Cameron has no idea what to do

The Prime Minister’s sniffy attitude to some of his own natural supporters seems quite likely to cost him power"

www.spectator.co.uk/features/9220061/ukip-arent-going-away-and-david-cameron-has-no-idea-what-to-do/

"Voters think Lib Dems will fade away, UKIP here to stay"

yougov.co.uk/news/2014/10/07/voters-think-lib-dems-will-fade-away/

"Ukip is here to stay – especially if Labour wins"

www.spectator.co.uk/columnists/politics/9343412/ukip-is-here-to-stay-especially-if-labour-wins/

"It was less easy to predict that it [UKIP] could attract young voters too."

Labour want to lower the voting age to 16. They think that young people will vote for them because they think young people are easily influenced by their spin etc. But they will get a great shock when they find that young people will vote for UKIP in greater numbers than they vote for Labour, just as they were shocked by the number of young people who preferred the SNP to Labour in Scotland.

"The Conservatives are heading for another humiliating defeat at Ukip’s hands in the crucial Rochester and Strood by-election, according to a survey by ComRes."
...
Ukip’s 13-point advantage is four points higher than the previous poll in the constituency and suggests the Tories’ decision to “throw the kitchen sink” at the by-election is not working.
...
But ComRes found that 66 per cent of local people believe the Tories “are coming across as desperate” by sending so many politicians there."

www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/poll-tories-on-course-for-another-humiliating-defeat-in-rochester-byelection-9811832.html

It's desperate at Metropolitan Elite Towers. Every PPE and teenage Oxbridge think tank spinner available has been drafted in to come up with more top quality spin, they're bricking it, they know they can't win - the People's Army has got them in a spin.

They hired the best and the brightest from the top public schools.
Every one of them had been to Oxbridge, it was said they were no fools.
PPEs grew on trees and as for money, they earned metropolitan fees.
They majored in spin and public policy, they were a natural born aristocracy.

They knew every trick, but their downfall was their arrogance, for they thought the public was thick.

They didn't understand the people, well how could they from high up on their steeple?
They thought we could be spun, nudged and done up like a kipper, they lectured us as if we were a nipper.
They said they cared, charidee was their middle name, it was all our fault, we were the ones to blame.

All their media mates ran a coordinated spin campaign, every night on TV it was exactly the same.
Charidees, spinners, modernisers, polars bears, every night another fright until the people started to do what was right.
They called us binge drinkers, they said we were shameless and that they would increase the price of our alcohol because we weren't blameless.
They lectured us and hectored us and said that they were modern, untill it all got too much and we said sod 'em.

Then came a man from Kent who listened to the people's discontent.
He sat smoking a fat cigar in a public bar as he poured himself another jar.
His name was Farage and all the people knew and hoped that he would go far.
He left the bar and went into the street and cried out to the spinners that the emperor has no clothes, and of course he was right, it was as plain as your nose.

And then the shit hit the fan, the Oxbridge spinners didn't predict it, but who foresaw it, why, my old nan.
Down in Clacton-on-Sea, the people made history
To the metropolitan elite and all their media mates it was a mystery
This wasn't in the script, this wasn't what was meant to be
This was the people's victory

Claig ….. Four posts containing top to bottom spin on the success of UKIPs political propaganda on why, but don’t you think that it is more telling that you have not chose to qualify YOUR OWN STATEMENT, “UKIP will get us out of the EU but it can't be done overnight."

So I will once again ask you HOW, as this is key to whether UKIP is a serious political party, rather than a ‘cult’ that betrays its supporters with false promises, WILL UKIP “get us out of EU”, and over what time frame?
“UKIP leader Nigel Farage has disowned the party's entire general election manifesto - which he helped launch - branding it "drivel”.
news.sky.com/story/1200525/nigel-farage-disowns-ukip-manifesto-as-drivel

Re the youth vote, of course UKIP and Labour are targeting them, as they are politically naïve and listen to political soundbites rather than go into policy detail and a party’s record in power. You don’t think launching a Calypso was aimed at your older and more BNP type anti ethnic voters do you lol? But look how the youth vote has changed against the Lib Dems for what they see as broken promises - wait until a vote UKIP get Labour vote crashes the economy and services and tuition fees go up through the roof, and as taxes rise, they’ll have more trouble paying them back when leaving.

Re other voters, Claig, I get it I really do, and so do the Conservatives who if they do try hard to win a by-election ‘they are desperate’, but if don’t try hard ‘they don’t care’ or ‘have given up’ depending on the UKIP spin.

As UKIP can deliver nothing they offer, they are CLEARLY a protest vote, and the Conservatives doing the right thing for the country now, ARE seriously worried, worried for all our futures with a ‘vote UKIP now, pay for it for generations to come’ – as without a plan for growth, tax rises have to pay it down.
www.nationaldebtclock.co.uk/

Cameron will of course be personally worried, as he wants a UK Referendum, the United Kingdom Independence Party clearly does not, and when like in 1979 and 2010 they need to come in to sort out this countries problems, thanks to the ‘now’ protest vote, the future state of the State and our services, will be so much worse – and everyone knowing then that UKIP offered nothing but mild British anarchy, will not make solving the 2020 crisis, any easier._

"HOW ... WILL UKIP “get us out of EU”, and over what time frame?

I have explained that the Tories are finished as a party and that UKIP will become the main opposition to the politically correct metropolitan PPEs in Labour and that in 5 years' time, UKIP, the party of the people, will absolutely thrash the metropolitan spinners and that calling UKIP "vile, abhorrent and un-British" will only hasten their decline.

In 5 years' time, UKIP will be in government and then we will come out of the EU.

Isitmebut, what you are missing is the power of the people.
We have been spun, lied to, ignored, mocked, called "fruitcakes" and worse by an out-of-touch arrogant metropolitan elite who thought they were born to rule, and that each and everyone of us was an arrant fool.

They underestimated the British people, they underestimated Middle England, and now they are getting their comeuppance.

That is democracy, that is how the people change things for the better, so that our voice is heard.

Humpty Dumpty has had a great fall and all of the King's spinners and metropolitan media manipulators can't put him back together again.

Claig … there is sooo much ‘spin’ in there, I don’t know where to start.
But firstly, of course I understand the ‘power of the people’, here in 2010 they voted for the Lib Dems and UKIP in droves, and now we have a minority government that cannot implement all the ‘change’ they want e.g. put into law a Referendum date for the NEXT parliament – and not related (lol) the Palestinians elected Hamas to speak for them ‘democratically’.

Second, if UKIP’s ‘change’ to a political party turning around our economy is a 20-years lie on their ability to leave the EU, WHICH YOU CLEARLY STILL REPEAT and a 2010 manifesto your leader rubbished – where is the upside of ‘vote UKIP, getting Labour back’ to govern?

Thirdly, to obviously appeal to the young and the less aware, you keep on and on and on about the ‘Westminster elite’, when there are clear policy differences. And if UKIP needs Conservatives to win Westminster seats - as below is the ‘standard’ UKIP have to to wheel out at by-elections a ‘a political alternative’ – then voters should just vote for the ‘Westminster elite Conservatives’ directly – and not risk our recovery/services.

Is it really 'spin' if this is the standard of UKIP candidate Farage previously told this country was to answer to our budget deficit and put forward at by-elections before a few sitting MP Conservatives - and how many more are UKIP now hiding in plain sight before their Conservative 'upgrade'? lol

“UKIP man's chief backer is porn star called 'Lord Lust' (...so much for Nigel Farage's pledge to weed out the 'Walter Mittys')”

• John Bickley tipped for second place in Wythenshaw and Sale by-election
• He was nominated by 'womaniser and bon vivant' James Hadfield-Hyde
• Mr Hadfield-Hyde hosted adult show Lord Lust's Lovelies in the 1990s
• He also appeared in pornographic film Up At The Crack Of Dawn
www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2554783/UKIP-mans-chief-backer-porn-star-called-Lord-Lust-Nigel-Farages-pledge-weed-Walter-Mittys.html

Isitmebut

Alll you do is smear

Smear Wheeler. smear Sykes, smear lord Lust etc etc etc

smear is your only political weapon for defending Cameron's hopeless case.

Thats why i dont bother any more

If you want a serious debate about timescales for renehoiation etc - that's fine.

If you just want to moan about funders / backers / DJs etc then carry on - on your olwn

Farage comes out swinging over the UKIP Calypso.

"The Ukip Calypso song, written in jest and enjoyed by many, meant that thousands of people, if not millions of Ukip supporters were "vile", according to Labour's Chuka Umunna."

www.independent.co.uk/voices/comment/attacks-on-ukip-calypso-show-just-how-skewed-peoples-priorities-are-9814360.html

They can't put Farage back in his box. He won't lie down, he won't give up. They are throwing the kitchen sink at him, but UKIP are still going to win.

3 by elections tonight, including one in Kent.

Tories won 2 and Labour won 1 ( in Don Valley area where Caroline Flint is the MP)

In both cases UKIP were 2nd

I don't think the support is as deep or as widespread as the polls suggest

WetAugust ..... re your "In both cases UKIP were 2nd" and "I don't think the support is as deep or as widespread as the polls suggest".

May I take you back to your previous post, throwing your toys out of the pram for my daring to point out - that take away the two sitting 'Westminster elite' Conservatives back-bench MPs UKIP bought to win your first Westminster seats - UKIP are full of numbnuts most of us would not trust to run a bath, never mind a council, and god forbid, our country.

Yet look at that link; Mr Farage was happy enough to wheel Mr Bickley around the Wythenshaw and Sale by-election as the 'change' this country needs.

UKIP's rich backer who joined/funded UKIP from around 2010, runs a big FTSE spread betting company, he manages 'punters' and 'risk', so reduced the 'odds' of trusting very odd UKIPs candidates to win Westminster seats by buying a few Conservatives, which is very 'corporate'.

So I do not 'smear' Wheeler, I tell it how it is, UKIP attacking Conservatives (and choosing to forget UKIP's purpose) is nothing more than a attempted 'reverse takeover', where a smaller player tries to take over a larger one.

Thing of it like in Syria, ISIS was small until they picked up Iraqi generals/strategists, and that is what Wheeler is too UKIP, an effective strategist - but all of his UKIP bred troops have two-left feet, usually in their MOUTHS. lol.

Ooops, comparing Wheeler to an Iraqi general might be seen as a smear, my bad.

'UKIP are full of numbnuts most of us would not trust to run a bath, never mind a council, and god forbid, our country.'

Where exactly is your evidence for that?

Claig …. “where is my evidence for that”, how long ya got for me to dig them all up????
For a starter, just using that link above, Farage himself had said that he needed to ‘weed out’ what he called the ‘Walter Mitty characters’, with and without jackboots.

Looking at a UKIP/Farage endorsed Mr Bickley, apparently the main runs companies, took £100k from the EU for one of them, yet he ‘stands against’ the EU? What does that say about Mr Bickley’s character, judgement, professional and institutional ethics?

UKIP’s Wheeler is a smart man, professionally HE knows the best way to steal market share from competitors, is to HIRE the oppositions talent.

But in increasing UKIP’s talent pool, how sad is it for a UKIP wanting to now run the country, that two Conservative BACK BENCHERS, are the best UKIP has by far?

Bearing in mind Farage was Conservative, don’t you think that it is a sad state of UKIP affairs, when ‘in the UKIP land of the politically blind, the (Toru third division) BLUE eyed men are now kings’?

Claig

It's clear what Junckers and co are trying to do now. They want yo make Dave very unpopular as he's shown to be spineless over Europe, hence Ukipngains strength, leading to Ed victory.

And Junckers and co are doing this because they want Ed in because Ed will not threaten them with a referendum.

This is a direct EU challenge to the democracy of this country.

It's outrageous

It looks like they are not being helpful to Dave with the timing for the by-election. This probably ends up helping UKIP's chances in the by-election.

I think this tax increase thing was a decision of the old commission, and it appears that the new commission can change it and the new commission starts on Nov 1. But it is all smoke and mirrors because even if they change it now, we know that it will probably come back at another time, so it won't probably make much difference except for timing and by-elections.

Miliband is not going to win anyway. Labour are a joke, they haven't been able to get their act together and be a forceful opposition so they won't make it this time.

We are witnessing the collapse of popular support for the establishment parties. The Tories could only get a turnout of 5688 in their open primary in Rochester for what Farage has described as the most important by-election of the past 30 years.

"The turnout is the key in this as it will give some indication as to the level of interest in the constituency in the Conservative candidate. It is worth bearing in mind that the turnout in Sarah Wollaston’s open primary in Totnes was 16,497. That much lower turnout in a more high-profile contest following a defection will add to party worries following yet another poll showing Ukip ahead in the constituency."

blogs.spectator.co.uk/isabel-hardman/2014/10/kelly-tolhurst-wins-rochester-primary-on-turnout-of-4000/

It's desperate and ordinary people don't care about the Tories any more. It's over for them. The only reason we voted for them was because we didn't like Labour. But they are not even real Conservatives anyway, so they have lost their base. All they have got left is Isitmebut, a motley crew of modernisers, the metropolitan elite and some PPEs - that's it. It's over.

UKIP signs in UKIP offices nationwide now say "UKIP. The People's Party".
That is the truth and that is why it is over.

The corporate, metropoloitan media can try and smear UKIP all they like, but they are losing. Even on social media, UKIP are winning.

"Is Ukip winning on Facebook and Twitter?"
...
But if following a party on Twitter doesn’t mean you support them; liking them on Facebook usually does. Ukip currently has 276,435 likes on Facebook, which is just 18,153 likes short of the Conservative party’s 294,588 and over 82,000 ahead of the Labour Party, which only has 193,788. The Liberal Democrats have 104,132, the Green party of England and Wales has 96,723 and the Scottish National party has 166,795.

Unlike the other parties, Ukip is not just attracting young Facebook users, but is getting older users to engage. The Conservative and Labour parties see their main Facebook interactions among the 18- to 24-year-old age bracket, but Ukip are seeing most engagement from 25-34s and 45-54s."

www.theguardian.com/media/2014/oct/22/ukip-facebook-twitter-nigel-farage-social-media

UKIP gets all the people, not just the yoof, because it is the people's party.

The establishment are losing it, they can't stop UKIP because they can't stop the people.

We know that the establishment believes in global warming and wants to stay in the EU and we know that UKIP challnges those two things. But UKIP, I think, is going tio win because there aren't enough spinners and PPEs in the land to stop the people.

My guess is that Dave will make a stand over this tax thing and challenge the Commission in some way. But it won't make any difference to the people.

Boris Johnson tried to stem the tide to UKIP a while back by saying:
“Vote Tory, vote for the real deal. Don’t go for imitations"

But everyone knows that the real deal is UKIP, everyone knows that Britain's most popular politician is Farage and everyone knows that UKIP is the people's party. That is why UKIP will beat the Tories in Rochester, UKIP's 271st most possible seat to win.

No seat is unwinnable, no spinner is safe, UKIP are on the way to victory, keep the faith.

WetAugust
Precisely! Well summarised.

And even if Labour do win, they will only scrape in.

That means they won't be able to stitch up the people by eroding our civil liberties and our freedoms. They won't be able to bring in their Big Brother State with their DNA databases and ID cards. They won't have the majority to push it through.

So they can't ruin the country or its finances.

Five years' later, UKIP will trounce every spinner in the land and UKIP will be in charge and then we will leave the EU.

I am totally outraged that they are also demanding additional money from Greece. We saw images from Greece last year of Greece being unable to provide medical card, we saw impoverished Greeks handing their children to orphanages because they couldn't afford to feed them and one man hung himself in Syntagema Square in desperation at having no money to buy food.

And the EU want to take money off Greece to give to Germany and France.

It's an utter disgrace

What the Bristish Propoganda Corporation is not showing on the news are the thousands of people who protested in Milan last weekend about the EU and austerity or the thousands that protested in Spain.

the EU is creating a pressure cooker within these poor countries and that pressure cannot be contained forever. Bad things will happen unfortunately.

and that's why we in the UKIP need to get out now in order to stop sending the EU ever more money for them to squander on grants to the BBC (14 million) or handouts to Afghanistan when we are already spending our own UK foreign aid there.

Sort out the food banks and the NHS black hole here before sending our hard earned case to be squandered by a load of unelected bureaucrats who hate us.

Claig

The next Parliament is a poisoned chalice. It's time that Labour had another big drink from it.

any Labour Govt will not last the full term anyway. The IMF would probably have to set in like it did back in the 70s.

Only then will Labour finally be totally killed off and Tories / UKIP will finally get a free hand in a clear victory

let's get it over with