Tory MP Mark Reckless defects to UKIP

[claig]

Panic in elite circles

Farage promising a positive campaign in Rochester, is conducting a similar ‘blitzkrieg’ as Clacton; behind one front, feigning a veneer of political respectability behind a sitting (ex) Conservative MP, but then opens a second National Front, with scare stories of immigration the current Conservative led government (thanks to him) can do little about this parliament – or UKIP as a Westminster party, could do in another 10-years at least.
www.express.co.uk/news/uk/524125/EXCLUSIVE-One-million-MORE-migrants-will-flood-Britain-before-EU-vote-warns-Farage

Reading the above article, he has a serious point that a UK within the ‘free movement’ of the EU, the UK with an economy growing much faster, is likely to see an increased rate of immigration, but plucks 1 million out of the air, but by insinuating our population will increase by 1 million, in disingenuous at best.

The ‘free flow’ of citizens goes TWO WAYS, and our citizens EMIGRATING will be a large factor in our NET immigration figures and not even Mr Farage could dispute that an economically weak Europe, with their home prices falling, ours rising, and more ‘baby boomers’ retiring – there should be significant UK citizen outflows, than seen in the past. For sure, our emigrations ebbs and flows, and those having left the UK coming back home e.g. for financial reasons, are counted in as ‘immigrants’.

So plucked immigration figures like 1 million from a party leader, KNOWING it is a main worry of many voters, is neither responsible, or POSITIVE campaigning, from a UKIP that appears to think ‘MP Recall’ is more important to its voters once getting its feet under a seat in Westminster.

Farage’s quotes on Cameron’s policies/focus on immigration is both inaccurate and highly misleading for his own political gain, especially as UKIP votes in 2010 ensured a minority Conservative government COULD NOT legislate for a referendum to-date. So one has to wonder what a Farage who’s only key policies are immigration and MP Recall when there are so many more issues, can bring to a Party Leadership Debate before the next General Election.

The UK has never felt the need to give the main anti immigration issue BNP a prominent national platform, so why give a Farage ranting mistruths on issues UKIP can do nothing about, within a Party Leadership Debate, needing to discuss the OTHER serious issues in ‘the peoples’ Top 10 of concerns UKIP have no serious policies on - when whoever forms the 2015 parliament/policies, will affect our lives for many years to come.

Oh dear, Mr Reckless clearly hasn't completed the UKIP dumbing down assimilation lessons, and Mr Farage is finding out the hard way that if you want to buy sitting MPs who just sit there and do what they are told by their leadership no matter what they do – he should have raided the parliamentary Labour Party.

”Mark Reckless refuses to back scrapping HS2 in first public split with Ukip leader Nigel Farage”

“Former Tory MP tells The Telegraph he stands by previous HS2 support despite Ukip officially opposing plan and Mr Farage calling it 'undesirable, unwanted and unloved'

www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/ukip/11170215/Mark-Reckless-refuses-to-back-scrapping-HS2-in-first-public-split-with-Ukip-leader-Nigel-Farage.html

After all on this subject Labour and UKIP have much in common; Labour caused a north to south economic train crash, while UKIP wouldn’t want the train line built in the first place, never mind fixed.

With UKIP Carswell getting 100% behind (clean) air head Conservative Zac Goldsmiths Reacall policy and talking about nothing else, and a UKIP Reckless would vote with the Conservatives on HS2 – one really has to ask, WHAT IS THE POINT OF UKIP in Westminster, when so much is at stake in 2015?

Oh dear Mr Barrisso so has just said that DAve will not get EU agreement to control inflation

Thank you WetAugust ... 'here is a part of one I was preparing earlier', for another thread.

If Mr Farage was ‘a man of the people’ WHY is he thanking the outgoing EU Commissioner, membership enforcer and project dinosaur Mr Barroso, for stating today the obvious that curbing EU immigration and ‘free movement’ is illegal – unless of course, living in Gibraltar, wanting to enter ‘freely’ into and out of Spain.
www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-29680059
”The UK would have "zero" influence if it voted to leave the EU, the outgoing president of the European Commission has said”. Spoken like the Captain on the EU Titanic, offering ‘influence’ on arranging the deckchairs.”^

The reason is that Mr Farage, as selfishly stated, is that what is BAD for the UK, is GOOD for (a far right party like) UKIP, knowing full well that similar to 24 Brussels MEP seats obtained in the same way, voters will erroneously believe that UKIP can influence both the UK’s exit from the EU and/or curb immigration, which is disingenuous at best.

If the leader of the United Kingdom Independence Party seriously wanted what was right for Britain via EU ‘change’, he would not be gloating at Cameron how tough it will be to renegotiate the UKs reforms of the EU - whilst sitting there salivating, speculating how many Westminster seats he might get from our pain – he would be ensuring that the UK had the OPTION FOR EU INDEPENDENCE, by getting not splitting the Conservative vote, so Cameron with an election Referendum mandate from ‘the people’, can hold it in 2017 (or before if getting EU nowhere).

But Farage has said that he doesn't believe a word that Cameron says.

And if the polls are anything to go by, then it seems that the people are with Farage and the word is UKIP.

He is thanking Barroso for exposing the fact that it is the DU, and not our elected Governement, who decides who lives in our country.

He is thanking Barroso because Cameron will no longer be able to lie that he will achieve immigration controls. Cameron has been told that immigration controls would be illegal.

He is thanking Barroso for making quite clear who actually rules this country, and it's the DU, not the Tories. Govt that cannot make its own laws as to who does and who does not live in their country may be in Government, but is certainly not in control.

So now we can stop the pretence that Dave will be able to negotiate any significant changes to put to the people in his planned 2017 referendum.

So if you have obtained no significant change then a referendum is pointless.

So Cameron might as well decide whether to stay in or get out now.

Sorry. For DU please read. EU.

WetAugust ….. for the umpteenth time, HOW CAN Cameron decide “to get out now” if thanks to UKIP voters in 2010, Cameron’s Conservatives does NOT have a parliamentary majority to get a government policy past their Lib Dem coalition partners and Labour. Although I do understand a private members Bill is going through the motions, trying to arrange the Referendum in this parliament, for the next.

www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/ukip/7693877/General-Election-2010-Ukip-challenge-cost-Tories-a-Commons-majority.html
“Analysis of (the 2010) results shows that in at least 21 key marginal seats, Ukip’s share of the vote proved enough to allow Labour or the Lib Dems to see off strong Tory challenges.”

Re Barroso, all Farage is doing is gloating at the OUTGOING repeat OUTGOING Commissioner stating the current EU rules for cheap UKIP votes, pretending now that if ‘the people’ gave Farage 5,10,15 Westminster seats, ON TOP of the 24 MEPs Farage got under similar false pretences,_ somehow Farage could magic our exit from the EU and cut immigration.

Re Cameron’s immigration and other reforms within a very economically sick EU, who talks about ‘growth’ in both the old and new members, but don’t have a clue how to achieve it in its current structure - you don’t think he has any support from the leaders of the core Western European nations for solutions?

We shall see if he gets his reforms, but if NOT, we have to have the option to leave via an IN/OUT Referendum, which UKIP/Farage more interested in Westminster power than the United Kingdom Independence Party primary purpose, will selfishly ensure the UK does not get.

P.S. Regarding your following quote “So if you have obtained no significant change then a referendum is pointless” – d’uh, I can honestly say I’ve never read a more head-up-bottom political statement in my life. lol

Claig …. “But Farage has said that he doesn't believe a word that Cameron says”

But that is from an ex City commodity trader that has pretended for 20-years that UKIP can bring the UK out of the EU and control immigration, has 24 Brussels MEPs (including himself) that has financially benefiting from that scam with £78k salaries and £3,500 expenses paid into their bank every month whether claimed or not – so I’d suggest that you and those voters previously ‘protesting’, that they are still being misled, now for Farage to get to Westminster, having failed several times over the years.

Cameron gave Scotland a Referendum, and as we’ve gone over a thousand times while you and others think Farage power is more important than this country, as while the non accountable, bureaucratic structure of the current EU might suit Labour, it’s against everything the Conservatives have stood against for at least 30-years.

Claig...as someone posting thousands of post supporting Farage and his anti EU/immigration quest for Westminster seats, could you please explain precisely how if Farage gets Westminster seats at the detriment of Conservative seats, how UKIP will force a parliamentary Labour Party to leave the EU?

Farage may hold the balance of power and if Labour get in, which I doubt they will, Farage could hold their feet to the fire and make a referendum a condition of the support of the People's Army.

But, even if Labour do get in, then that will spell the end of the Conservatives and the emergence of UKIP as the only viable opposition to Labour for the future. Labour will then have a few years to make merry but will be restricted since they will not have a large majority, and after that UKIP will win the next election.

So either way, it is a good result for the future. UKIP is the beginning of real change where PR will come in and the people will be properly represented.

Claig .. I got as far as "Farage may hold the balance of power...." when I kinda turned off as very highly unlikely when in 2015 Labour could count on the Lib Dems, SDP and others, with a similar ideology, to form a coalition within.

As for a 5,10,15 seat UKIP 'spelling the end of the Conservatives', when UKIP, with no domestic policies that stick longer than a year, would have ensured the UK stayed within the EU - would be competing with a Conservative Party that dragged the UK back from the economic precipice in 1979 and 2010, and hands over much healthier economies to Labour - I very much doubt it, as voters wouldn't trust Farage to run bathwater, never mind the UK.

So far, and you use the UKIP mantra 'change' again, the only thing UKIP wants to do is via Recall, obtain seats by misinformation, in between General Elections, to suit Farage's agenda of MORE POWER, with no innovative solutions over and above what is being done, what to do with it.

If the UK's future is after every Labour economic train crash the UK has to rely on UKIP to put the country back on it's feet, best we REMAIN in the EU with all the other clueless countries looking for growth.

You may be old enough to remember a GE that was held on the basis of 'Who runs this country, the Govt or the Unions.'

All Cameron needs to dos is to call an eel cation now on the question of 'Who runs this country, the Govt or the EU.'

he could do that tomorrow. he would not need Lib support to do that.

But he might get the wrong answer, as Heath did,

Bug if he really does believe that the UK cannot live with the existing EU open borders mandate then he should have the courage to seek the mandate of the UK electorate to tell the EU that it's make or break time.

Aye whole unsavoury spectacle of an unelected failed politician from a failed PIIGS state dictating what we can and can't do in our own country, while we meekly hand over millions of pounds a day to perpetuate this craven stupidity makes me want to puke.

Cameron is like a man on a visit to a dominatrix paying to be thoroughly abused. It's disgusting to watch.

-Nd what fucking planet is Barrodo on when he says without the EU we would have no influence.

Wrong Wrong Wrong.

The EU is a leech on the successful member statues, it gains it's so called power through the success of its member nations and the respect those member nations have in the world. Nobody respects the EU

Barroso ought to remember that we are a per memento member of the UN Security Council, we are a founder member of NATO, we are a G7 economy...........

Meanwhile there are hundreds of thousands protesting over the weekend in the streets if Milan against the DU. Did the Beeb give this any coverage? thought not.

Cameron is playing a stupid game because the depth of feeling against the EU in this country cannot be contained forever. Like any pressure cooker, it will eventually blow and we are already reaching boiling point.

Barroso was the one who managed to get a second referendum in Dublin, when the first one gave the ‘wrong’ answer, NO - and like many other EU dinosaurs he will keep trying to sell the original concept in soundbites, totally ignoring the facts/consequences of enlarging the EU way beyond the economically mature economies, where citizens of those accession States, mainly see their personal growth OUTSIDE their country of birth.

Farage is the one playing both a stupid and dangerous game, as despite UKIPs ‘Independence’ title, voting UKIP on EU/Immigration issues, will get the UK no further to SOLVING the issue as if voting for the BNP, Greens or Girl Guide Movement – whilst STOPPING the one main party that will.

Miliband/Labour tends to keep quiet on the issue and hope it goes away.

Clegg/Lib Dems has borrowed a copy of the Barroso book of EU soundbites on permanent loan, that includes the dangers of leaving e.g. we will lose 3 million jobs, yet to be qualified in great detail, how.

Cameron in wanting a Referendum, where before hand ‘the people’ have the opportunity to weigh up all the pros and cons from both sides, is far from being “stupid”, it is both good governance and DEMOCRATIC, something UKIP’s Carswell keeps lecturing about as the ‘change’ we need, in Westminster.

This is why only a majority Conservative government, not needing pro EU LIb Dem or Labour parliamentary support to legislate for a Referendum that if votes 'OUT', can bring us out, is the ONLY COMMON SENSE APPROACH.

So voting for Farage is only FOR Farage, and certainly not the means to decide a ‘positive’ future direction of this country, whether in the EU (with or without prior reforms), or out.

Isitmebut

You think a referendum is democratic

But it's not at all democratic if the Govt uses that referendum to lie and scare the voters into voting the way theGovt wants.

Like they did during the Scottish referendum when they called all their business chums in and got them to say they would leave Scotland if there was a YES vote. Even the HBOS royal Bank of Scotland FFS.

No, a referendum is only democratic if it is FREE and FAIR. Cameron doesn't have those words in his vocabulary.

Everybody needs to face up to the fact that WE WILL NEVER BE PERMITTED TO LEAVE THE EU,

Once you understand that then UKIP becomes a form of legalised and benign civil disobedience.

WetAugust …. Nice try on ‘what is the point of UKIP’, but surely if we wanted “civil disobedience” in parliament, we’d invite in the more civil Greens, not the reprobates currently representing Westminster constituency levels, that Mr Wheeler/Farage obviously doesn’t feel have the ‘quality to succeed, hence raiding sitting Conservatives MPs to get their sized 12s in that Westminster door.

Re Scotland and Cameron’s democratic offer of an IN/OUT Referendum that despite a Mr Salmond and all his henchmen (and women lol) scaring the bejezus out of many citizens frightened to admit they’ll vote to stay IN - the referendum results reflected THE FACTS, not the heart – and if those owning/running companies fearing an SNP backlash before hand, FINALLY spoke up with their fears/intensions, then so be it.

Too many issues determining the economic viability of an Independent Scotland, in the early years at least, were left up in the air i.e. currency, interest rates and national borrowing/debt, when even I with an ounce of financial nous could put down on paper here the facts of why Scotland could NOT retain what previously used.

Re the EU, the ‘freedom of movement’ (like a good fitting bra) is a key temperament issue that is not working for many within the EU as many members are entering a triple dip recession, it must be negotiable, even if on a temporary basis (say, a few years) – BUT THIS COUNTRY STILL NEEDS THE IN/OUT DEBATE AND REFERENDUM other countries had before they signed that ‘kin Lisbon Treaty.

The pros and cons need to be FACTUALLY explained, rather than rely on hugely exaggerated claims, i.e. leaving the EU we’ll lose 3 million jobs and in Scotland ‘we are one of the richest nations on earth’.

The EU as is, WILL DRAG US ECONOMICALLY & SOCIALLY DOWN WITH IT, as you can have the best socialist principles in the world, right up to the money runs out, so we have to know WHY we should stay IN, and THEN ‘the people’ vote on it – as trusted in Scotland.

You are right in saying the EU will eventually drag us down

where I disagree is that unlike you, I don't believe any in out referendum would be fair. And a referendum that is not fair must not be held up as the democratic decision of the people.

"Mr Farage called on his supporters to get Ukip Calypso to the number one slot in the singles charts."

www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/nigel-farage/11174130/Get-Ukip-Calypso-with-its-dodgy-faux-Jamaican-accent-to-No-1-says-Nigel-Farage.html

There is no stopping UKIP because it is the People's Revolution. All of the spinners ignored us and lectured us about the polar bear, minimum pricing for alcohol, smoking in parks, smoking in cars , smoking in bars etc etc and now we have all had enough.

What can the Tories come up with - the Conservative Rap? It will just be more Conservative Crap.

Um nice song- let them all come in... Who the fuck is them

Them are the citizens of our fellow EU member states who now have an unalienable right to come to live in the UK and there is nothing that Dave can so to stop them doing so - despite what Dave tries to tell us.

BBC Newsnight will be reporting on the UKIP Calypso.

They will probably try their usual game but it will backfire on the metropolitan elite.

and the Latest News

UKIP Calypso is now #1 in the itunes download chart

A very nice Ex Labour councillor joined UKIP yesterday

UKIP have reformed their European Parliament grouping that the EU bully Schulz tried to destroy, so UKIP can once again alleviate itself of EU handouts, just like all the other parties, all funded net contributors to this farcical experiment i.e. The UK taxpayer for one.

So quit,e a good day for UKIP

Meanwhile back in DrearyDaveLand Cameron's nose just grew another foot as he said he would control our borders despite being told by Barroso, plus loads of EU Commissioners, plus the Cambridge Professor of EU Law on Radio 5 that free movement of people is a key tenet of the EU that none of the members stars will ever agree to UK opting out off. So no one believes Dave anymore.

So welcome to unlimited immigration into the UK from any member state. Which kind of changes the U,a whole perspective towar the EU as we've always tried to widen EU membership in order to dilute the depth of political union. Well not any more we won't as we will have to admit any citizen of any future EU member. And Dave already thinks Turkey should join.

Even the Spectator is saying the Tories new slogan is UKIP ARE RIGHT - JUST DONT VOTE FOR THEM

People are starting to wake up and realise what the future will look like in this country and they don't like it.

This has been one of the most exciting periods in UK politics. Almost as interesting as the Winter of Discontent or the 3 Day week or the wranglings over the Maastricht Treaty.

It's a perfect storm

Labour is fielding an unelectable candidate that Labour itself doesn't like but are stuck with.

Scotland are feeling very sore about Labours broken promises.

the Tories are stuck with Trust Me Dave who thinks he can walk on water and clear giant basil dings in a single bound - and regularly falls flat on his face as even his own MPs don't believe him anymore.

The Libs are just irrelevant

People are starting to see just how controlled the UK is by the EU and, as a result, UKIP now has 40,000 members and won the European elections.

A really nice mix of ingredients for a stoning election

UKIP Calypso is #1 on Amazon mp3 downloads. Ahead of all the pop stars.