Tory MP Mark Reckless defects to UKIP

[claig]

Panic in elite circles

No frothing on this dude. That all comes from the determined yo be offended brigade.

Did you read about god gofer Nazi who is now a Milton Keynes Labour councillor?

Thougt not.

Did you watch the New EU Presidents speech this morning in which he said it would the most political commission ever and that petty matters could be decided by the national Govts. the big decisions would be made by the unelected commissioners. Juncje also said that he wants more immigration.

Did you know that UKIP voted against the appointment of these undemocratic dictators but the Tory MEPs abstained. So much for Cameron getting his way in the EU. His Tory MEPs just sat on the sideline and watched the farce continue. Pathetic.

Don't think it will get much coverage in the news either.

Are you actually bothered by things like democracy and sovereignty or do you think that being able to use Euros when you travel around Europe outweighs silly old fashioned things like democracy?

Because I don't. Which is why people like me and Claig will continue to discuss the disgusting way in which this country is being ruled by Brussels. I find it quite incredible that people wholes forefathers fought to keep this country as a self ruling state are quite happy to be dictated to into allowing all citizens the right to live here and that we are unable to even deport foreign criminals. What freedoms did we actually fight got because I don't see a lot left.

A very pissed off sounding Dan Hannan now says he will be biting AGAINST the new EU Commission

AT LAST!

This "New EU President" making a speech, is this THE ONE that Cameron vetoed, but hardly any other head of State had the gonads to support, despite many giving their private support - as Junkers 'block' of support was far bigger??

So UKIP, now voting against this 'block' will achieve WHAT, how close is the vote???

Conservative MEP's abstaining ahead of Cameron needing goodwill to negotiate immigration with all EU leaders, not just Junckers, is not just grown up political, it is advisable, UNLESS their opposition would have made any difference at all. FYI Dan 'the man' Hannan said days ago he would be voting 'against'.

Is the vote looking close, or once again at great taxpayer expense, is a UKIP that should be looking after our regional interests within the EU (while we are in it), in trying to piss everyone off within Brussels, is as influential in 'changing' the direction of the EU, as a duck fart in windy weather???

And you have the national front to lecture on this thread on the need for DEMOCRACY & SOVEREIGNTY - when when the 20-year EU 'protest party', UKIP, are knowingly standing in the way of a Conservative UK Referendum on the EU?

What is the point of an expensive, ineffective UKIP protest group within the the sea of bureaucrats called Brussels, especially when looking at their main UK policy, if we wanted to vote for a racist party endorsing songs/chants about immigration, we could just vote for the BNP????

WetAugust … on your last post to me yesterday, you made several accusations against me and the ability/record of Cameron, - while you sing the praises of a UKIP leader who’s only ‘success’ has been 20-years of taxpayer salaried political deception, on both his and his party’s abilities – so please clarify.

You said that I “never actually answer anything, you just deflect”, when I’d have thought few would agree, as usually I reply with a link QUALIFYING my opinion. In fact as far as you are concerned, I’d suggest that the opposite is true, where you make the same inaccurate statements time and time again, I challenge them with FACTS, which you chose neither to challenge nor accept – as it’s not what you WANT to hear.

A perfect example was yesterdays post; “once Dave has ticked his Win The GE off his To Do List I expect he will completely forget about all those promises he made to achieve it. like he did to the Scots. like he did over the Lisbon Treaty.”

Re Scotland – this was no snap of fingers and done deal, are you not aware that there is a timetable over secveral months, where every political party from London to John o’ Groats has a ‘say’ before the Devo-max-ish document is put together, never mind finally agreed - and that it has been said that Cameron/Conservatives want to give Scotland more powers than Labour etc – which admittedly is likely to put that timetable under pressure.

Re the Lisbon Treaty – are you repeating Farage’s mistruth the other day, re Cameron’s “cast iron guarantee” on a referendum to come out of the Lisbon Treaty, which I believe was Cameron’s promise in late 2007?

Well here is the full text, what bit does Farage and you NOT understand of the “no treaty will be ratified” promise, when a basic timeline glance shows was taken out of his hands once Labour/Brown signed the Lisbon Treaty, and all thing EU were then enshrined into British Law BEFORE 2010.

Today, I will give this cast-iron guarantee: If I become PM a Conservative government will hold a referendum on any EU treaty that emerges from these negotiations. No treaty should be ratified without consulting the British people in a referendum.

From 2010, thanks to UKIP, Cameron’s Conservative minority government has shared legislative power with a more pro EU party and it’s leader than Labour, so explain to me HOW Cameron has broken his ‘should we go in or stay out’ 2007 promise, he is reiterating now, only NOW WE ARE IN THE EU, the question becomes a ‘do we stay in, or come out’ question?

You have to enjoy the irony that if the Conservatives hadn’t lost so many votes to UKIP in 2010, the Referendum would have been organised by now. lol

“Support for staying IN the European Union surges to a 23-year high... all thanks to the rise of Ukip”

• 56% say they will vote to stay in, with 36% wanting to leave the EU
• Highest level of support for EU since 1991, according to IpsosMORI poll
• Since 2012 support for Ukip is up 13 points, but for EU backing is up 12
www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2803377/Support-staying-European-Union-surges-23-year-high-thanks-rise-Ukip.html

Farage needs to stop grandstanding, get his stupid gloating face and party out of the way of a 2017 EU Referendum, where THE FULL FACTS will do the talking to 'the people' - who similar to Scotland, have to be trusted to make the right decision.

It appears the longer this issue hangs around, and therefore so does UKIP, if (as I suspect) on balance we are better off out of the EU, the "democracy" Farage, Carswell and the UKIP cult laughingly spouts, in this case, may not give the 'right' result.

Jean Claude Junckers, incoming EU President says rules on freedom of movement cannot be changed.

He said that if the EU were to change the rules of freedom of movement of people it would be open to challenges to freedom of movement of goods or capital too.

Happy negotiating with Junckers then Dave

Tonight's ComRes poll puts UKIP on 43% and Tories on 30%

Wow!
The gap gets bigger by the day, UKIP is on the way, the spinners are going to pay and pray while the people in Rochester make hay.

"Ukip tipped for big win at Rochester by-election

Ukip will land a second voice in Parliament next month according to a new poll that puts the party a commanding 13 points ahead of the Conservatives in the run up to the Rochester and Strood by-election."

www.itv.com/news/update/2014-10-22/ukip-tipped-for-big-win-at-rochester-and-strood-by-election/

Particularly alarming for the Tories is how many voters there intend to use this by-election to kick the government. 62 percent of those polled agree with the statement that, ‘“This by-election is a good opportunity for me to show David Cameron and the Conservative Party how unhappy I am with their government”

blogs.spectator.co.uk/coffeehouse/2014/10/ukip-13-points-ahead-in-rochester-strood/

I imagine there must be absolute panic in metropolitan elite circles. What more can they do? They are visiting 5 times already, any more visits and the people of Rochester may get sick of the sight of them. How many more promises can they come up with? What else have they got left? All the spin they have got just falls on deaf ears? Their think tanks are not working, their insults are not working, their spin is not working, modernisation is a complete turkey, they're out of ideas and if they carry on like this, they'll be out of office.

It's starting to look like it's over.

"Ukip’s surge appears to be due to the eurosceptic party drawing converts from the traditional three main parties, with the poll showing 39% of people who voted Conservative in 2010 were planning to vote Ukip next month, as were 39% of 2010 Lib Dem voters and 30% of 2010 Labour voters.

Farage’s party has also rallied many who failed to turnout at the last election, with a staggering 57% of people who did not vote in 2010 saying they intended to vote Ukip in the by-election."

www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/2014/10/22/ukip-hold-huge-lead-ahead-of-rochester-by-election_n_6030996.html

"If he too wins for Ukip, then the political scene in this country will change completely.

Come the next election, all bets are off."
...
Only 40 minutes away from London on the fast train, but a galaxy away from the metropolitan elite of politicians, whose ignorance of and indifference to the concerns of Middle Britain has played such a part in Ukip's rise."

www.express.co.uk/news/politics/524828/Ukip-Rochester-by-election

They ignored Middle Britain. The metropolitan elite thought they had us all in the bag. They should have listened at the local elections just over 1 year ago. We told them then, but they called us "fruitcakes".

Claig .... of course the Conservatives want to win in Rochester, but it is a by-election and governments rarely win by-elections, even the one that has done the best out of the G7 countries in steering the UK out of the worst recession in 100-years - with the worst budget deficit in Europe (£157 bil in 2010) to fix 'stuff' with.

If people chose to vote for the man that has had, and lied to them, on one main policy for 20-years and will ENSURE we stay in the UK, it has no basis in logic, so there is nothing the main parties can do about it.

Similar to France really, where people vote for the Front National - but as in France, those same people will pay for that decision via their pockets and services, for many years to come - getting far worse shortly when France HAS to cut it's Euro 60 billion ish annual budget deficit, as a price for Germany bailing the EU out.

Clearly UKIP is a 'protest', as they offer nothing else, and if the previous General Elections are not not repeated (where your vote drops to 2-3%) then labour will form the next government and the country won't be able to afford the services we have, never mind improve them.

*What a shame the majority will have to suffer, because Farage with 24 MEP seats that achieve squat all, needs Westminster power.

Claig/WetAugust .... clearly the way way you gush over a man you know has lied on what UKIP can achieve for 20-years, it isn't a political party where policies or a record in government matter, as I've said before, its more of a 'cult' - and they have a long history of screwing with peoples minds.

Of course Ukip won't condemn its racist new partners, because Ukip is the cult of Nigel Farage

“Ukip has allied itself with racists and Holocaust deniers - but as long as that's OK with Nigel Farage, the cult leader, don't expect a peep of condemnation from within the party”
www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/nigel-farage/11179456/Of-course-Ukip-wont-condemn-its-racist-new-partners-because-Ukip-is-the-cult-of-Nigel-Farage.html

“Yesterday Iain Martin posed a very good question. “Will anyone in Ukip condemn Farage's despicable new EU alliance?”, he asked, in response to the news the People’s Army had done a deal with the extremist Polish KNP (New Right) party to secure group status, and a stream of lucrative European Union funding.”

“And this morning we have our answer. No”.

“Nigel Farage is always at pains to explain how his party shuns racism and extremism. It’s a sham, of course, as I’ve written countless times before. And his embrace of the KNP proves it’s a sham”.

“The KNP are racists and Holocaust deniers. In July, KNP leader Janus Korwin-Mikke called for the abolition of the minimum wage in Britain by claiming that “four million n**rs” lost their jobs after John F Kennedy introduced a US national minimum wage in 1961. He also claimed Adolf Hitler “was probably not aware the Jews were being exterminated”.

“The KNP are so extreme that, according to a report from Rajeev Syal in the Guardian, even French BNP leader Marine Le Pen ruled out forming an alliance with them, explaining that Korwin-Mikke’s "remarks, his political views, ran contrary to our values”.

'but it is a by-election and governments rarely win by-elections'

But this is not against Labour, this is against the party of the "fruitcakes" and we are giving them the kind of drubbing that you only read about in history books.

Clacton was the biggest landslide in post war history. This is a complete collapse in the metropolitan modernising facade, it has collapsed like a house of cards and people are rejoicing and voters who have never voted before are joining in to have their say. This is the modernisers' worst nightmare. This is Middle England saying enough is enough.

The modernisers don't understand it because they don't understand us. They ignored us, sneered at us and mocked us, they never thought we would vote for change, they thought we were "fruitcakes".

"If he too wins for Ukip, then the political scene in this country will change completely.
Come the next election, all bets are off."

Who knows what may happen?
There are still months to go and lots of things can go wrong in between. Labour won't win - look at the NHS in Wales. Then look at the Tory disasters.

If it carries on like this, Farage may even make it to Number 10.

When UKIP get in, there'll be no banning smoking in parks, no minimum pricing for alcohol, far fewer spinners on TV and in the House of Commons, no more politically correct Labour type spinners restricting civil liberties and freedoms. Finally the majority, ordinary people will be represented and this Oxbridge clique of modernisers who think ordinary people are "fruitcakes" will lose their influence.

Claig ..... I'd wait with the dumb general Election predictions, UKIP still have to win one Westminster seat with one of their own candidates rather than bribing a Conservative to jump ship for whatever baubles of power UKIP's rich FTSE company owner personally offers them.

Tell me, why do you think with UKIP's 'home bred' candidates, no matter if they get double digit percentages of votes in other elections, in the past 3 General Elections it plummets to 2-3%???

'why do you think with UKIP's 'home bred' candidates, no matter if they get double digit percentages of votes in other elections, in the past 3 General Elections it plummets to 2-3%???'

Because people had not yet had enough of the modernisers then. We still voted for them. We still hoped they might be on our side. But then it all changed. We all swung against the spinners en masse in last year's local council elections. That was the beginning of the end of the metropolitan elite's modernising reign and now things will never be the same.

Now we have all had enough, we know they are not on our side, and that is why UKIP is here to stay and it won't fall to 2-3% any more. The modernisers' game is up because we have all had enough.

Claig

I didn't realise until today that the Tory MEPs are in a grouping with Turkish Islamists. Very hypocritical to arrest UK jihadis joining ISIS via Turkey while members if your Ian party are in cahoots with Islamists.

I didn't realise until today that Labour MEPs were in an affiliation with homophobic MEPs.

Makes me kind of content to hear UKIPs Pole who had to join their grouping say that Hitler should have been executed.

So on Monday Barroso kicked a Dave in the nuts and today Junckers gave him a very vicious Glasgow handshake. Perhaps the poor disillusioned sod will finally get the message. But if he still believes the Uk will be able to control its borders he'll have to wait until the good voters of a Rochester tell him he's on planet Plonk!

I added the Red Cross to my list of proscribed organisations today.

Its time the professionally offended brigade realised that we've had enough of their stupidity. It's starting already with the p audience response to Eagles on QT.

Louise Bours on QT tonight. She should be good

Have a nice day y'all

Labour have got a 35% strategy and the modernisers in the Conservative Party are relying on a 2-3% strategy where UKIP falls back to that. But they are both dreaming, both totally out of touch.

They don't understand the people, they don't realise that they have had enough. Now they are being told to leave the Westminster Bubble and to go and meet some real people and they are shocked to find that they are not modernisers and spinners, like the BBC told them. They are reporting back to HQ that the people are "fruitcakes" and they don't speak their language. They are in panic and Farage is strolling around cleaning up because he talks our language and the people think he is one of us.

In a nutshell Claig, what UKIP has achieved is to empower ordinary people to stand up say "you are talking bollocks" instead of staying quiet as the Leftie PC brigade had schooled them to do.

And that is a good thing

'Its time the professionally offended brigade realised that we've had enough of their stupidity'

Yes, it's backfiring on them. They got away with it for years because they control the airwaves and the BBC could preach the message, but now the people are immune to it. Times have changed, the game has changed.

No one told Chuka and he is still spinning the same old line thinking it might fool us

"Chuka Umunna on Ukip: vile, abhorrent and un-British"

www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/ukip/11178984/Chuka-Umunna-on-Ukip-vile-abhorrent-and-un-British.html

This will just lose Labour a ton of votes because people will think they are not on our side, because the people like Farage. He has the highest popularity rating of any politician, and we don't think he is vile, abhorrent and un-British.

Claig .... you don't get 'modernizers' as Carswell calls himself, in an international financial/economic recession, a government has to get the basics right - although like WetAugust, as an armchair anarchist, you are not looking for what is being done right with a honking great budget deficit, you have to follow a cult figure thats promises 'change' but offers no solutions or anything different, other than a UKIP demagogues lust for power.

*How does Farages leadership poll look, compared to all the others, could you please show all the latest finding you have - as if he is not seen as PM material, one has to assume that it is his immigration scare tactics, where he gets the BNP vote as well - not that Farage 'the statesman' minds.

Isitmebut, don't you realise that these Oxford PPEs don't decide all their policies by themselves. They have advisers, modernising think thanks and civil servants. Probably about half of the MPs aren't qualified for their roles but it doesn't matter too much because they get advice. They are not magicians, in fact some of them are modernising "fruitcakes", but they get advice which is the same as any other party would get.

But what really counts is principles and leadership, and that is what Farage has got and what the modernisers don't have. Because they are just spinners and have no convictions. They are the opposite of Thatcher.

Farage and UKIP will set policy - leave the EU, stop wasting our money, scrap the Climate Change Act, slash the foreign aid budget by billions, scrap the billion pound HS2, cut green taxes, restore freedoms, restore sovereignty, restore democracy, introduce PR and local referenda, exempt the NHS from TTIP, bin any plans to ban smoking in parks, bin any plans to introduce minimum alcohol pricing, end the spin culture, end politically correct tyranny that hinders free speech etc etc

Then the civil servants will come up with ways to do those things and the people will rejoice.

Claig ...you can't support a party that has lied for 20-years about getting the UK out of the EU and rubbish your own General Election manifesto a year AFTER you have the votes, and keep calling the other party 'spinners' as you sound rather stupid - and if Farage needs to get women on-side, you really do him no favours.

Re your rants to my 2-3% UKIP vote question, if Farage/Wheeler were so confident in 2015 being any different, why did they have to buy some sitting Conservative MPs?